# why are there more than one screwdriver (or screw) type? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [December 22, 2011, 7:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-there-more-than-one-screwdriver-or-screw-type/607058 "2011-12-22T07:16:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![moldmonkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ee59a6/32.png) [@moldmonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/moldmonkey)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2011, 6:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-there-more-than-one-screwdriver-or-screw-type/607058/41 "2011-12-24T06:26:10Z")
> [@](#): > > On high end examples of custom gunsmithing, one of the things you see is all the screws being at the same “clock position” when they are properly tightened. This is accomplished by using screws with slightly oversized heads that are tightened into place, then ground down and a new slot cut into place at the desired clock position. I think the hex head screws became popular mainly because they offer a somewhat similar aesthetic appearance without nearly the work. I had always heard this was done by making the countersinks deeper in small increments until the slots line up. There are attachments (Cogsdill brand, IIRC) for hand drills and drill presses that allow fine adjustment and repeatability of countersink depth. This was in high end boats. Gunsmiths have been known to do things the hard way/take little things to extremes before though.🙂 Found it: [http://www.cogsdill.com/products/deburring/micro-limit/](http://www.cogsdill.com/products/deburring/micro-limit/) ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2011, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-there-more-than-one-screwdriver-or-screw-type/607058/42 "2011-12-24T23:12:29Z")
> [@Larry\_Mudd](#): > > What’s to elaborate? Peter Robertson (inventor of the eponymous screwdriver) was widely regarded as a harmless crackpot for the decade-and-a-half before Adolph Ketteruck of the Craftsman Corporation accidentally hit upon a manufacturing process for producing screws which worked with it. I would argue that, if a screwdriver didn’t have screws to drive, it wasn’t a screwdriver. It’s just a weird shaped piece of metal with a plastic handle. ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2011, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-there-more-than-one-screwdriver-or-screw-type/607058/43 "2011-12-31T00:10:05Z")
> **[How Do Gunmakers Line Up Screw Slots??](https://www.shotgunworld.com/threads/how-do-gunmakers-line-up-screw-slots.177410/)** > > I am pretty mechanically inclined. I have read the entire texts of Game Gun, Fine Gunmaking: Double Shotguns, Double Guns and Custom Gunsmithing, and Best Guns. In these books they touch on making gunscrews and aligning them but for the life of me... ---
**Author:** ![crypto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b3f665/32.png) [@crypto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crypto)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2011, 6:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-there-more-than-one-screwdriver-or-screw-type/607058/44 "2011-12-31T06:37:38Z")
[quote=“Gary “Wombat” Robson, post:26, topic:607058”] Okay. But that’s not what you said in the part of the OP that I quoted. [/QUOTE] Well, that’s what I meant. You should have been able to figure that out! 😛 [quote=“Gary “Wombat” Robson, post:26, topic:607058”] Your goal is to only have one or two screwdrivers? That’s a problem. Torx, Robertson (square-drive), and Allen head screws all require a set of drivers in different sizes. You have to scale up with the size of the screw, or you’re going to snap off the shank of the screwdriver. Even with one standard head style, you can’t get away with just one or two drivers. Flat-blade screwdrivers partially solve that problem, but they’re absolutely horrible to use with a power driver since they’re not self-centering and the heads tend to strip out easily. They definitely have their place, though. Also, as I mentioned above, in a tight space, you may not have room above the head to fit a screwdriver. That necessitates either a hex-head screw or an Allen-head (although you could probably find a set of right-angle Robertson or Torx drivers). I would be happy to see Allen screws replaced by Torx, and Phillips screws go away entirely. I just can’t see backing down to a single type. [/QUOTE] OK… I seem to have confused some folks. Sorry about that. I’m not talking about a “type” of screw, like a sheet metal screw, or any other type of screw that has a purpose based on its threads, screw composition, or designed purpose. I’m also not talking about the size of the screw… length, thickness, whatever. I’m just focusing on the head of the screw. i.e. can the different screw heads that require so many different screw driver types (and heads) be reduced to ultimately one or two designs? I also understand that if we choose torx heads, that they will have to be different sizes, to compensate for the size and length of screw. But the basic look of the screw head would be the same. I hope that’s a bit more clear. ---
**Author:** ![crypto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b3f665/32.png) [@crypto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crypto)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2011, 6:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-there-more-than-one-screwdriver-or-screw-type/607058/45 "2011-12-31T06:44:54Z")
> [@FE3O4ENAIL](#): > > If we had on one type, whos standard would we use, DIN (German), SAE (American), JIC ( Japanese)? This isn’t really what I was going for. I’m referring to the screw head design, so if the world decides that every screw will be a torx head, so be it. THAT’s what I’m interested in standardizing. ---
**Author:** ![Anachronism](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e56c9b/32.png) [@Anachronism](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anachronism)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2011, 12:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-there-more-than-one-screwdriver-or-screw-type/607058/46 "2011-12-31T12:00:32Z")
> [@Stink Fish Pot](#): > > At the end of the day, though… the only one that serves any purpose outside of holding things together is the torque head… I’ve never personally had to torque a screw to a certain specification, but assuming this is a possibility, then fine… use this screw head for ever screw application, thereby leaving you the option of torquing if you need to, but for the vast majority of applications, you’d just screw it in. What is a torque head screw? Do you mean torx? ---
