Yes, that’s how I interepreted what you said:
If you were saying something else, then I misunderstood you.
All I was saying is there is no need for a lawyer or legal advice if all that needs to be done is copy identical text from one document to another; to fill in a form with prepared data of which no opinion is requested, desired or needed.
Sorta like a college lecture, where the data passes from the notebook of the professor to the notebook of the student without affecting the mind of either. 
And I would say it depends on the form. And what the stakes are.
If you have $10,000 in assets, you can probably get away with using a $30 will form that you downloaded from the internet. If you have $500,000 in assets, you’d be crazy to do that.
For most Americans, buying a house is the only high stakes transaction they will enter into in their lifetimes.
(I suppose that the stakes are somewhat high vis-a-vis student loans. Actually, I would guess that most student borrowers would be well-served to see an attorney before signing those student loan papers.)
Brazil84, then your beef is with the title companies, not me. I am constantly suggesting to both buyers and sellers that if they have any doubt about any legal matter, they should consult with a lawyer, but it’s their choice to do so or not. I will not force them.
In most real estate transactions I observe, the title company decides on the title wording (it’s usually obvious, or requested by a buyer) and sends it to be typed up at another office. A lawyer doesn’t look at it. Then the seller gets a bill that says, “Title preparation, $75”.
If there is a legal opinion to be rendered, that gets billed separately, usually by the hour.
I understand. But a title company is not the same thing as a layperson.
I concede that there are plenty of people and entities out there who are competent to do simple legal work but are forbidden to do so by laws forbidding them from the “practice of law.”
But that’s a different issue from the question of whether your average Tom, Dick, or Harry is competent to draft a deed buying or selling a house. Even if there is a form available.
Just thought I’d add my own little opinion in - The reason Ive chosen the path of law is not only is it probably recognised as a respectable career but also the aspect of helping others (with the added bonus of making some good money! lol). I wouldnt be surprised if I find myself working in the sector of legal aid as people who are granted legal aid are the ones who usually appreciate the help more so. Also that way I wont be taking money directly from the person Im helping.
It cuts both ways, trustno_1. Some of my best ever clients have been pro bono ones, as well as some of my biggest pains.
Out of interest, where in the process are you? I hope you can continue with the aaim of legal aid work - the world needs more good pro bono lawyers.
So far I’ve got a HND in Legal Service, a BA (HONS) Law and Management and have completed my first year of LLB (HONS). I have three years left of my LLB then have to do my diploma to enable me to practice. Although as the law society of Scotland states I have to do a two year traineeship before I can work on my own and be fully qualified. So I essentially have another 6 years before I can get to where I really wanna be and by that time i’ll be pushing 30 (28) sigh. My real ambition is to practice law in MA, I really hope thats one ambition I get to fulfil. Im currently looking for work in a solicitors firm to get my foot in the door so to speak!
To cheer you up, I started practicing at age 36.
That’s not the point. The fact that virtually every real estate transaction involves a lawyer =/= every lawyer is involved with real estate. Every instance of brain surgery involves a brain surgeon, but that doesn’t mean that all doctors operate on brains.
Not in my experience.
Why more litigation lawyers per capita in the USA than most other first world nations?
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You need litigation more than most other first world nations. The nanny state and private litigation create a balance which is considered fair to society. The less the nanny state provides (e.g. health insurance, disability insurance, etc.), the more private litigation is used to fill the gap.
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You can afford litigation more than most other first world nations. If both parties have the funds for a lawsuit, or there is a pot of gold at the end of the litigation rainbow (e.g. insurance in a contingency fee based matter), then a lawsuit is far more likely than if the defendant is poor or uninsured.
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Profit!
Welcome to the SDMB. I hope you join us as a member.
What is MA? I’m a barrister and solicitor in Kanukistan, so I’m not familiar with this MA of which thoust speaks
Don’t let the ripe old entry age of 28 get you down. In this game, having a few years under your belt is a good thing. I was called to the bar when I was 39, and have no regrets.
Ye Commonwealth of Massachusetts.
Actually, it normally does not cost anywhere near that much. It’s just that your dislike of lawyers is so well known that word has spread throughout the legal community, so when you go for legal services, you are grossly overcharged.
You will be pleased to learn, however, that steps are being taken to clean up the land registration system. For example, here in Ontario, we are moving away from our old land registration system, in which title was only registered with the government, to a land title system, in which title is both registered with and guaranteed by the government. We are also going over to electronic rather than paper-based filing. http://www.lawreform.ie/Kate%20Murray%20Ireland%20Nov%2010%202004.pdf Title companies and paralegals are doing more and more of the residential real estate work, while lawyers are moving away from it.
I had an interesting chat with a friend on this a couple of weeks ago. I am a sole practioner in the middle of nowhere, about eight-hundered and fifty miles from the provincial capital. He’s down there running the litigation department of one of our nation’s largest firms. Despite our firms being about as different as they come, neither of our firms handle residential real estate. The fees are too low. The exposure is too high. The clients can be far better served by volume based service providers, such as title companies, paralegals, or real estate clerks supervised by lawyers.
So there you have it, ralph: a cleaner registration system that includes guarantee of title, a streamlined computerized filing procedure, and lawyers doing their darndest to steer clear of residential real estate.
Do you really want to get into the JD vs MBA debate?
A JD is a good generalists degree if you want to either be a lawyer, work in an industry tangential to the law (ie selling lit support software) or tell your coworkers you are a lawyer after you change into a different industry.
What kind of blows my mind is not so much how many lawyers there are but how there is a multi billion dollar industry of software companies, vendors and management consulting and accounting firms (including the Big-4 accounting firms) that exist only to support various aspects of litigation. I spent 4 years in a management consulting firm doing stuff like computer forensics, electronic discovery management, expert testimony, investigations and general “so what is it you actually do here?” management consulting stuff. All for lawyers and law firms and legal departments. I just took a new job managing a strategy group at a Fortune 500 company where all we do is just figure out the logistics and infrastructure of dealing with our company’s lawsuits. Forget the lawsuits, we probably spend $40 million a year just paying someone to store all the data we need to produce during discovery.
The U.S. is a country founded on the rule of law. Many of the Framers were lawyers. Most Americans still strongly believe it’s better to take each other to court than to hurt or kill each other when a dispute arises.
I went into the law because (in no particular order) the subject fascinated me, lawyers can help get things done in ways others can’t, I wanted to help people and see that justice was done, I wanted to earn some money, my dad is a lawyer, and practicing law can be prestigious even if individual grubby ambulance-chasers aren’t. As the saying goes, everyone hates lawyers until they need one. I’ve long thought it’s not that we have too many lawyers, but that we have too many lawyers chasing the same large but limited pool of money (in big firms, as corporate counsel, or as personal-injury lawyers, especially). There’s no lack of poor people who need representation in civil litigation or criminal cases but may find it hard to come by capable counsel.
DMark, when I started law school in 1989, there were several polls that indicated that LA Law was indeed very influential in inspiring lots o’ people around that time to apply to law school. To Kill A Mockingbird influenced an earlier generation, but Atticus Finch remains the beau ideal of a good, honest lawyer for many.
There’s a vacancy in Mississippi. Richard “Dickie” Scruggs was just sentenced to 5 years for attempting to bribe a judge in an insurance coverage case over Katrina damages.
Not enough sand. 