# Why can't Biden get more traction from the economy? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [May 18, 2024, 1:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736 "2024-05-18T13:12:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![survinga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cab0a1/32.png) [@survinga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/survinga)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 3:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/178 "2024-05-20T03:22:27Z")
> [@Jophiel](#): > > People keep using “anecdotal” in this thread to describe these things but, for the people with these concerns, it’s not “anecdote” – it’s personal experience. Don’t get hung up on the use of the word, “anecdote”. I got blasted for saying, “So”, a while ago. Please lighten up here, folks. The point I’m making is that Biden has to talk about what he’s accomplished, and he has to listen to voters, too, who will point out areas of concern that they have. Many people, when they talk about problems in the economy will turn to anecdotes - things they have seen in their life or in people around them. It’s not an insult to say the word, “anecdote”. And FWIW, I don’t expect Biden to use that word. He’s a politician. He should be able to empathize with people that are telling him about things that worry them, whether it be about the economy, crime, democracy, world affairs, trade, corporate greed, the lack of unions, whatever it is they bring up…But he also can’t run from his record and act like the economy is in tatters. That would be a bald-faced lie if he did do that. ---
**Author:** ![Common\_Tater](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/common_tater/32/13846_2.png) [@Common\_Tater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Common_Tater)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 3:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/179 "2024-05-20T03:27:00Z")
> [@SunUp](#): > > One of the candidates wants to bring that era back. That isn’t going to happen, American manufacturing jobs, whole swaths of industries have steadily been hollowed out every decade since the 1970s. Outsource the factories overseas - and Insource the workers via illegal migration. There’s your “Bipartisan” Congress for you, eh? Who says Republicans and Democrats can’t agree on anything? When was the last time you heard a Democrat publicly complain about millions of foreigners driving down wages, foreigners taking peoples careers away? One thing that pissed off a lot of Union guys was that clip of Biden poking a finger into some Union guy’s chest exclaiming “I don’t need your vote to win!”. Jeeze Louise. Getting dyed in the wool rank and file Union guys to vote for a Republican, a _New York Republican_, that’s some bizarro world shit right there. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 3:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/180 "2024-05-20T03:27:59Z")
> [@survinga](#): > > I do think Biden needs to point out his own accomplishments, and he has to talk about what he will do to address “unfinished business”, to address concerns people have about either their own situation or the nation’s situation. I think that this, fundamentally, is it. “We’ve done a lot to rebuild our economy after 2020, and COVID. We’re creating jobs, and our economy is growing. But, I recognize that there are still issues – things that are hitting many of you in your wallets. The price of food, housing, and energy is still high, and even though wages have gone up, it hasn’t been enough to make up for that. Being able to buy your own home feels impossible for many of us. That has to change, and that _will_ change, and **here are my plans to change it.** ” It’s that last bit, in particular, that I think many people aren’t hearing from Biden. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 3:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/181 "2024-05-20T03:29:59Z")
> [@survinga](#): > > Don’t get hung up on the use of the word, “anecdote” Wasn’t really directed at you; I’ve seen it used multiple times. I do think it adds to the antagonistic tone of the thread towards people who say things aren’t great, especially when contrasted with the “Look at our _data_” comments. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 3:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/182 "2024-05-20T03:42:25Z")
> [@survinga](#): > > 1. Inflation tamed, with underlying multi-variate core inflation currently at 2.6% - > > [Multivariate Core Trend Inflation - FEDERAL RESERVE BANK of NEW YORK](https://www.newyorkfed.org/research/policy/mct#--:mct-inflation:trend-inflation) Inflation may be under control, but that doesn’t mean that prices have actually gone down. People see their salaries/wages go up once a year at review time, and meanwhile they’ve seen pretty much everything else go up significantly in price in the past few years. I mean, back pre-pandemic, a family of four going out to dinner might be 70-80 bucks at a moderately priced sit-down place. Now the same dinner is upwards of $100. Or a 12-pack of soda used to be something like 4-5 dollars at most and were often on sale for a lot less. Now they’re close to $10 list-price, and on sale for 4-5 bucks. People see this, and they either haven’t got a commensurate raise, or they’re not really putting two and two together- they just see that everything’s more expensive, and most of the price raises are in Biden’s term. It’s not entirely logical, but it’s the way people see it. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 3:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/183 "2024-05-20T03:45:21Z")
> [@bump](#): > > Inflation may be under control, but that doesn’t mean that prices have actually gone down. Right. They just aren’t (on the whole) rising as rapidly as they have. We’re still faced with current prices that are the result of several years of high inflation, and with wages that, for many people, haven’t kept pace. Prices going down, on a broad scale, is _deflation_, and that’s generally seen as a sign of a very weak economy (though most Americans would be thrilled, in the immediate term, if prices of food, gasoline, and rent went down right now). ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 3:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/184 "2024-05-20T03:49:17Z")
The real answer is raising wages to compensate, but I think that’s maybe a bit of a hard sell for a lot of employers right now. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 3:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/185 "2024-05-20T03:53:10Z")
> [@bump](#): > > they’re not really putting two and two together- they just see that everything’s more expensive, and most of the price raises are in Biden’s term. It’s not entirely logical, but it’s the way people see it. This sums up part of the problem. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 4:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/186 "2024-05-20T04:00:11Z")
Well yeah, but like @kenobi_65 and I have pointed out, even though the rate has leveled out to something fairly normal, that doesn’t negate the fact that prices are considerably higher than they were several years ago, and even if wages have sort of kept pace, that doesn’t _feel_ very good. I mean, if inflation was 5% and you got a 6% raise, that doesn’t _feel_ like a 6% raise, it feels like a 1% raise when you’re looking at your purchasing power. That’s what people are facing right now- they don’t necessarily care about inflation rates; they care about how much money they bring in versus what they can buy with it. And for most, I think that isn’t quite equal just yet, or doesn’t actually feel that way to most people. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 4:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/187 "2024-05-20T04:12:43Z")
