# Why are Republicans generally more patriotic than Democrats? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [July 19, 2017, 5:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-republicans-generally-more-patriotic-than-democrats/791627 "2017-07-19T05:03:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2017, 1:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-republicans-generally-more-patriotic-than-democrats/791627/41 "2017-07-19T13:20:26Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > No, they’re not. They’re more nationalistic, and more chauvinistic, and more jingoistic. > > It’s Democrats who more embody the actual love of country, and the people in it, that the word patriotism properly signifies. So why didn’t Democrats tell Gallup this? ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2017, 1:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-republicans-generally-more-patriotic-than-democrats/791627/42 "2017-07-19T13:22:12Z")
1. Objecting to an administration that appears friendly (if not complicit) towards a foreign power that meddled in the most recent election process. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2017, 1:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-republicans-generally-more-patriotic-than-democrats/791627/43 "2017-07-19T13:23:26Z")
It would be interesting to see this poll done a bit differently, with the question of “do you consider yourself to be patriotic?” left until the end. Some good questions first would be: Do you consider those who protest against government policies to be patriotic? Do you consider paying your share of taxes to be patriotic? Do you consider those who criticize the govt’s actions to be patriotic? Do you consider those who criticize the actions of law enforcement to be patriotic? Do you consider supporting the rights of minorities to be patriotic? I could go on, but I’m actually down one eye today, which causes more trouble typing than I thought it would, but you get the point. Quantify what they consider to be patriotic before asking themselves whether or not they identify with it. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2017, 1:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-republicans-generally-more-patriotic-than-democrats/791627/44 "2017-07-19T13:24:44Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > So why didn’t Democrats tell Gallup this? Why didn’t 52% of Republicans explain what they mean when they claim to be “Extremely Patriotic”? ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2017, 1:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-republicans-generally-more-patriotic-than-democrats/791627/45 "2017-07-19T13:24:47Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > So why didn’t Democrats tell Gallup this? I don’t think that was an option in the poll responses. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2017, 1:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-republicans-generally-more-patriotic-than-democrats/791627/46 "2017-07-19T13:25:47Z")
False premise. For example, Democrats do no defend collusion with a hostile foreign power. > [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > Do you have any objective measurements for patriotism you’d like to propose? See above. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2017, 1:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-republicans-generally-more-patriotic-than-democrats/791627/47 "2017-07-19T13:29:06Z")
> [@Happy\_Fun\_Ball](#): > > I think I am more patriotic than most Republicans I know. They fly the flag in front of their house, but I have read the constitution, the declaration, the federalist papers, and other background material many times. I have taken many college level courses over the years on constitutional law and history. I have also read many supreme court decisions and oratories from through the centuries and I believe I have a much better idea of what the US was, is, and what it was intended to be. But I am sure Okra would believe he is more patriotic than me if he met me. Definitions of patriotism can vary, but to me this is what patriotism is all about. Caring enough about your country to understand it and what makes it unique. Jingoism isn’t patriotism, it’s just nationalism. And many people seem to just want the US to be like other countries, which also isn’t patriotism. Not that we shouldn’t shamelessly borrow from others, but we should so taking into account a) whether what other countries do actually works, rather than moralizing, and b) whether it’s compatible with our unique culture and views of government. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2017, 1:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-republicans-generally-more-patriotic-than-democrats/791627/48 "2017-07-19T13:49:49Z")
Perhaps part of the reason is that Democrats are traditionally more like to belong to identity groups (blacks, LGBT, feminists, socialists, globalists, etc.) with grievances against the US. Even granted that many of those grievances are legitimate, they are still going to be less likely to identify as patriotic. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2017, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-republicans-generally-more-patriotic-than-democrats/791627/49 "2017-07-19T13:59:52Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > So why didn’t Democrats tell Gallup this? It was a poll. The pollster asks a question and allows for only a limited number of responses. The person polled is given no opportunity to provide a clarifying response or to demand a definition of the word of to pointing out the errors in the phrasing of the question. As noted above, the Right Wing has hijacked the word “patriot” in the minds of many people to indicate an unquestioning support for the actions of my country regardless of whether those actions are right of wrong, proper or improper. In fact, for a number of people the actions of the country are defined as right or wrong based on whether the country is engaged in that behavior. So when citizens objected to U.S. interference in the Vietnamese civil war, they were branded “unpatriotic” and when citizens objected to an invasion of Iraq on the grounds that the excuses being put forth to justify it were lies and that such an invasion would cause the nation more harm than good, they were branded “unpatriotic.” It is more likely that more Democrats than Republicans associate the word patriot with meaningless flag waving and jingoism, so their answers will reflect that. If one’s definition of patriotism identifies a patriot as someone whose claims that their country is always right, regardless of its actions, then that is the answer to the OP. If one’s definition of patriotism identifies a patriot as someone with a great love of country, then one needs to find a word that has not already been politicized to have a specific political meaning. ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2017, 2:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-republicans-generally-more-patriotic-than-democrats/791627/50 "2017-07-19T14:04:35Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > I think that self-identified patriotism is a fine measurement, but since some have taken issue with it, I wonder if they have a better measurement. What’s it a fine measurement of? All it measures is whether someone describes themselves as patriotic. Of course, some people truly do believe that signaling patriotism is equal to being patriotic, but are you content to let that be your whole definition? You could try to quantify it with a few points, but some of them fall apart when you start looking at them. A few examples: [ul] [li]Did you serve in the millitary?[/li][li]Do you vote?[/li][li]Do you support your country even when it’s done wrong?[/li][li]Do you think it’s even possible for your country to do wrong?[/li][li]When your leadership declares someone an enemy, are they automatically your enemy?[/li][li]Do you perform civic oblications like voting, paying taxes, serving jury duty?[/li][li]Do you think America is the best country in every way?[/li][li]Do you display the flag or other patriotic symbols?[/li][/ul] Some of these seem like no brainers, but are more contentious when you pick them apart… i.e. military service is a pretty undeniable commitment, so why did so many arch-conservatives dodge Vietnam, and don’t even want to serve their country by paying taxes? Flying the flag is a big signaller of patriotism, but all it costs is $19.99 and a stick. There’s absolutely no risk in saying you’re patriotic, because even though patriotism isn’t universally popular, few people are going to criticize it unless you’re using it to justify some other weighty matter. I guess maybe the real question is why are so many Republicans content to define patriotism as saying the magic phrase “I am a patriot”. Given that they consider this such an important virtue, you’d think they would have tighter criteria than “Yep, I’m a patriot”. That’s why Republican patriotism is seen as shallow and insincere. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2017, 2:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-republicans-generally-more-patriotic-than-democrats/791627/51 "2017-07-19T14:05:14Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > I now believe that it is fairly well-established that Republicans generally are more patriotic than Democrats. **Why is that so?** > > The motivation for this thread came out of [this post in this thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=20350848#post20350848) and the ensuing discussion. I was asked to “take your hijack somewhere else” and now this is that somewhere else. You are welcome to read the context and arguments thus far over there, but I will try to briefly summarize the factual basis for my premise here regardless, as I suspect that that will become the main topic of discussion and not so much the _why_, although I would welcome any insights you have to offer on that front as well. > > [Gallup published a scientific poll in 2010](http://www.gallup.com/poll/141110/one-three-americans-extremely-patriotic.aspx) that asked this question: > > They helpfully provided a breakdown of the results by various groups, and here are those results for the two that matter for purposes of this OP: > > **Republicans** : > 52% extremely patriotic > 39% very patriotic > 9% somewhat patriotic > less than 0.5% not especially patriotic > > **Democrats** : > 20% extremely patriotic > 42% very patriotic > 26% somewhat patriotic > 11% not especially patriotic > > Personally I don’t see any reasonable way to parse those results that doesn’t show Democrats as generally less patriotic than Republicans, but I’d be delighted to hear your theories and arguments as to why this is not so, if that’s the claim you wish to advance. The only significant stat in there, IMHO that even weakly supports your conclusion is the final one…those who self-identify as ‘not especially patriotic’. The rest is really just how someone interprets the question. I’d say that basically Democrats and Republicans see the question differently, but in the end, most of those in the main stream self-identify themselves as patriots. The final category is pretty easily explained by the left wing fringe Democrats for who patriotism is not a characteristic that they feel is a good one to have…quite the opposite, I’m sure. ---
**Author:** ![Ann\_Hedonia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ann_hedonia/32/319_2.png) [@Ann\_Hedonia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ann_Hedonia)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2017, 2:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-republicans-generally-more-patriotic-than-democrats/791627/52 "2017-07-19T14:12:53Z")
I don’t enthusiastically identify as a “patriotic” because I associate the word with the patriot movement. > **[Patriot movement](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patriot_movement)** > > In the United States, the patriot movement is a term which is used to describe a conglomeration of non-unified right-wing populist, nationalist political movements, most notably far-right armed militias, sovereign citizens, and tax protesters. Ideologies held by patriot movement groups often focus on anti-government conspiracy theories, with the Anti-Defamation League (ADL) describing a common belief that "government has been infiltrated and subverted" and is no longer legitimate. The Several ... Although I’d love it if someone would jump in and explain how hatred of the federal government = love of country. I’m not holding my breath, though ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2017, 2:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-republicans-generally-more-patriotic-than-democrats/791627/53 "2017-07-19T14:19:11Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > So why didn’t Democrats tell Gallup this? Because they’re _also_ generally not hypocrites lacking in any self awareness or sense of irony? ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2017, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-republicans-generally-more-patriotic-than-democrats/791627/54 "2017-07-19T14:22:24Z")