**Author:** ![Dog80](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/6bbea6/32.png) [@Dog80](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dog80)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2011, 1:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-there-more-than-one-screwdriver-or-screw-type/607058/47 "2011-12-31T13:20:15Z")
This [legrand power strip](http://radionics.rs-online.com/web/p/distribution-sockets/7050728/) comes without a cable so you can attach a cable of your liking. On the backside there is a small removable panel that is secured by two philips screws. You take this out so you can connect the cable. The rest of the screws that hold the power strip together are not supposed to be removed so they have triangular heads. ---
**Author:** ![thelabdude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/dc4da7/32.png) [@thelabdude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thelabdude)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2011, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-there-more-than-one-screwdriver-or-screw-type/607058/48 "2011-12-31T18:05:36Z")
I think Harbor Freight sells a good sized pack of tamper resistant screw bits for $2. ---
**Author:** ![Mewl\_Dear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d6d6ee/32.png) [@Mewl\_Dear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mewl_Dear)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2011, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-there-more-than-one-screwdriver-or-screw-type/607058/49 "2011-12-31T18:35:27Z")
I know from years of experience that socket head screws (the kind you use allen wrenches on) are almost impossible to strip. ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Robson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gary_robson/32/3448_2.png) [@Gary\_Robson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Robson)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2012, 12:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-there-more-than-one-screwdriver-or-screw-type/607058/50 "2012-01-01T00:26:30Z")
> [@Stink Fish Pot](#): > > Well, that’s what I meant. You should have been able to figure that out! 😛 As I’ve been known to tell my kids, listen to what I _mean_, not what I say! 😉 ---
**Author:** ![VOW](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/vow/32/3043_2.png) [@VOW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VOW)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2012, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-there-more-than-one-screwdriver-or-screw-type/607058/51 "2012-01-01T00:44:47Z")
Okay, let’s say that you get your three wishes, and you’ve decided to become Emperor of the World. Your first decree is to mandate ALL screws will be of the “finagle” design, so the universal finagle tool will be used. All the mechanics, carpenters, handypersons, and assemblers will ONLY need a graduated set of finagle screwdrivers. Wonderful! Well, no, not really. The repair folks are still gonna need every single kind of screwdriver in the universe, because your decree doesn’t change all the screws in the the world that already exist in place. Gotta rethink that one. ~VOW ---
**Author:** ![crypto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b3f665/32.png) [@crypto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crypto)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2012, 3:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-there-more-than-one-screwdriver-or-screw-type/607058/52 "2012-01-01T03:37:24Z")
> [@Anachronism](#): > > What is a torque head screw? Do you mean torx? indeed. I hadn’t used my Q button in a while, so I thought I’d give it a work out. Sorry for the confusion. My bad. ---
**Author:** ![Rick](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/9f8e36/32.png) [@Rick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2012, 3:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-there-more-than-one-screwdriver-or-screw-type/607058/53 "2012-01-01T03:48:20Z")
> [@Mewl\_Dear](#): > > I know from years of experience that socket head screws (the kind you use allen wrenches on) are almost impossible to strip. Want to bet? They do strip. ---
**Author:** ![Rand\_Rover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/db5fbb/32.png) [@Rand\_Rover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rand_Rover)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2012, 4:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-there-more-than-one-screwdriver-or-screw-type/607058/54 "2012-01-01T04:41:01Z")
> [@Stink Fish Pot](#): > > I was looking at some screws tonight, and it occurred to me that there is really no need for any more than one type of screw and one shape screwdriver needed. > > I understand that the first screws came with the slotted top out of sheer ease, but the phillips head (the cross) blows this out of the water for ease of use. > > There are also the hex heads (for an allen wrench, for example) or a star head (for I assume setting torque specs., but not altogether sure). > > At the end of the day, though… the only one that serves any purpose outside of holding things together is the torque head… I’ve never personally had to torque a screw to a certain specification, but assuming this is a possibility, then fine… use this screw head for ever screw application, thereby leaving you the option of torquing if you need to, but for the vast majority of applications, you’d just screw it in. > > So, what gives? Why the continued production and use of all these other shapes? Everyone’s life would be much easier if you only had to keep one or two screwdrivers on hand for EVERYTHING! Why do we have Coke and Pepsi? Sprite and 7-up? McDonald’s and Burger King? The list goes on and on. Clothes from Brooks Brothers aren’t that much different than those from Joseph A. Banks. And a Honda Accord and Toyota Camry are pretty much the same damn thing as well. Different people like different things. And different companies think they can make something better than another company, and their idea for making something better may involve just a slight tweak. So, you end up with lots of different things that are pretty much the same damn thing but are slightly different. And that’s OK–there’s absolutely nothing wrong with that state of affairs. And what if everyone woke up tomorrow with the same idea as you–that we should have only one type of screw drive. What do you think would happen? Do you think all types of screw drives but one should be outlawed by some international law-making body that applies to all nations (which would need to be invented first)? What about existing screws that may need to be serviced–would those have to be replaced? So, your idea betrays an astounding ignorance about how the world works and would be completely unworkable if you were successful in convincing everyone of its merit. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Colossus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.colossus/32/9423_2.png) [@Dr.Colossus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Colossus)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2012, 12:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-there-more-than-one-screwdriver-or-screw-type/607058/55 "2012-01-02T12:27:47Z")
