# Why aren't TV/Movie musicals made anymore? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [July 1, 2008, 2:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-arent-tv-movie-musicals-made-anymore/454852 "2008-07-01T02:40:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2008, 2:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-arent-tv-movie-musicals-made-anymore/454852/21 "2008-07-01T14:13:36Z")
[QUOTE=Marley23] That’s an interesting point that I’d never considered. While I’m not a fan of musicals in general, for your “unrealistic” I’d substitute something like “hopelessly corny.” Popular tastes have gotten more ironic, and that doesn’t favor musicals. [/QUOTE] Eh…the old-style musicals were unrealistic, too, though. Crowd of strangers suddenly bursting into song and dancing step-perfect together, for one thing. _Chicago_ took care of this by making all the musical numbers that didn’t occur onstage to be in the main character’s head. But then, this was done in the latter part of the movie musical heyday as well. Fosse did it in _Cabaret_…all the musical numbers occurred either onstage or as records playing (or the beergarden scene, which was logically explainable). ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2008, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-arent-tv-movie-musicals-made-anymore/454852/22 "2008-07-01T14:28:47Z")
[QUOTE=WhyNot] You mean, like _Mama Mia_? Or _Enchanted_? Or _Hairspray_? Or _Sweeney Todd_? Or _Chicago_? Or _Across the Universe_? Or _Rent_? Or\* Moulin Rouge!\*? Or _Once_? Jeez, I dunno…why? 😃 [/QUOTE] A better question would be, why aren’t **Broadway** musicals made any more? I mean, something like _Rent_ or _Cats_ or _Les Miserables_ – I can’t put my finger on it, but it just seems to be something **fundamentally different** from _Oklahoma_ or _Guys and Dolls._ Not worse, just different – so different it probably requires a different genre-name. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2008, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-arent-tv-movie-musicals-made-anymore/454852/23 "2008-07-01T14:56:49Z")
[QUOTE=jayjay] Eh…the old-style musicals were unrealistic, too, though. Crowd of strangers suddenly bursting into song and dancing step-perfect together, for one thing. [/QUOTE] Right. Musicals were always unrealistic, but people used to have an easier time with the conceit. The way people look at them has changed: audiences want something that looks truer to life, and satire of classic musicals has brought things to the point where you can’t watch somebody start to sing in a musical without a sort of involuntary chuckle. (At least, if you’re me.) Hardcore Broadway musical fans have a different experience, I guess, but as noted, musicals are a genre now and not mainstream the way they once were. I believe they were considered the pinnacle of Broadway class and entertainment decades ago. But jukebox musicals and movie adaptations are seen as lowest-common-denominator stuff. ---
**Author:** ![vetbridge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b5e925/32.png) [@vetbridge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vetbridge)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2008, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-arent-tv-movie-musicals-made-anymore/454852/24 "2008-07-01T15:19:53Z")
[QUOTE=WhyNot] You mean, like _Mama Mia_? Or _Enchanted_? Or _Hairspray_? Or _Sweeney Todd_? Or _Chicago_? Or _Across the Universe_? Or _Rent_? Or\* Moulin Rouge!\*? Or _Once_? Jeez, I dunno…why? 😃 [/QUOTE] Gotta mention (although I may be the only fan) [Romance & Cigarettes](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=473127)😉 ---
**Author:** ![ArizonaTeach](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/45deac/32.png) [@ArizonaTeach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ArizonaTeach)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2008, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-arent-tv-movie-musicals-made-anymore/454852/25 "2008-07-01T15:31:41Z")
Just a few years back, there was a TV version of [The Music Man](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0293437/) with Matthew Broderick and Kristen Chenowith. ---
**Author:** ![gaffa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e68b1a/32.png) [@gaffa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gaffa)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2008, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-arent-tv-movie-musicals-made-anymore/454852/26 "2008-07-01T15:43:45Z")
I’m a straight guy who loves musicals. They aren’t making enough of them these days, so I get my fix with Bollywood films. Pretty much every mainstream Indian film is a musical. I wish the theaters near me would show them, as it is I have to make special plans to get out to the single theater in the far suburbs that schedules them. ---
**Author:** ![WhyNot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c77e96/32.png) [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2008, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-arent-tv-movie-musicals-made-anymore/454852/27 "2008-07-01T16:10:25Z")
[QUOTE=vetbridge] Gotta mention (although I may be the only fan) [Romance & Cigarettes](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=473127)😉 [/QUOTE] > [@](#): > > I searched and found no threads on this movie. Has anyone seen it? Written and directed by John Turturro, and produced by the Coens. It stars James Gandolfini, Susan Sarandon, Kate Winslet, and Steve Buscemi. It also has Christopher Walken, Eddie Izzard, and Amy Sedaris. > > Wow. > > Oh, and it is a musical. Holy $#!\*! How did I miss this one?! :eek: I must see it! ---
