# Why are Libertarians more Manly? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [October 18, 2013, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-libertarians-more-manly/671604 "2013-10-18T20:38:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![IceQube](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/dfb087/32.png) [@IceQube](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IceQube)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-libertarians-more-manly/671604/81 "2013-10-19T19:48:35Z")
> [@Larry\_Borgia](#): > > Wut? Clinton was a touchy-feely-emotional liberal and if we didn’t have him in office and a calculating and rational libertarian instead we wouldn’t have witnessed the whole Lewinsky affair. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-libertarians-more-manly/671604/82 "2013-10-19T19:49:41Z")
> [@IceQube](#): > > Somalia is actually getting by. Somalia has cell phone coverage (very inexpensive) and corporations are stepping in to fill traditional government functions. And look at all those Somalis who are becoming pirates. Which, as everyone knows, is the manliest profession. Well, Grace O’Malley, Anne Bonny, Mary Read, Ching Shih, the Dragon Lady, the Surprisingly Curvaceous Pirate, and Johnny Depp aside. ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Borgia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/larry_borgia/32/156_2.png) [@Larry\_Borgia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Borgia)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-libertarians-more-manly/671604/83 "2013-10-19T19:51:03Z")
> [@IceQube](#): > > Clinton was a touchy-feely-emotional liberal and if we didn’t have him in office and a calculating and rational libertarian instead we wouldn’t have witnessed the whole Lewinsky affair. Yeahhh…I’m just going to talk to someone else now. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-libertarians-more-manly/671604/84 "2013-10-19T19:51:56Z")
> [@IceQube](#): > > Well Bubbha “feel[s] your pain” … I think that statement exemplifies emotion over reason. Are you suggesting that merely admitting to the existence of emotions is irrational? Because I’m not sure how else to interpret this. ---
**Author:** ![LC\_Strawhouse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e19adc/32.png) [@LC\_Strawhouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LC_Strawhouse)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-libertarians-more-manly/671604/85 "2013-10-19T19:55:00Z")
> [@IceQube](#): > > Clinton was a touchy-feely-emotional liberal and if we didn’t have him in office and a calculating and rational libertarian instead we wouldn’t have witnessed the whole Lewinsky affair. Good point. If only we’d had instead a small-government crusader like Mark Sanford in office… ---
**Author:** ![IceQube](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/dfb087/32.png) [@IceQube](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IceQube)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-libertarians-more-manly/671604/86 "2013-10-19T19:58:44Z")
> [@LC\_Strawhouse](#): > > Good point. If only we’d had instead a small-government crusader like Mark Sanford in office… He’s not libertarian. He’s conservative. ---
**Author:** ![Karrius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/71c47a/32.png) [@Karrius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Karrius)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-libertarians-more-manly/671604/87 "2013-10-19T20:01:15Z")
> [@IceQube](#): > > He’s not libertarian. He’s conservative. IceQube, is there any reason you’re avoiding my question? Is running away from a simple question being asked of you a “manly, logical” thing to do? Or is cowering from a couple of words an emotional response? ---
**Author:** ![LC\_Strawhouse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e19adc/32.png) [@LC\_Strawhouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LC_Strawhouse)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 8:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-libertarians-more-manly/671604/88 "2013-10-19T20:09:31Z")
> [@IceQube](#): > > He’s not libertarian. He’s conservative. According to Wikipedia, “The libertarian Cato Institute ranked Sanford as the best governor in America in their 2010 fiscal policy report card”. ---
**Author:** ![IceQube](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/dfb087/32.png) [@IceQube](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IceQube)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-libertarians-more-manly/671604/89 "2013-10-19T20:41:24Z")
Also he had an affair with a foreigner. That doesn’t quite fall under the category of rational given he had a wife. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-libertarians-more-manly/671604/90 "2013-10-19T20:59:33Z")
> [@IceQube](#): > > Also he had an affair with a foreigner. That doesn’t quite fall under the category of rational given he had a wife. That is nice, but we are not discussing Vulcans, the reality is that most of the examples pointed as being representatives of libertarianism are human after all. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Hamster\_King](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8edcca/32.png) [@The\_Hamster\_King](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Hamster_King)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-libertarians-more-manly/671604/91 "2013-10-19T21:10:35Z")
