# Why are we alive? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [May 24, 2012, 8:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-we-alive/622931 "2012-05-24T08:59:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2012, 5:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-we-alive/622931/61 "2012-05-26T05:19:44Z")
> [@thepillar](#): > > What’s the point of being alive when after a couple of decades we die. Who/what is responsible for starting life on planet earth and who/what is it? Why did bring forth life on this planet? Being alive is more evolutionarily successful than being dead. Living things have more children, who inherit the desire to be alive and reproduce also. As for responsibility, far as we know it was chemistry. As for why, my friend’s father, a Holocaust survivor, said “Why is a crooked letter.” And he ought to know. ---
**Author:** ![Mijin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mijin/32/9369_2.png) [@Mijin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mijin)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2012, 12:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-we-alive/622931/62 "2012-05-26T12:24:36Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > Methinks some people in this thread need to get laid. > Just sayin’. I’m not going to dignify that with a response, but I will expand on what I was saying: It’s great to spread positive messages, and try to make people feel better about their lives. “The power of positive thinking” is a very popular concept, particularly in the US. But ultimately, at some point you have to see things as they are. And, very simply, if we’re going to say life is great because we get to experience joy, then by the same token you could say it’s crap because we get to experience misery. I’m not saying life is all bad; I’m trying to counter the implication that it is all good. ---
**Author:** ![Nars\_Glinley](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nars_glinley/32/8177_2.png) [@Nars\_Glinley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nars_Glinley)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2012, 12:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-we-alive/622931/63 "2012-05-26T12:43:41Z")
Or you could say that life is good because we get to experience crap too. Or you could simply say that life is. ---
**Author:** ![Mijin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mijin/32/9369_2.png) [@Mijin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mijin)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2012, 1:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-we-alive/622931/64 "2012-05-26T13:08:45Z")
> [@Nars\_Glinley](#): > > Or you could say that life is good because we get to experience crap too. > > Or you could simply say that life is. Right, and I would say the latter because the former doesn’t stand up to scrutiny. You see plenty of people who are very happy who have not yet experienced significant emotional or physical pain: they don’t feel they are lacking anything. Indeed, this is the way life has progressively gone in the developed world; far fewer of us will experience the grief of losing a child, or the pain and horror of losing a limb. So is this a bad thing? Do we need these negative experiences for our lives to be good? ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2012, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-we-alive/622931/65 "2012-05-26T20:26:23Z")
> [@Mijin](#): > > But ultimately, at some point you have to see things as they are. And, very simply, if we’re going to say life is great because we get to experience joy, then by the same token you could say it’s crap because we get to experience misery. > > I’m not saying life is all bad; I’m trying to counter the implication that it is all good. No body is saying it is all good - that would be unrealistic. However there have been studies which have shown ones attitude is not directly related to ones position in life. People who have the most miserable of circumstances can be very positive. I’m a bit manic-depressive, so I’ve seen it both ways. ---
**Author:** ![thepillar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc8723/32.png) [@thepillar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thepillar)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2012, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-we-alive/622931/66 "2012-05-27T14:23:05Z")
> [@](#): > > Wait, I’m 40, does that mean I’m 2 decades past my expiration date? And I could drop dead any second? CRAP! By a couple of decades, I wasn’t implying 2 decades, but just a few: 7 to 10 for instance. And for those who’ve managed to make it to 4 decades and beyond, what have they learnt about the meaning of life and the universe? If the answer is nothing, then it just shows that they haven’t been contemplating about it, not that life itself is meaningless. Chemistry and physics is not an answer for explaining life, it’s just a way to either run away from the question or demonstrate to others that one just doesn’t know. If my favorite team loses a game, the reason for the loss cannot be just “chemistry or physics”; if I manage to have a son or a daughter, the reason why this individual is now alive is not “chemistry or physics”. Physical sciences are but a mere medium through which life manifests, not the cause. The sciences do not huddle around a board room to decide what life form they want to create next, something(s)/entity/force/energy, obviously imperceptible to humans, is directing the course of life, just like it’s also directing the course of the planets and the universe. Physics and chemistry are the terms humans use to make sense of it all. These sciences are by their very nature limited and thus cannot explain the origin and dynamics of thought, intellect and other cognitive phenomena. Hence they fail miserably to account for the existence of intelligent sentient beings. > [@](#): > > Interesting point, that I’m only partly grasping. From nature’s POV, I can see there’s no purpose, but from an individual’s, the desire for survival and sex are instinctive. When everyone is born with those inherent drives, doesn’t that suggest a purpose behind them? The source from whence these inherent drives originate from is the main point of this thread. ---