**Author:** ![vetbridge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b5e925/32.png) [@vetbridge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vetbridge)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2008, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-arent-tv-movie-musicals-made-anymore/454852/28 "2008-07-01T16:19:49Z")
[QUOTE=WhyNot] Holy $#!\*! How did I miss this one?! :eek: I must see it! [/QUOTE] Take my word. You will either really love the movie (like me), or you will not be able to sit through it. Hope you enjoy it!!! ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2008, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-arent-tv-movie-musicals-made-anymore/454852/29 "2008-07-01T16:35:21Z")
[QUOTE=vetbridge] Gotta mention (although I may be the only fan) [Romance & Cigarettes](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=473127)😉 [/QUOTE] Ah, thanks… I’d seen a clip of [Walken’s DELILAH number](http://youtube.com/watch?v=sEH5zmAtLks&feature=related) but thought it was a music video. If that scene’s indicative of the movie I’ve GOT to see it. (For those who want to get straight to the music, skip to 1:35 of that video.) ---
**Author:** ![vetbridge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b5e925/32.png) [@vetbridge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vetbridge)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2008, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-arent-tv-movie-musicals-made-anymore/454852/30 "2008-07-01T16:44:23Z")
[QUOTE=Sampiro] If that scene’s indicative of the movie I’ve GOT to see it. [/QUOTE] You’ve gotta see it. James Gandolfino taking the trash to the curb and breaking out in song (“A Man without Love”), then joined by the garbagemen dancing with their cans. . . ---
**Author:** ![cbawlmer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/71e660/32.png) [@cbawlmer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cbawlmer)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2008, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-arent-tv-movie-musicals-made-anymore/454852/31 "2008-07-01T19:14:53Z")
[QUOTE=Sampiro] had a student ask me today if some character or other in it was gay [I’ve no idea the character but I’m assuming Zac Efron’s] [/QUOTE] The brother of the blond girl (Sharpay?) is pretty clearly supposed to be gay. They never state it explicitly, but it was obvious to me when I saw it. ---
**Author:** ![MovieMogul](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f08c70/32.png) [@MovieMogul](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MovieMogul)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2008, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-arent-tv-movie-musicals-made-anymore/454852/32 "2008-07-01T19:32:29Z")
One other thing: movie musicals used to be the preferred crossover medium for popular artists (singers) to find a more widespread audience. Musicals would either be written for or around them, or they would take Broadway shows (which they often starred in originally on stage) and translate them to the big screen. This was also true for exceptionally talented dancers who had singing ability as well. With the advent of television in general and MTV in particular, recording artists now have that same access to a larger audience but through a more manageable (and less expensive) short form of movie musical–the music video. Sure, some music artists still want to expand their brand, visibility, and industry cred through film, but most are content with highlighting their singing and dancing talents on the small screen. ---
**Author:** ![AlmondJoy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/35a633/32.png) [@AlmondJoy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlmondJoy)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2008, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-arent-tv-movie-musicals-made-anymore/454852/33 "2008-07-01T20:58:14Z")
somewhat on topic but I read a really good review of Mama Mia in variety- I can’t wait! ---
**Author:** ![Governor\_Quinn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/d26b3c/32.png) [@Governor\_Quinn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Governor_Quinn)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2008, 2:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-arent-tv-movie-musicals-made-anymore/454852/34 "2008-07-02T02:07:20Z")
[QUOTE=mobo85] That would be another category entirely- musicals based on movies or TV shows…which is probably another trend Disney started with _The Lion King_. [/QUOTE] I can think of adaptations of films for use as Broadway musicals as early as the 1950s. I’d like to make a two-point argument: 1. The decline of the movie musical first is apparent in the mid-1950s, when the movie studios begin to shut down their in-house departments that made original movie musicals, and, instead, shifted to focusing more on adaptations of stage hits. 2. The shift noted in 1) started to become a big problem in the late 1960s. Most of the pre-1965 Broadway hits that could be filmed had been or would soon be, there weren’t as many new shows that were both hits and which could be filmed (I only count thirty or so book musicals between 1965 and 1980 that were financial successes, and close to half of these have not been filmed), and changes to the film industry made the resurrection to the in-house departments of the past implausible. As for television musicals, the original television musical was tied to a type of program (the “spectacular”) that peaked in the early years of the medium. Once that declined (the last concerted efforts that I can think of to keep it afloat were by ABC in prime time around 1967 and in late night in the early 1970s), so did the television musical. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2008, 2:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-arent-tv-movie-musicals-made-anymore/454852/35 "2008-07-02T02:14:34Z")