> [@IceQube](#): > > Liberal policies don’t lubricate the machinery of freedom as well as libertarianism. I don’t know why I’m bothering but still: Libertarianism isn’t about freedom. It’s about property rights. Libertarians are perfectly fine with the most grotesque perversions of freedom so long as property rights are preserved. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 9:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-libertarians-more-manly/671604/92 "2013-10-19T21:15:26Z")
> [@IceQube](#): > > Also he had an affair with a foreigner. That doesn’t quite fall under the category of rational given he had a wife. Would it have been more rational if the affair were with an American? ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-libertarians-more-manly/671604/93 "2013-10-19T21:28:49Z")
> [@IceQube](#): > > Clinton was a touchy-feely-emotional liberal and if we didn’t have him in office and a calculating and rational libertarian instead we wouldn’t have witnessed the whole Lewinsky affair. Yes, if we had had a libertarian president in office, he wouldn’t have been having affairs with women. He’d have had no interest in that feminine womanly stuff. He would have been doing manly he-man masculine things like reading body-builder magazines and watching gladiator movies and dressing up in leather and making the Marine guards feel uncomfortable with all those surprise locker room visits. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-libertarians-more-manly/671604/94 "2013-10-19T22:03:44Z")
> [@IceQube](#): > > Peripheral question: libertarians generally believe in the good of human nature while liberals believe in the vices of humans. If liberals believe humans to be flawed how can a flawed liberal lead a country? So who’s the libertarian archetype? Who is the example of the manly, non-gross-outable manly man that should be leading the country? Ron Paul? 😕 ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-libertarians-more-manly/671604/95 "2013-10-19T22:14:54Z")
> [@IceQube](#): > > Liberal policies don’t lubricate the machinery of freedom as well as libertarianism. Libertarianism is strongly anti-freedom; it is anti-government, not pro-freedom and government is vital to freedom. It simply redefines non-government examples of oppression as not counting, and calls the result “freedom”. It’s basically neo-feudalism; a weak “king” in the form of the government, and a society of powerless serfs ruled over by “lords” in the form of corporations, the wealthy, religious organizations, and other non-government organization. And that’s assuming it holds together and doesn’t collapse into outright warlordism. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-libertarians-more-manly/671604/96 "2013-10-19T22:31:19Z")
> [@bobot](#): > > So who’s the libertarian archetype? Who is the example of the manly, non-gross-outable manly man that should be leading the country? > Ron Paul? > 😕 Have you never seen a picture of Milton Friedman shirtless? ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-libertarians-more-manly/671604/97 "2013-10-19T22:38:12Z")
Is that a threat? ---
**Author:** ![LC\_Strawhouse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e19adc/32.png) [@LC\_Strawhouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LC_Strawhouse)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-libertarians-more-manly/671604/98 "2013-10-19T22:39:11Z")
Paul Ryan was held up as an example of a true libertarian, but ran a [much slower marathon time](http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/politics/2012/09/paul_ryan_marathon_which_politician_had_the_fastest_marathon_time_a_slate_interactive_.html) than Harry Reid, Max Baucus and John Edwards. Does this refute the “manly libertarian” hypothesis or does it mean that Edwards and Reid are secret libertarians? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-libertarians-more-manly/671604/99 "2013-10-19T22:41:31Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Is that a threat? I hear he’s going to be played by Hugh Jackman in the movie _Uncle Milty Goes to Washington_. ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2013, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-libertarians-more-manly/671604/100 "2013-10-19T22:44:31Z")
I’m gonna go ahead and call this thread a wash. The OP has shown no intent to debate the points, has done nothing to address any questions of objections lodged, and instead has opted for, well… > [@IceQube](#): > > Liberal policies don’t lubricate the machinery of freedom as well as libertarianism. …We done here? IceQube, you’d do well to look up FDR’s four freedoms. In particular the third; libertarianism fails _massively_. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-libertarians-more-manly/671604.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-libertarians-more-manly/671604.md?page=6)