**Author:** ![Latro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a87d85/32.png) [@Latro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Latro)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2012, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-we-alive/622931/67 "2012-05-27T15:19:09Z")
> [@thepillar](#): > > By a couple of decades, I wasn’t implying 2 decades, but just a few: 7 to 10 for instance. And for those who’ve managed to make it to 4 decades and beyond, what have they learnt about the meaning of life and the universe? If the answer is nothing, then it just shows that they haven’t been contemplating about it, not that life itself is meaningless. > Chemistry and physics is not an answer for explaining life, it’s just a way to either run away from the question or demonstrate to others that one just doesn’t know. If my favorite team loses a game, the reason for the loss cannot be just “chemistry or physics”; if I manage to have a son or a daughter, the reason why this individual is now alive is not “chemistry or physics”. Physical sciences are but a mere medium through which life manifests, not the cause. The sciences do not huddle around a board room to decide what life form they want to create next, something(s)/entity/force/energy, obviously imperceptible to humans, is directing the course of life, just like it’s also directing the course of the planets and the universe. Physics and chemistry are the terms humans use to make sense of it all. These sciences are by their very nature limited and thus cannot explain the origin and dynamics of thought, intellect and other cognitive phenomena. Hence they fail miserably to account for the existence of intelligent sentient beings. > > The source from whence these inherent drives originate from is the main point of this thread. Quite the confused little caterpillar, aren’t we? I don’t know where to begin to address this muddle. Especially since many posts here have already addressed your ‘question’. Maybe you should stop contemplating for a while and actually read them. ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2012, 6:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-we-alive/622931/68 "2012-05-28T06:41:30Z")
You find out why you were alive at the end of your life. Oh, I guess I was there to do that. So what you do is why you are here. ---
**Author:** ![Randvek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/a6a055/32.png) [@Randvek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Randvek)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2012, 7:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-we-alive/622931/69 "2012-05-28T07:05:30Z")
> [@Esox\_Lucius](#): > > Interesting point, that I’m only partly grasping. From nature’s POV, I can see there’s no purpose, but from an individual’s, the desire for survival and sex are instinctive. When everyone is born with those inherent drives, doesn’t that suggest a purpose behind them? It’s pretty easy to demonstrate that those with a desire to survive and reproduce will live longer and have more children, creating more with a desire to survive and reproduce. No, the real question is why the heck sentience and sapience exist. ---
**Author:** ![thepillar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc8723/32.png) [@thepillar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thepillar)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2012, 7:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-we-alive/622931/70 "2012-05-28T07:33:54Z")
> [@Randvek](#): > > No, the real question is why the heck sentience and sapience exist. Exactly. ---
**Author:** ![Mijin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mijin/32/9369_2.png) [@Mijin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mijin)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2012, 9:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-we-alive/622931/71 "2012-05-28T09:20:15Z")
I’m not sure that’s the real question actually; I’d much rather know what consciousness _is_ than how it came about. ---
**Author:** ![Smeghead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f1d935/32.png) [@Smeghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smeghead)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2012, 12:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-we-alive/622931/72 "2012-05-28T12:23:05Z")
I know how and why I’m here. As for all you other zombies, however… ---
**Author:** ![glee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b5a626/32.png) [@glee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/glee)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2012, 1:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-we-alive/622931/73 "2012-05-28T13:39:21Z")
> [@thepillar](#): > > … something(s)/entity/force/energy, obviously imperceptible to humans, is directing the course of life, just like it’s also directing the course of the planets and the universe… And who created this something? 😕 And who gave it the directions to follow?? :smack: ---
**Author:** ![Latro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a87d85/32.png) [@Latro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Latro)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2012, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-we-alive/622931/74 "2012-05-28T14:53:05Z")
> [@thepillar](#): > > Chemistry and physics is not an answer for explaining life, it’s just a way to either run away from the question or demonstrate to others that one just doesn’t know. Yes, yes they are. You are the one running away from the answer. Because you _want_ there to be more. > [@](#): > > If my favorite team loses a game, the reason for the loss cannot be just “chemistry or physics”; Yes, yes it is. Chemistry and physics make one team win and the other lose. You _wanting_ one to win has no influence on the forces in play. Unless maybe you cheer them harder and that has some influence on some player’s brain chemistry so he’ll try harder. > [@](#): > > if I manage to have a son or a daughter, the reason why this individual is now alive is not “chemistry or physics”. Yes, yes it is. Chemistry (and a bit of physics). > [@](#): > > Physical sciences are but a mere medium through which life manifests, not the cause. Not just ‘a mere medium’ they are _the_ medium through which we can understand life and the universe a bit better. > [@](#): > > The sciences do not huddle around a board room to decide what life form they want to create next, well, you got something right at least. > [@](#): > > something(s)/entity/force/energy, obviously imperceptible to humans, is directing the course of life, just like it’s also directing the course of the planets and the universe. Forces, yes. But nothing sentient. WE are the sentient ones, brought forth by non-sentient forces. > [@](#): > > Physics and chemistry are the terms humans use to make sense of it all. These sciences are (by their very nature) limited Indeed. Right again. > [@](#): > > and thus cannot explain the origin and dynamics of thought, intellect and other cognitive phenomena. Hence they fail miserably to account for the existence of intelligent sentient beings. Why the thus? This doen’t automatically follow from the above. They can and do explain a lot. But, yes there is still much more to learn out there. Thank heavens. ---