i don’t have much to add that probably hasn’t been addressed, but the more facets the fastener has, the less likely you are to damage or slip out. This is why socket\>wrench. I saw a really good diagram of the mechanics of a wrench on a nut in Cycleworld. Contact is only made near the inside corner of only two facets. Whereas sockets not only contact every facet, but also have a larger contact patch per facet. I work on a lot of antiques and can say flathead panhead screws can screw off. PUN(t)! ok, sorry. Anyway– Someone mentioned the case of torquing off the head of a Torx before it slips out. I’ve done this numerously with Phillips heads, while screwing into well-seasoned oak. Have you ever used Tapcons (read carefully, NOT ‘tampons’)? We had a flood and had to fix a lot of buckled oak flooring that was lain over concrete. We’d torque the heads of those 1 out of 4 times. And the ones we used were .30cents each. I think we’ve sufficiently conquered the torquability of the fastener realm. Time to strengthen the shafts. Everything about all of this reeks of innuendo. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Colossus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.colossus/32/9423_2.png) [@Dr.Colossus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Colossus)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2012, 12:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-there-more-than-one-screwdriver-or-screw-type/607058/56 "2012-01-02T12:39:43Z")
Want to know of a dumb screw? I don’t know what it’s called, and loath them so much I will not research their name– but we were assembling a late 18th century french poster bed and the fasteners were these drive bolts that had ball heads with four holes in them. You had to find something to stick in the hole and turn it like a key. The fundamental design of the thing paradoxically ensured you could only turn it 1/4 turn per…uh…lever insertion. Every quarter turn you had to pull out, stick it in another hole, and repeat until–I might as well say it–climax was reached. Ok, i know it’s called “seating” the screw, but come on. I’m simply not that mature. I’ve never seen them outside extremely old French furniture, and it’s impossible to look a it and not it was someone’s real bad idea. On a similar note, we are in possession of the Cowbridge House (google it–very interesting. it’s the English Manor House where Ecko hide out and perfected/manufactured radar during the Battle of Britain). It’s from the late 1790s and something else. My point, tho, is that we re-assembled some of the carved oak rooms/staircase levels and such for display. All the screws are old, brittle flat-heads–an impossible mess. But I got the biggest kick off finding a hand-held drill stashed in a cubby behind a carved oak section of what would be a header wall. It is most assuredly from when the home was built and just emphasizes the ungodly effort that used to be required to make grand things. It looks like a corkpull for wine bottles. But it was instead to make pilot holes in extremely dense quarter-sawn English Oak. Those Victorians, man. Wow. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Colossus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.colossus/32/9423_2.png) [@Dr.Colossus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Colossus)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2012, 12:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-there-more-than-one-screwdriver-or-screw-type/607058/57 "2012-01-02T12:44:23Z")
> [@Rick](#): > > Want to bet? They do strip. seconded and carried. Work on a motorcycle some time and you’ll see just how easily female slot will go round on you. I had to change my Ducati’s clutch and it was the pits. They strip out like mad. ---
**Author:** ![crypto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b3f665/32.png) [@crypto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crypto)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2012, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-there-more-than-one-screwdriver-or-screw-type/607058/58 "2012-01-02T20:52:42Z")
> [@Rand\_Rover](#): > > Why do we have Coke and Pepsi? Sprite and 7-up? McDonald’s and Burger King? The list goes on and on. Clothes from Brooks Brothers aren’t that much different than those from Joseph A. Banks. And a Honda Accord and Toyota Camry are pretty much the same damn thing as well. > > Different people like different things. And different companies think they can make something better than another company, and their idea for making something better may involve just a slight tweak. So, you end up with lots of different things that are pretty much the same damn thing but are slightly different. And that’s OK–there’s absolutely nothing wrong with that state of affairs. > > And what if everyone woke up tomorrow with the same idea as you–that we should have only one type of screw drive. What do you think would happen? Do you think all types of screw drives but one should be outlawed by some international law-making body that applies to all nations (which would need to be invented first)? What about existing screws that may need to be serviced–would those have to be replaced? > > So, your idea betrays an astounding ignorance about how the world works and would be completely unworkable if you were successful in convincing everyone of its merit. What’s wrong with you? :rolleyes: Seriously… My idea “betrays an astounding ignorance about how the world works… blah, blah, blah”? Before I retort, read your screw manifesto again and see if you can figure out what you did. Let me guess… your family owned stock in the “shitty slot screw company”, and lost your college fund when the phillips came out? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-there-more-than-one-screwdriver-or-screw-type/607058.md?page=2)