# why are so many dopers liberal? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [April 13, 2002, 1:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-so-many-dopers-liberal/103357 "2002-04-13T01:39:18Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Michael\_Ellis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/977dab/32.png) [@Michael\_Ellis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Michael_Ellis)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2002, 4:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-so-many-dopers-liberal/103357/41 "2002-04-16T04:36:11Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by rjung \* > \*\* > “Do not be angry with me if I tell you the truth.” > –Socrates \*\* Hmm… “Tell a lie often enough --” Nah, I’m not going to bother. ---
**Author:** ![jjimm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba8739/32.png) [@jjimm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jjimm)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2002, 12:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-so-many-dopers-liberal/103357/42 "2002-04-16T12:37:00Z")
I find the general tone of the SMDB to be right-wing, but then again:[list=a][_]I find people with whom I disagree more noticeable[_]Some conservative posters here are very vocalThe terms ‘conservative’ and ‘liberal’ in the US are both much further right than their equivalents in Europe[/list] ---
**Author:** ![Magickly\_Delicious](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magickly\_Delicious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magickly_Delicious)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2002, 2:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-so-many-dopers-liberal/103357/43 "2002-04-16T14:17:04Z")
Well, if you asked me to define where I fall, I’d say that I’m conservative or middle-of-the-road, definitely not liberal. However, I do find myself saying stuff sometimes that could be construed as liberal. I think it’s because I have ideals that I wish would happen but in the real world, a lot of those ideals just plain don’t work. However, all I do here is talk, so it really doesn’t matter. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Pergau](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7c8e57/32.png) [@Pergau](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pergau)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2002, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-so-many-dopers-liberal/103357/44 "2002-04-16T14:33:49Z")
I think it’s because conservatives know in their heart and soul that their ideas are abhorrent to normal people so they act and sound more liberal than they really are. But come the secrecy of the ballot box you can bet your life that they’ll crawl out of the woodwork. ---
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2002, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-so-many-dopers-liberal/103357/45 "2002-04-16T15:40:41Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Guinastasia \* > \*\*Honestly? I’m a Liberal with a capital L and I see quite a lot of conservatives on this board. > > I’d say most people fall in the center. You have a nice mix here. \*\* My experience is exactly opposite of **Guin’s** – I am strongly conservative on most issues, and I see quite a lot of liberals on this board. Sometimes, in fact, this board seems to be the center of the liberal universe. Of course, as I’ve mentioned elsewhere, where I live, Pat Buchanan is all but considered a moderate. Make of that what you will. > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Sofa King \* > **Because conservatives are so tightly unified under threat of expulsion, they must also bear the burdens of those who purport to represent them, the Rushes and Jerries and Pats, some of whom base their arguments upon fallacious premises.** Uh, just what conservative Star Chamber is doing the expulsions here? What’s you’ve written is not true. A conservative is perfectly free to be a “freethinker”, as it were. There is no official line to toe. Conservatives are no more tight-knit than liberals. We come in hundreds of flavors. Rush Limbaugh, Jerry Falwell, and Pat Robertson don’t speak for the whole of conservative America, or even the majority. Also, Falwell and Robertson certianly aren’t true opinion leaders with any import. Neither are columnists like Ann Coulter or Cal Thomas. They’re among the most extreme, so you notice them. Most conservatives, however, don’t . From my vantage point, Falwell and Robertson are hardly ever in the news. BTW, I agree with Rush’s takes, _sans_ hyperbole, about 2/3 of the time; and with Cal Thomas’ takes about 1/2 the time. I think I have a pretty good eye for when either is being disingenuous towards their target. ---
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2002, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-so-many-dopers-liberal/103357/46 "2002-04-16T15:43:53Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Pergau \* > \*\*I think it’s because conservatives know in their heart and soul that their ideas are abhorrent to normal people so they act and sound more liberal than they really are. But come the secrecy of the ballot box you can bet your life that they’ll crawl out of the woodwork. \*\* What? C’mon, man – conservatives are people, too! Sheesh! **Conservative != extreme freako right-wing fascist** **Guin** … are you quite certain that this board leans right in light of **Pergau’s** post? ---
