# Why can't Biden get more traction from the economy? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [May 18, 2024, 1:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736 "2024-05-18T13:12:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 19
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2024, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/404 "2024-05-24T19:30:46Z")
> [@survinga](#): > > I’m not sure how Biden can change this narrative. My advice to him is to first and foremost **make the election about Donald Trump and the radicalism of MAGA**. That’s his best chance . Exactly. I’m sure few agree … but it seems that, _in general_, economic concerns – _ **this one time, for this one election** _ – are red herrings distracting from what should be the massively overwhelming issue in the 2024 presidential election. Preserve the nation as an entity first – _then_ come around for the economy (personal or otherwise). Don’t worry about changing the drapes while the house is on fire. **“It’s the economy, stupid”** - James Carville, Pleistocene Era **“It’s actually _having a nation_, stu- … um, yeah”** - many resolute Biden voters ---
**Author:** ![survinga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cab0a1/32.png) [@survinga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/survinga)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2024, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/405 "2024-05-24T19:57:09Z")
> [@bordelond](#): > > Preserve the nation as an entity first – _then_ come around for the economy (personal or otherwise). Don’t worry about changing the drapes while the house is on fire. Alot of people don’t even notice that the house is on fire. They’re not as focused on “democracy” and Trump’s plans to go after political enemies and take away rights. Their focus is paycheck to paycheck. It’s just the way it is. But still, it’s something that I hope resonates with enough people to get Biden over the hump. He can attack Trump on a host of fronts: democracy, january 6, reproductive rights, economy (in some ways, not all), and even remind people of the covid nightmare. On top of that, we’ll find out next week, but Trump might be a convicted felon by November. It’s gonna be hard to win on the economy when half the country thinks we’re in a recession with record unemployment. It’s a falsehood that’s taken root in the country, and that makes Biden’s job super-hard if this election is about the economy. Unbelievable. When I started this thread, I wasn’t aware of that level of insanity in the discourse. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2024, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/406 "2024-05-24T20:30:29Z")
> [@Jophiel](#): > > And, no, I’m not saying this happened to every person. Show us it happened to _one_ person. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2024, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/407 "2024-05-24T21:04:51Z")
Show that my proclaimed “exaggerated hypothetical” of going from supermodel masseuse to dog poop collector happened to one person? Ummm… pass for what I’d hope are obvious reasons. Show you that one person out of the 168 million people in the US labor force within the last four years found work that they found less satisfying and/or paid less than their previous job? Actually, I’ll pass on that as well for completely different reasons. Which I’d hope are also obvious. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2024, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/408 "2024-05-24T21:20:08Z")
What is obvious is that it is _impossible_ for _any_ President to fix things so that no one is dissatisfied with their current job situation. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2024, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/409 "2024-05-24T21:22:05Z")
There seems to be a misunderstanding among some posters that I’m _blaming_ Biden for the situation. I’m not. I’ve said before that much of it is out of his hands. I’m merely responding to the overarching question of “How could anyone be unhappy with these macroeconomic numbers?” with something besides “Misinformation”. > [@bordelond](#): > > I’m sure few agree … but it seems that, _in general_, economic concerns – _ **this one time, for this one election** _ – are red herrings distracting from what should be the massively overwhelming issue in the 2024 presidential election. This is true. > [@survinga](#): > > Alot of people don’t even notice that the house is on fire. They’re not as focused on “democracy” and Trump’s plans to go after political enemies and take away rights. Also this. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2024, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/410 "2024-05-24T21:27:27Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > What is obvious is that it is _impossible_ for _any_ President to fix things so that no one is dissatisfied with their current job situation. Sure, and one person’s vote will never singlehandedly turn an election. But if tens of millions of people are dissatisfied with their current job situation, that _might_. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2024, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/411 "2024-05-24T21:27:53Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > But it seems that the pro-Biden side also wants Americans who **aren’t** well off to grit their teeth and say, _“My rent and groceries are 40% higher than before, I’ll never own a house and I’m sinking even further into debt, but Biden’s economy is still good nonetheless”_ and vote for Biden anyway. The Biden administration isn’t saying anything close to this, so why does it seem that way to you? Have you considered listening to what the Biden administration is actually saying, instead of what groups that are declared enemies of that administration _claim_ they are saying? Do you know what would really help Biden? People not repeating Republican talking points over and over again uncritically then asking “Why do people feel bad about the economy? What is Biden doing wrong?”. If you have a way to counter the right wing propaganda machine, that would be helpful. Denying it exists at all? Not so much. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2024, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/412 "2024-05-24T21:31:16Z")
> [@Jophiel](#): > > I’m merely responding to the overarching question of “How could anyone be unhappy with these macroeconomic numbers?” with something besides “Misinformation”. Oh. I thought the question was “why can’t Biden get more traction from the economy?” Sure, people can be unhappy with their own situation in this economy. They can also be unhappy with the economy in general, because of high housing costs, or whatever. But why doesn’t a generally _very good_ economy translate to more support for Biden? That’s the overarching question. ---