There’s also _De-Lovely_, which features many Cole Porter tunes and, mixed in there somewhere, a thoroughly inaccurate biography of Cole Porter. ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2008, 2:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-arent-tv-movie-musicals-made-anymore/454852/36 "2008-07-02T02:40:53Z")
[QUOTE=Bryan Ekers] There’s also _De-Lovely_, which features many Cole Porter tunes and, mixed in there somewhere, a thoroughly inaccurate biography of Cole Porter. [/QUOTE] I don’t know much about Porter (the main thing I know about his life that’s different from the movie is that the real Porter, ironically, couldn’t sing worth a damn), but it’s got to be leagues better than [Night & Day](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0038776/). Casting Cary Grant as Cole Porter would be about like casting Patrick Stewart in “The Don Rickles Story”. That said, I really like the soundtrack to _De-Lovely_. The movie not so much- the whole bit with Jonathan Pryce as an angel (or some other worldly being) guiding the flashbacks was a bit too contrived (though Kline’s aging makeup was good). ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2008, 3:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-arent-tv-movie-musicals-made-anymore/454852/37 "2008-07-02T03:26:21Z")
[QUOTE=Sampiro] I don’t know much about Porter (the main thing I know about his life that’s different from the movie is that the real Porter, ironically, couldn’t sing worth a damn), but it’s got to be leagues better than [Night & Day](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0038776/). Casting Cary Grant as Cole Porter would be about like casting Patrick Stewart in “The Don Rickles Story”. [/QUOTE] Well, the OP was asking (more or less) about recent TV/movie musicals. I can understand _Night and Day_ pretending Porter wasn’t gay, but I found _De-Lovely_ treating him as gay but also being emotionally tortured about it because it hurts Linda Lee Thomas’s feelings, since she’s his _true_ love, to be kinda… worse. I’d like to see another biopic that is more casual about it - Porter’s gay, his relationship with Thomas is mostly a business arrangement, he writes good music, done. _De-Lovely_ seemed more about catering to the stereotypical female fantasy about rescuing a cultured man from his gayness. I skipped the dialogue and just listened to the songs, including [the duet between Porter (Kevin Kline) and “Jack” (John Barrowman)](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=if1kUoDWt9w) which I used to learn the lyrics to _Night and Day_ (the song) which I then performed at a military Christmas party, to some appreciation. ---
**Author:** ![si\_blakely](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d9b06d/32.png) [@si\_blakely](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/si_blakely)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2008, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-arent-tv-movie-musicals-made-anymore/454852/38 "2008-07-02T14:28:01Z")
What intrigues me is the fact that many of the new musicals feed on a sense of nostalgia by using familiar music _Mamma Mia_ - ABBA _We Will Rock You_ - Queen and a whole bunch of others, many of which have (deservedly) failed - the Cliff Richard one, for example. At least AvenueQ has original material - **The Internet is for Porn** is classic. Oh, and I liked the _LOTR_ musical, in spite of reservations. Not as great as _Les Mis_, but pretty darn good. Si ---
**Author:** ![FriarTed](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/friarted/32/1052_2.png) [@FriarTed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FriarTed)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2008, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-arent-tv-movie-musicals-made-anymore/454852/39 "2008-07-02T14:34:51Z")
[QUOTE=cbawlmer] The brother of the blond girl (Sharpay?) is pretty clearly supposed to be gay. They never state it explicitly, but it was obvious to me when I saw it. [/QUOTE] Before I knew he was her brother & I saw the group pictured darn near everywhere, I thought- “There’s the black couple, the brunette couple, & the blond glamour queen & her gay friend.” ---
**Author:** ![rjk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ed655f/32.png) [@rjk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjk)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2008, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-arent-tv-movie-musicals-made-anymore/454852/40 "2008-07-02T14:48:20Z")
Of course I have to link to a recent musical that was a great hit: > **[Food Court Musical - Improv Everywhere](https://improveverywhere.com/2008/03/09/food-court-musical/)** > > We staged a spontaneous musical in the food court of a Los Angeles shopping mall. More [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-arent-tv-movie-musicals-made-anymore/454852.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-arent-tv-movie-musicals-made-anymore/454852.md?page=3)