Why are Iraqi insurgents attacking?

[Least_Original_User_Name_Ever]

@Cardinal

I would like to ask for an explanation from the conspiracy believers. I’m really asking, so if please for once avoid the screaming that so often goes on in this forum (which is why I hardly ever come here. I hardly learn anything in the time I can put forth to wading through the nonsense and screaming).

What is the rational, elucidated explanation for your beliefs about Bush’s motivations regarding Iraq? I so often see statements about “It was for the oil”, but I never see a citation, and it doesn’t make sense to me. Even the explanation above doesn’t make sense to me, as it needs venal actions on the parts of so many people with so many different political backgrounds.

How could this idea of getting better profits for oil companies benefit Bush so much? His numbers are in the toilet, and he has to know that war is NOT good for the economy, no matter how many facile people say otherwise. War spends money on things that we’d rather not have to do, and wastes time and effort, too. Bush will be rich enough after 2008, I can’t understand how he’s supposed to have sold out his historical legacy for even more money.

Anyway, I’m willing to listen. Just please try to be clear and answer responses calmly.

T o get an idea of what the point is,read in Winkipedia about Bremers 100 orders. If you can justify what he did please pass the info to the Iraqis. They have to live with them.

[BrainGlutton]

@Squink

Today’s Weather in Baghdad

The links on that page are frickin’ hilarious!

Meet Locals – read their Hotel Tips and Travel Guides for Baghdad

[Squink]

@Cardinal

Sorry, I meant, “Please provide a cite for the following:” It’s not famous enough that I’ve heard of it.

The Al Qaqaa Weapons Cache incident, where the US let 380 tons of HMX, RDX and PETN slip through its fingers is the most publicized incident. The plunder of radioactive barrels from Tuwaitha is another.

[Henry-Finland]

@Cardinal

Sorry, I meant, “Please provide a cite for the following:” It’s not famous enough that I’ve heard of it.

I do not know about WMDs, but this the US army left without guards.

In addition to his involvement in assassination plans, officials said Abu al Abbas provided a host of support to insurgents, from explosive devices, to coordinating suicide bombers, to helping foreign fighters get into Iraq to orchestrating the several bombing operations in recent weeks, to include the Abu Ghraib attack April 2 and the car-bomb attacks on April 29.

He confessed to stealing 300 to 400 rockets and more than 720 cases of plastic explosives from a weapons facility in Yussifiyah in early 2003.

He claimed he buried some of the stolen weapons and explosives material at his farm in Yussifiyah and stored the remaining stolen weapons and explosives at two other underground sites located near his farm.

Abu al Abbas claimed the stockpile located at his farm was exhausted for use as road and car bombs while coalition forces found and destroyed the remaining weapons and explosive material buried at the two outlying storage sites.

The captured al-Zarqawi associate admitted to providing explosive devices to Umar al-Kurdi, the notorious bomber responsible for preparing and detonating over 75 percent of all vehicle bombs in Baghdad prior to his capture Jan. 15. Abu al Abbas gave Abu Umar access to his stockpile of explosives during a one-month period spanning from December 2004 to January 2005.

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/library/news/2005/05/mil-050508-afps02.htm
Maybe this gives a picture:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2003_invasion_of_Iraq

Looting took place in the days following. It was reported that the National Museum of Iraq was among the looted sites. The assertion that US forces did not guard the museum because they were guarding the Ministry of Oil and Ministry of Interior is apparently true.[citation needed]
According to U.S. officials the “reality of the situation on the ground” was that hospitals, water plants, and ministries with vital intelligence needed security more than other sites.
There were only enough US troops on the ground to guard a certain number of the many sites that ideally needed protection, and so, apparently, some “hard choices” were made. Also, it was reported that many trucks of purported Iraqi gold and $1.6 billion of bricks of US cash were seized by US forces.

<snip>
More serious for the post-war state of Iraq was the looting of cached weaponry and ordnance which fueled the subsequent insurgency. As many as 250,000 tons of explosives were unaccounted for by October 2004. [48] Disputes within the US Defense Department led to delays in the post-invasion assessment and protection of Iraqi nuclear facilities. Tuwaitha, the Iraqi site most scrutinized by UN inspectors since 1991, was left unguarded and may have been looted. [49]

The US generals, their plan, included more troops, some 300 - 450.000, but ‘the ultimate war genius, the sun in the storm’, the flight instructor Rumsfeld, ordered cuts of the troops and kicked the generals that had made/were responsible for the original military plan. The officer in Pentagon that was responsible of planning the peace-efforts after the war, was never asked anything, just forgotten according to the book written by Bernstein. [Remember that the text in the book was approved by the White House. See the last pages].

The greatest military victory that US has ever had, maybe the greatest in history, was ruined by too few troops and thus USA could never win peace, just the war.
Henry

[Bosda_Di_Chi_of_Tricor]

@Measure for Measure

That is one heck of a post.

If true, the US would be one of the first burglars in the history of the world to leave the house he broke into with less than he entered with.

