# Why are the revelations in the Bible? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [November 11, 2004, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-the-revelations-in-the-bible/274239 "2004-11-11T18:32:31Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 5\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Bippy\_the\_Beardless](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ac8455/32.png) [@Bippy\_the\_Beardless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bippy_the_Beardless)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2004, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-the-revelations-in-the-bible/274239/1 "2004-11-11T18:32:31Z")
If someone could point me to a good web site, or has a good explanation. Why did the revelations get into the Bible instead of the apocrypha? Its contents seem to me quite out of line with the rest of the New Testament. Was it put in because it is such a good source for preaching material, Who was the “John” to whom the revelations were given and when are they dated from? ---
**Author:** ![Neurotik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/91b2a8/32.png) [@Neurotik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Neurotik)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2004, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-the-revelations-in-the-bible/274239/2 "2004-11-11T19:01:45Z")
You may want to try [this article.](http://www.nccbuscc.org/nab/bible/revelation/intro.htm) ---
**Author:** ![Bippy\_the\_Beardless](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ac8455/32.png) [@Bippy\_the\_Beardless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bippy_the_Beardless)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2004, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-the-revelations-in-the-bible/274239/3 "2004-11-11T19:55:11Z")
Thanks for the link, it gives good information on who John may have been. But reinforces my view that it seems more to fit in more with the old testament than the new, or a good Christian read, but not part of the bible itself. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2004, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-the-revelations-in-the-bible/274239/4 "2004-11-11T20:06:32Z")
From [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Book\_of\_Revelation:](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Book_of_Revelation:) > [@](#): > > **The Revelation of St. John the Divine,** popularly known as the **Book of Revelation** or **The Apocalypse** (apocalypse is from the Greek for “revelation”), is the final book and the only prophetical book of the New Testament in the Bible. > > The book is addressed to seven churches, at Ephesus, Smyrna, Pergamon, Thyatira, Sardis, Philadelphia, and Laodicea. > > It contains an account of the author, named John in the text, who saw a vision describing future events at the end of the world–involving the final rebellion by Satan at Armageddon, God’s final defeat of Satan, and the restoration of peace to the world. > > It is definitely one of the most controversial, and hardest to understand, books of the Bible, with many ranging interpretations of the meanings of the various names and events in the account. The identity of the author John is not completely clear. A traditional view is that the author of this book was John the Apostle, but other scholars doubt that. The traditional Christian view is that this John was the same as the author of the Gospel of John and 1, 2, and 3 John. In the fourth century, St. John Chrysostom and other bishops argued against including this book in the New Testament canon, chiefly because of the difficulties of interpreting it and the danger for abuse. Christians in Syria also rejected it for a time because of the Montanists’ heavy reliance on it. In the 9th century it was included, with the Apocalypse of Peter among “disputed” books in the Stichometry of Nicephorus, patriarch of Constantinople. In the end, it was included in the accepted canon, although it remains the only book of the New Testament that is not read within the Divine Liturgy of the Eastern Orthodox Church. > > Traditionally the date of the writing of this book has generally been fixed at the year 96, in the reign of Domitian. Others contend for an earlier date, 68 or 69, in the reign of Nero. Those who are in favour of the later date appeal to the testimony of the Christian father Irenaeus (died 185), who received information relative to this book from those who had seen John face to face. He says that the Apocalypse “was seen no long time ago.” Other evidence for the later date is internal: the book alludes to significant persecution, affecting the Christians of Asia Minor. This is a better historical fit for Domitian’s reign than Nero’s; Nero’s persecution was mostly confined to the territories around Rome, while Domitian’s persecution was indeed vigorously carried out in Asia Minor. > > \ > > The acceptance of Revelation into the canon is itself the result of a historical process, essentially no different from the career of other texts. The eventual exclusion of other contemporary apocalyptic literature from the canon may throw light on the unfolding historical processes of what was officially considered orthodox, what was heterodox, what was even heretical. From [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biblical\_canon:](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biblical_canon:) > [@](#): > > The first complete listing of canonical books of the New Testament mentioned in the Denziger Sources of Catholic Dogma is in §84, which dates from 382 (the Council of Rome). > > “One book of the Gospels according to Matthew, one book according to Mark, one book according to Luke, one book according to John. Epistles of the Apostle Paul, fourteen in number, one to the Romans, two to the Corinthians, one to the Ephesians, two to the Thessalonians, one to the Galatians, one to the Philippians, one to the Colossians, two to Timothy, one to Titus, one to Philemon, one to the Hebrews. Also one book of the Apocalypse of John and one book of the Acts of the Apostles. Also the canonical epistles, seven in number: two epistles of the Apostle Peter, one epistle of the Apostle James, one epistle of the Apostle John, two epistles of another John, a priest, and one epistle of the Apostle Jude the Zealot. Here ends the canon of the New Testament.” > > The third Synod of Carthage, in 397, ratified the canon accepted previously at the Synod of Hippo Regius in North Africa, 393, the acts of which have been lost. This synod marks the beginning of a more widely recognized canon. The inclusion of some books in the New Testament was still debated: Epistle to Hebrews, James, 2 John, 3 John, 2 Peter, Jude and Revelation. Grounds for debate included the question of authorship of these books (note that the Canon of Rome had already rejected John the Apostle’s authorship of 2 and 3 John, while retaining the books); suitability for use; and how widely they were actually being used. 2 Peter is the most weakly attested of all the books in the Christian canon. One concern regarding the book of Revelation at that time is that it was already being interpreted in a wide variety of controversial ways. Virtually all Christians have accepted and continue to accept the same 27 books as the New Testament, except for those Syriac-speaking Christians who continue to use the Peshitta. In addition, the Ethiopian Orthodox Church lists four books of Sinodos (church practices), two Books of Covenant, “Ethiopic Clement”, and “Ethiopic Didiscalia” within their New Testament canon. The books that were not accepted are generally termed New Testament apocrypha. > > At the time of the Protestant Reformation, Martin Luther made an attempt to remove the books of Hebrews, James, Jude and Revelation from the canon (partially because they were perceived to go against certain Protestant doctrines, partially because of the early debate over their inclusion), but this was not accepted. However, these books are ordered last in German-language Lutheran Bibles to this day. ---
**Author:** ![C\_K\_Dexter\_Haven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b2d939/32.png) [@C\_K\_Dexter\_Haven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/C_K_Dexter_Haven)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2004, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-the-revelations-in-the-bible/274239/5 "2004-11-11T22:05:41Z")
Well, not directly addressing the book of Revelation (there’s no “s” on the end), but the general topic of why some books were included and some excluded, you might try: [Straight Dope Staff Report: Who wrote the Bible? (Part 5: How did the Bible come to be compiled?](http://www.straightdope.com/mailbag/mbible5.html)