**Author:** ![LiquidLobotomy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/898d66/32.png) [@LiquidLobotomy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LiquidLobotomy)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2002, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-so-many-dopers-liberal/103357/47 "2002-04-16T20:18:34Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Sublight \* > \*\* > I’m a moderate, and I think everyone here is an extremist nutcase. > \*\* All right! I’m finally represented! On the serious side, I agree with you completely. ---
**Author:** ![Giraffe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giraffe/32/129_2.png) [@Giraffe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giraffe)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2002, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-so-many-dopers-liberal/103357/48 "2002-04-16T20:39:18Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by bordelond \* > **Guin** … are you quite certain that this board leans right in light of **Pergau’s** post? This is an excellent example of how one’s politics skew their perception. **Pergau** = one person SDMB = many, many people If a single person’s post changes your perceptions of the political consensus of the entire message board then you are, I am afraid, an idiot. (I mean that in a general sense, not directed at **bordelond** personally.) I range between somewhat to very leftist, depending on the issue. Some threads here have many conservative voices, depending on the issue. Some have many liberal voices. Overall, I’d guess this place is more liberal than conservative on average, but mostly I think it’s a delightful mix of opinions and viewpoints. ---
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2002, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-so-many-dopers-liberal/103357/49 "2002-04-16T21:10:26Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Giraffe \* > \*\* > This is an excellent example of how one’s politics skew their perception. > > **Pergau** = one person > SDMB = many, many people > > If a single person’s post changes your perceptions of the political consensus of the entire message board then you are, I am afraid, an idiot. (I mean that in a general sense, not directed at **bordelond** personally.) \*\* I know what you mean. **Pergau** , however, has lots of company here among those vocal about their political leanings. ---
**Author:** ![rextango](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ac91a4/32.png) [@rextango](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rextango)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2002, 2:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-so-many-dopers-liberal/103357/50 "2002-04-17T02:33:30Z")
Even here in the stoic midwest stoners seem pretty liberal. That’s interesting since stoners would seem to be more concerned with personal freedoms than marching lock-step into a total welfare socialist state. I don’t seem to recall many Commie nations being too friendly to druggies. It is my opinion that the Constitution fails to make drugs illegal, unless it infringes upon another’s freedoms. Sounds good to me. Hmmm, the Constitution…maybe we should actually follow it instead of sending yahoo after yahoo to Washington to torture it into fewer freedoms and more laws. ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2002, 3:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-so-many-dopers-liberal/103357/51 "2002-04-17T03:48:53Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Sofa King \* > **It is understood that liberals are more loosely bound and are therefore permitted to disagree amongst themselves.** “Permitted?” My dear boy, the correct word is “REQUIRED!” As Will Rogers put it many years ago, “I do not belong to any organized political party: I’m a Democrat.” As for the question about differences between us and our parents, I and my parents are originally from Minnesota. We are pretty much “Humphrey Democrats.” It is my understanding that Minnesota’s modern Democratic Party was formed from a coalition of the Farmer-Labor Party and the Progressive Party. By American standards we’re pretty pink, though I consider myself quite moderate and everybody else who lives in my county (Dupage County, Illinois–Henry Hyde’s my congressman) is a right wing nut. ---
**Author:** ![TwistofFate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/cdc98d/32.png) [@TwistofFate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TwistofFate)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2002, 10:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-so-many-dopers-liberal/103357/52 "2002-04-17T10:19:26Z")
Lets look at it like this. World and local events influence what topics are discussed. lets take from the last election onwards. At the Election, it is safe to say that both sides came out in fairly equal numbers to discuss the election. with the ensuing debate caused by the events surrounding the Election, the board took a jump to the left, settled back to normal. (which, IMO is center right). The board was creeping to the left with the AWNR, Kyoto, and “Star Wars” discussions, before 9/11 pushed the board extreme right for a brief while, and now has settled back to normal. Events determine the political mood of this board. ---
**Author:** ![Pergau](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7c8e57/32.png) [@Pergau](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pergau)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2002, 1:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-so-many-dopers-liberal/103357/53 "2002-04-17T13:04:13Z")
Twisty, I don’t think it’s as simple as that. You’re right about the knee-jerk reaction but it’s more a question of Culture than events. ---