**Author:** ![thepillar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc8723/32.png) [@thepillar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thepillar)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2012, 6:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-we-alive/622931/75 "2012-05-29T06:35:53Z")
> [@Latro](#): > > Yes, yes they are. You are the one running away from the answer. > Because you _want_ there to be more. All posts have been taken into account. However, a response does not necessarily constitute a satisfactory and correct answer. What one deems satisfactory and correct isn’t always so for another. Asking for more simply implies lack of satisfaction from the responses. > [@](#): > > Yes, yes it is. Chemistry and physics make one team win and the other lose. > You _wanting_ one to win has no influence on the forces in play. Take the upcoming elections for instance, chemistry and physics will not determine whether the Democrats will win or lose the elections. I can assure you that your desire and subsequent vote in favor of the Democrats will definitely play more of a role in deciding the elections than the molecular configurations and reactions on Election Day. As a matter of fact, if the entire country shared your intention to actually vote for the Democrats, Obama will be reelected. Don’t really see how chemistry and physics will play any role there. > [@](#): > > WE are the sentient ones, brought forth by non-sentient forces. Begging your pardon sir/ma’am, but are you serious? One would think that sentient beings can only come from sentient forces. > [@](#): > > Why the thus? This doen’t automatically follow from the above. Due to the deficiencies of chemistry and physics, certain intangible phenomena like sentience, sapience, mind, thought etc, cannot be explained by them; nor are these intangibles a product of chemistry and physics. > [@glee](#): > > And who created this something? 😕 > And who gave it the directions to follow?? :smack: Definitely not chemistry and physics! ---
**Author:** ![Moe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moe/32/2972_2.png) [@Moe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moe)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2012, 7:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-we-alive/622931/76 "2012-05-29T07:38:19Z")
> [@thepillar](#): > > Take the upcoming elections for instance, chemistry and physics will not determine whether the Democrats will win or lose the elections. I can assure you that your desire and subsequent vote in favor of the Democrats will definitely play more of a role in deciding the elections than the molecular configurations and reactions on Election Day. As a matter of fact, if the entire country shared your intention to actually vote for the Democrats, Obama will be reelected. Don’t really see how chemistry and physics will play any role there. Interestingly enough I just saw a talk last week by someone who cited a number of studies to show how your political orientation is in fact biologically determined (to some extent). ---
**Author:** ![thepillar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc8723/32.png) [@thepillar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thepillar)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2012, 8:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-we-alive/622931/77 "2012-05-29T08:14:35Z")
> [@Moe](#): > > Interestingly enough I just saw a talk last week by someone who cited a number of studies to show how your political orientation is in fact biologically determined (to some extent). To some extent, meaning that it’s not to a great extent and is thus immaterial and not the overall determining factor. ---
**Author:** ![Latro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a87d85/32.png) [@Latro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Latro)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2012, 8:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-we-alive/622931/78 "2012-05-29T08:20:03Z")
> [@thepillar](#): > > [QUOTE=Latro] > > You are the one running away from the answer. > Because you want there to be more. Asking for more simply implies lack of satisfaction from the responses. [/quote] Your lack of satisfaction wil not alter reality. > [@thepillar](#): > > Take the upcoming elections for instance, chemistry and physics will not determine whether the Democrats will win or lose the elections. I can assure you that your **desire** and subsequent vote … (bolding mine) Desire or a thought for that matter, are not some kind of ‘magical spirits’ floating around. They are brain processes. > [@thepillar](#): > > [QUOTE=Latro] > WE are the sentient ones, brought forth by non-sentient forces. Begging your pardon sir/ma’am, but are you serious? One would think that sentient beings can only come from sentient forces. [/quote] Begging _your_ pardon. Why would one think that? > [@thepillar](#): > > Due to the deficiencies of chemistry and physics, certain intangible phenomena like sentience, sapience, mind, thought etc, cannot be explained by them; nor are these intangibles a product of chemistry and physics. As said above they are brain processes. Chemo-electrical processes in a physical organ. True, we do not yet understand _fully_ how it works _exactly_, **yet**. Though our accumulation of knowledge (aka science) on this subject is at an early stage, rough measurements of thoughts, emotions and the like can already be taken _from the brain_. Also, look at how damage to the brain, or just a simple **chemical** inbalance can alter emotions, thoughts, behaviour. ---
**Author:** ![ruh-roh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@ruh-roh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ruh-roh)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2012, 1:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-we-alive/622931/79 "2012-05-29T13:55:41Z")
> [@glee](#): > > And who created this something? 😕 > And who gave it the directions to follow?? :smack: “It’s turtles all the way down” ---
**Author:** ![cheetah777](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/90db22/32.png) [@cheetah777](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cheetah777)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2012, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-we-alive/622931/80 "2012-05-29T15:21:54Z")
> [@Esox\_Lucius](#): > > All seriousness aside, we’re born into a meaningless existence in an uncaring universe and then we die, without having any say in either. The time in between is what matters, and it’s up to each of us ourselves to determine what “the point” of it is. It could be to raise a family, or build a giant chain of megastores, or become a drug addict. It’s a combination of whatever your heart desires and whatever is within your capabilities. > […] Ridiculous. I don’t believe in nihilists. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-we-alive/622931.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-we-alive/622931.md?page=5)