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2024, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/413 "2024-05-24T21:33:51Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > **Have you considered listening** to what the Biden administration is actually saying … … where have I heard this before? It was really recent. _([Nice Greco-Roman reversal there!](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fbd59gwCAh8))_ ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2024, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/414 "2024-05-24T21:37:07Z")
> [@Jophiel](#): > > I’m merely responding to the overarching question of “How could anyone be unhappy with these macroeconomic numbers?” with something besides “Misinformation” Way to ignore the “elephant” in the room. The misinformation is real, it is big and it is organized. Why are you deliberately evading it? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2024, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/415 "2024-05-24T21:41:55Z")
But it sounds so much better when _I_ say it. 😁 ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2024, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/416 "2024-05-24T21:42:43Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > Oh. I thought the question was “why can’t Biden get more traction from the economy?” I’d have thought they were pretty closely related to be essentially the same for this purpose but points on technicality. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2024, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/417 "2024-05-24T21:44:59Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Why are you deliberately evading it? As I’ve said numerous times now, even if you want to blame it all, 100%, on misinformation, that’s (a) not a problem you’re going to solve before November and (b) doesn’t do anything to actually sway voters who feel dissatisfied. You can either waste a lot of time railing about how mean FOX News is or you can try to convince voters that Biden has an economic plan that will benefit them in the coming term _regardless_ of why they’re not keen on the current situation. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2024, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/418 "2024-05-24T21:57:52Z")
> [@Jophiel](#): > > As I’ve said numerous times now, even if you want to blame it all, 100%, on misinformation NOBODY is blaming it _all_ on misinformation, and this misdirection is getting boring. You may not be able to “solve” the problem by November (and here we have the “solve” bugaboo, where if you can’t put forth a complete solution then it is useless to try to elevate the problem at all), but totally ignoring the problem is much worse. By the way, this “railing against FOX News” minimalism is another way to misdirect away from a a very real problem. Can you link to anyone here that claims that FOX News alone is the problem? Biden isn’t out there trying to sway votes in a political vacuum, despite your desperate efforts to make it seem so. Once again, you can tune the engine 'til the cows come home, but it won’t make a difference if you ignore the dudes pouring sugar in the gas tank. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2024, 10:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/419 "2024-05-24T22:02:00Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > NOBODY is blaming it _all_ on misinformation, and this misdirection is getting boring _Even if you wanted to do that…_ doesn’t mean you did do that, it’s remarking on the futility of the situation in the short term. “Even if you have all the money in the world” doesn’t mean you HAVE all the money in the world, it’s a phrase suggesting that even having all the money in the world won’t solve the problem. Even if the sole reason anyone wasn’t “giving Biden traction” was misinformation, it wouldn’t address the short term problem. If people are going to get all huffy about what I wrote, could you at least read it first? ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2024, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/420 "2024-05-24T22:08:47Z")
> [@Jophiel](#): > > If people are going to get all huffy about what I wrote, could you at least read it first? Because you have.spent much of this thread minimizing the misinformation component, and finally after acknowledging its existence are now pivoting to telling us it does not matter since there is nothing anytcan do about the misinformation. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2024, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/421 "2024-05-24T22:15:19Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > are now pivoting By “are now”, you mean “at least five days ago”, right? > [@Jophiel](#): > > If they came to that conclusion because a MAGA podcast told them, you still need to address it directly because you’re not going to go house to house and explain to each person “No, actually you’re really doing just ducky”. The Biden re-election campaign needs to find a way to address these kitchen table finances and how the administration will help people who feel like they’re struggling, and saying “No way, check out these macro-economic indicators” ain’t gonna do it. I’m not even going to post each time I made this same point (and the related point that you’re not going to ‘fix’ misinformation between now and November) since, again, people would rather get huffy than read. Oh, what the heck, here’s an example of the related point brought up four days ago as well: > [@Jophiel](#): > > Ok, but that’s not a problem that’ll be solved between now and November. Economic messaging to people who consider the economy to be bad HAS to be solved before November or else Biden is going to lose. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2024, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/422 "2024-05-24T22:49:13Z")
Again: How the hell do you solve it when misinformation is being put out constantly and your answer is to ignore that problem? ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2024, 10:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/423 "2024-05-24T22:50:07Z")
One thing many progressives don’t grasp is that “Feelings don’t care about your facts.” On top of that, elections aren’t won on the basis of fairness or accuracy, they’re won on the basis of **perception**. Complaining about “misinformation” is like a military complaining that its enemy is launching rockets and hitting people. Okay, but what are you going to **do** about it? Fairness is irrelevant; how are you going to counter the threat? There is no Election Referee who is floating above all this and is going to award points to whichever side had the more accurate facts. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736.md?page=18) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736.md?page=20)