Wasn’t part of the [Lois Lerner IRS scandal](https://www.forbes.com/sites/kellyphillipserb/2016/06/24/irs-targeting-scandal-citizens-united-lois-lerner-and-the-20m-tax-saga-that-wont-go-away/) that she was picking out any organization with “Patriot” in the name and giving them the run-around? Apparently she has much the same definition. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2017, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-republicans-generally-more-patriotic-than-democrats/791627/55 "2017-07-19T14:31:52Z")
> [@HMS\_Irruncible](#): > > I guess maybe the real question is why are so many Republicans content to define patriotism as saying the magic phrase “I am a patriot”. Given that they consider this such an important virtue, you’d think they would have tighter criteria than “Yep, I’m a patriot”. That’s why Republican patriotism is seen as shallow and insincere. What makes you think that Republicans’ definition of patriotism ends at ‘saying the magic phrase “I am a patriot”’? More of them did tell Gallup that they were extremely patriotic than Dems, but that’s not any sort of evidence that that’s all their patriotism consists of. Take, for example, your first quantifiable point: “Did you serve in the millitary?” The military has far more Republicans serving in it today than Democrats. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2017, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-republicans-generally-more-patriotic-than-democrats/791627/56 "2017-07-19T14:35:49Z")
Another question: why did Republican patriotism jump increase by 50% between 2005 and 2010? The 2005 poll had Republican “extremely patriotic” responses at 32%, and five years later, at 52%. Also, as Gallup points out, “Republicans’ relatively higher identification with the “extremely patriotic” label is particularly intriguing when one considers that Democrats are currently far more likely than Republicans to say they are satisfied with the way things are going in the country (41% vs. 7%, respectively).” I think part of what **Hurricane** is picking up on may be not as much about the character of the parties, but a reflection of some kind of political phenomenon that I can’t put my finger on, either. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2017, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-republicans-generally-more-patriotic-than-democrats/791627/57 "2017-07-19T14:38:54Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > I don’t think that was an option in the poll responses. If Democrats believed that “the word properly signifies” “the actual love of country, and the people in it” and that “It’s Democrats who more embody” those characteristics, then why did 11% of them say they were “not especially patriotic”? Do 11% of Democrats not have “actual love of country and the people in it”? Do 26% of Democrats only love the country “somewhat”? ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2017, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-republicans-generally-more-patriotic-than-democrats/791627/58 "2017-07-19T14:40:47Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Another question: why did Republican patriotism jump increase by 50% between 2005 and 2010? The 2005 poll had Republican “extremely patriotic” responses at 32%, and five years later, at 52%. > > Also, as Gallup points out, “Republicans’ relatively higher identification with the “extremely patriotic” label is particularly intriguing when one considers that Democrats are currently far more likely than Republicans to say they are satisfied with the way things are going in the country (41% vs. 7%, respectively).” > > I think part of what **Hurricane** is picking up on may be not as much about the character of the parties, but a reflection of some kind of political phenomenon that I can’t put my finger on, either. There are going to be a certain segment of the self identified republican extreme patriots that will say, “Of course I am extremely patriotic, I voted against Obummer!” ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2017, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-republicans-generally-more-patriotic-than-democrats/791627/59 "2017-07-19T14:41:05Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > If Democrats believed that “the word properly signifies” “the actual love of country, and the people in it” and that “It’s Democrats who more embody” those characteristics, then why did 11% of them say they were “not especially patriotic”? Do 11% of Democrats not have “actual love of country and the people in it”? Do 26% of Democrats only love the country “somewhat”? I’m sure beliefs about the meaning of the word differ quite extensively – hence my point about how white supremacists, confederate flag wavers, confederacy supporters, and the like might claim they’re patriotic, but I think it’s very reasonable to believe that they are not. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2017, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-republicans-generally-more-patriotic-than-democrats/791627/60 "2017-07-19T14:41:56Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Another question: why did Republican patriotism jump increase by 50% between 2005 and 2010? The 2005 poll had Republican “extremely patriotic” responses at 32%, and five years later, at 52%. > > Also, as Gallup points out, “Republicans’ relatively higher identification with the “extremely patriotic” label is particularly intriguing when one considers that Democrats are currently far more likely than Republicans to say they are satisfied with the way things are going in the country (41% vs. 7%, respectively).” I agree, it’s an interesting phenomenon, and one I don’t think I have a good explanation for. I’m not sure what caused Republicans’ self-identified patriotism to swell between 2005 and 2010. Someone earlier hinted at the Tea Party movement, but I’m not sure I understand how that would affect their answers so dramatically. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-republicans-generally-more-patriotic-than-democrats/791627.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-republicans-generally-more-patriotic-than-democrats/791627.md?page=4)