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2002, 1:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-so-many-dopers-liberal/103357/54 "2002-04-17T13:19:14Z")
**Giraffe, Guinistasia** , here’s another one, from [this current GD thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=109887): > [@](#): > > _Originally posted by Enderw24:_ > **Ashcroft lost though. That’s gotta be good news, right?** So what’s that – Ashcroft is uber-conservative, and therefore irredeemably bad somehow? Ashcroft never had a good idea in his life? I can cull quotes like this all day long if I cared to. The board is clearly overwhelmingly liberal, FWIW. ---
**Author:** ![Spoke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a88e57/32.png) [@Spoke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoke)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2002, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-so-many-dopers-liberal/103357/55 "2002-04-17T16:05:34Z")
I’m a moderate Democrat, and on the SDMB I find myself tangling with extremists on both ends of the spectrum. Seems pretty well-balanced to me, at least from an American political perspective. ---
**Author:** ![DPWhite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d26b3c/32.png) [@DPWhite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DPWhite)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2002, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-so-many-dopers-liberal/103357/56 "2002-04-17T16:17:00Z")
Because we are fighting ignorance. ---
**Author:** ![Sublight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/439d5e/32.png) [@Sublight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sublight)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2002, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-so-many-dopers-liberal/103357/57 "2002-04-17T16:18:05Z")
**bordelond** , you’re a conservative and see the board as full of liberals. **Guin** is liberal and sees it as full of conservatives. I’m a moderate and see it as full of extremists. What does that tell you about selective perceptions? ---
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2002, 4:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-so-many-dopers-liberal/103357/58 "2002-04-17T16:58:49Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Sublight \* > \*\ ***bordelond** , you’re a conservative and see the board as full of liberals. **Guin** is liberal and sees it as full of conservatives. I’m a moderate and see it as full of extremists. What does that tell you about selective perceptions? \*\* See my first post in this thread. Clearly, I cannot make up my mind! 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Giraffe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giraffe/32/129_2.png) [@Giraffe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giraffe)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2002, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-so-many-dopers-liberal/103357/59 "2002-04-17T18:15:14Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by bordelond \* > \*\* > So what’s that – Ashcroft is uber-conservative, and therefore irredeemably bad somehow? Ashcroft never had a good idea in his life? > > I can cull quotes like this all day long if I cared to. The board is clearly overwhelmingly liberal, FWIW.\*\* Again, this reinforces the idea of selective perception. You assume that **Ender** is anti-Ashcroft solely because Ashcroft is conservative. Ashcroft has been pretty consistently in favor of increased security and safety at the expense of civil liberties. Some people think increased safety is not worth restrictions to civil liberties. Others do. It’s an issue worth discussing, without automatically assigning labels based on position, e.g. if you disagree with what Ashcroft is doing, you must therefore be anti-Republican. Not all conservatives want to curtail free speech and civil liberties in the name of security. Secondly, as **Sublight** already said, if you “cull quotes”, you can see any bias you want. Thirdly, I first thought this place was surprisingly conservative when I started posting. That’s because most of my friends are liberal as well. I submit that if you are surrounded by people with similar political leanings in your daily life, a message board with a significant fraction of people holding opposing views (even if it’s less than 50%) may seem disproportionate, just due to the contrast with what you’re used to. ---
**Author:** ![JohnM](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/848f3c/32.png) [@JohnM](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnM)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2002, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-so-many-dopers-liberal/103357/60 "2002-04-17T19:14:49Z")
Do we have any political science grad students who might be up for a research project to settle the question? Proposed methodology: select a random subset of postings, sort by poster, then have a group of your fellow students (pre-selected for political bias so as to fairly represent a spectrum of opinion) rank each poster on a left-right spectrum or 4-quadrant grid. Crunch the responses, write it up, and you just may have a decent thesis and your M.A. degree. Title it something like “Political Expression on the Internet: A Case Study.” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-so-many-dopers-liberal/103357.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-so-many-dopers-liberal/103357.md?page=4)