According to this site (which has an axe to grind) the Iraq War has cost the US $287 billion and counting.

The war has reduced energy security: Iraq exports less oil than it used.

---

“…defile the Holy places of Mecca and Medina”. - Huh? How? Are you saying that nonbelievers should be prohibited from setting foot within 200 miles of the Holy City? That seems immoderate. Maybe you’re saying something else.

…the crusaders and their apostate (see Shia) lackeys."
Ok, but you understand that only most Americans probably were unaware of the Shia/Sunni split prior to the latest Iraq war, right? You also know that “Crusader” connotes “Pre-1400 Christian invader” as well, right?

In the past the US has been happy to bankroll despots that keep the oil flowing. The idea that the US has religious motivations in this conflict that are in any way decisive is a little silly though. We are far too self-absorbed for that.

Your thoughts are welcome on this board though: I don’t think we have enough Islamic participation.

Measure–I thijnk he was trying to post from an Insurgent POV, not that he actually espouces those views.

[Henry-Finland]

@Least Original User Name Ever

T o get an idea of what the point is,read in Winkipedia about Bremers 100 orders. If you can justify what he did please pass the info to the Iraqis. They have to live with them.

The link:

Paul Bremer

Progress of the reconstruction of Iraq’s infrastructure One of the CPA’s most important tasks was the reconstruction of Iraq’s infrastructure. While Iraq’s oil infrastructure was rapidly repaired – with the notable exception of the meters – the progress of the reconstruction of Iraq’s potable water, sewage and electricity systems was disappointingly slow.

Defenders argued that this was due to the unanticipated volume and fierceness of those resisting the Coalition’s occupation. Critics argued that the manner in which Bremer and his aides, awarded reconstruction contracts played a big role. Most contracts were awarded to well connected US firms.

Only 2% of the reconstruction contracts in 2003 were awarded to Iraqi firms. Those who are more critical of the American’s efforts to fix Iraq believe the Bush administration’s issued certain Orders to maintain varying degrees of economic and political control even after sovereignty has been established in Iraq.

Those who are more suspicious believe there were 100 Orders enacted by Bremer before his departure. These alleged orders are listed as follows

Order #39 allows for the following: privatization of Iraqs 200 state-owned enterprises; 100% foreign ownership of Iraqi businesses; national treatment of foreign firms; unrestricted, tax-free remittance of all profits and other funds; and 40-year ownership licenses.

Order #40 turns the banking sector from a state-run to a market-driven system overnight by allowing foreign banks to enter the Iraqi market and to purchase up to 50% of Iraqi banks.

Order #49 drops the tax rate on corporations from a high of 40% to a flat rate of 15%. The income tax rate is also capped at 15%.

Order #12 enacted on June 7, 2003 and renewed on February 24, 2004, suspended all tariffs, customs duties, import taxes, licensing fees and similar surcharges for goods entering or leaving Iraq, and all other trade restrictions that may apply to such goods.

Order #17 grants foreign contractors, including private security firms, full immunity from Iraq s laws.

Order # 81 prohibits Iraqi farmers from using the methods of agriculture that they have used for centuries. The common worldwide practice of saving heirloom seeds from one year to the next is now illegal in Iraq.

One interpretation of international law is that Bremer’s orders are illegal as they fundamentally alter Iraq’s existing laws. This as transformation of an occupied country’s laws violates the Hague regulations of 1907 (the companion to the 1949 Geneva conventions, both ratified by the United States), and the U.S. Army’s Law of Land Warfare.

Henry

[Gary_Robson]

I really do like the SDMB, but I am increasingly frustrated by the overgeneralization.

@Der Trihs

And as far as the Red Staters seeking vengeance, forget it. Those people are mindless right wing cattle; he can treat them any way he wants, and they’ll blame it all on the liberals.

So in Ohio (a “red state” that went 51% Bush in the last election), the 2,659,664 people who voted for Kerry are “mindless right wing cattle?” In Montana (a “red state” that went 59% Bush), the people who elected a Democrat-controlled state legislature and selected Democrats as governor and one of our senators are “mindless right wing cattle?” Since you live in a “blue state,” should I infer that you have no Republicans as neighbors?

@Kimstu

But I doubt they’re representative of all red-staters, and if you continue to claim otherwise then I’d like to see a cite.

How could anybody possibly be representative of all red-staters? The whole “red state/blue state” concept is a gross and meaningless oversimplification and overgeneralization, and people who use either term in an argument are basically grasping at straws.

@Der Trihs

As opposed to the people who think America is “The Greatest Country in the World !”

Okay, this confuses me. If you’re capable of living wherever you want, why wouldn’t you choose the country you consider the greatest country in the world? Why is it a bad thing to live in the country you like the best?

@RedFury

But hey! You’re “winning” anyway!

I am? Cool! I didn’t even know I was fighting. Or are you actually naive enough to think all Americans are personally involved in the war and support it fully?