To bring it back to the OP, inflation has been brought under control. In quite a short time, very successfully. I know that does not mean that prices will go down, but it is still A Good Thing. How can the public be informed of this good news (we are not faced with FUTURE price increases), in the face of the firehose of misinformation they are receiving? ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 4:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/188 "2024-05-20T04:17:31Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > I know that does not mean that prices will go down, but it is still A Good Thing. > > How can the public be informed of this good news (we are not faced with FUTURE price increases), in the face of the firehose of misinformation they are receiving? Yes, that’s good news, but you do understand that a message of “it’s not going to get any worse” doesn’t help a whole lot when many people feel that nothing’s been done to address how much harder paying the bills has gotten over the past couple of years? ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 4:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/189 "2024-05-20T04:22:22Z")
Yes, absolutely. “We fixed the colossal fuckups of Trump and weathered the Covid crisis’ economically better than most” Is not a catchy election slogan. Neither is “ you are not as boned as those jerks say you are” But there must be some way to communicate this to voters who are thinking with their feelings rather than their heads. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 4:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/190 "2024-05-20T04:26:40Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > But there must be some way to communicate this to voters who are thinking with their feelings rather than their heads. Speaking as a longtime ad guy: there may not be. Most people will tell you that they think about things rationally, and that they make well-reasoned, fact-based decisions. In my experience, it’s typically post-hoc rationalization that’s done to justify making a decision based on their gut and their emotions. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 5:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/191 "2024-05-20T05:23:05Z")
I fear you are absolutely correct. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 9:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/192 "2024-05-20T09:07:53Z")
> [@kenobi\_65](#): > > Speaking as a longtime ad guy: there may not be. Most people will tell you that they think about things rationally, and that they make well-reasoned, fact-based decisions. In my experience, it’s typically post-hoc rationalization that’s done to justify making a decision based on their gut and their emotions. As a longtime ad guy, what would you do if a client asked about crafting a campaign meant to appeal to (a) those who think about things rationally and make well-reasoned fact-based decisions — and then asked you about crafting one meant to appeal to, as it were, (b) gut and emotions, such that the audience can readily brew up post-hoc rationalizations? ---
**Author:** ![nightshadea](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/7ba0ec/32.png) [@nightshadea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nightshadea)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 10:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/194 "2024-05-20T10:55:48Z")
Because in a lot of places, gas isn’t as cheap as it used to be … if he could get gas back down to 3 bucks and under theyd throw babies up in the air and proclaim him the best evah it’s also why the clip of Trump saying his first order will be to " drill baby drill and screw the environment" got so much traction a few months ago ---
**Author:** ![Common\_Tater](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/common_tater/32/13846_2.png) [@Common\_Tater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Common_Tater)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 11:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/196 "2024-05-20T11:45:03Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > How can the public be informed of this good news (we are not faced with FUTURE price increases), I’d not take that bet. Government types in DC like to solve their problems with Ye Olde Cannon of government confetti-buck spending. Monetary inflation is most definitely one problem more “printing” won’t solve, (although predictably a few of the lower of the low frequency clowns in DC have actually suggested this) but generally they can’t help themselves. It’s always been this way, politically and historically speaking, debasing the currency is the only way they keep their heads. ---
**Author:** ![survinga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cab0a1/32.png) [@survinga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/survinga)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 12:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/197 "2024-05-20T12:10:06Z")
> [@bump](#): > > People see this, and they either haven’t got a commensurate raise, or they’re not really putting two and two together- they just see that everything’s more expensive, and most of the price raises are in Biden’s term. It’s not entirely logical, but it’s the way people see it. OK, but wages have kept up with inflation & surpassed in macro-terms. I posted this in post #1, and I’ll post it again. Real wages have grown during the Biden era, and they’ve actually grown the strongest at lower & middle quintiles. See the link: [https://x.com/arindube/status/1755568054501609646](https://x.com/arindube/status/1755568054501609646) Now, I realize this hasn’t helped **everyone** , as has been discussed ad nauseum in this thread. But I do think Biden should take credit for this, unless he wants to pretend he’s accomplished nothing. ---
**Author:** ![survinga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cab0a1/32.png) [@survinga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/survinga)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 12:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/198 "2024-05-20T12:19:52Z")
> [@kenobi\_65](#): > > Yes, that’s good news, but you do understand that a message of “it’s not going to get any worse” doesn’t help a whole lot when many people feel that nothing’s been done to address how much harder paying the bills has gotten over the past couple of years? > [@kenobi\_65](#): > > Speaking as a longtime ad guy: there may not be. Most people will tell you that they think about things rationally, and that they make well-reasoned, fact-based decisions. In my experience, it’s typically post-hoc rationalization that’s done to justify making a decision based on their gut and their emotions. I think Biden can point to the IRA law that was passed in 2022 that will help lower prescription costs for Medicare and help with things like Insulin. Also, in that act, he beefed up subsidies for the ACA, which lowered costs for millions buying health insurance on the exchange. He can also point out that we’re producing more oil & gas than any country ever, which although it won’t have a huge effect, will lower gas prices on otherwise global market and make us a net exporter or oil/gas. He can also point out that he’s forgiven student debt for millions. Finally, he can of course point out that under his administration, lower & middle class wages have compressed some and made real wage gains…all of this, while he hopefully pivots to how he supports female reproductive rights, which is something his opponent does not support. I just think Biden needs to lean into his actual record. There’s an awful lot of good there, and he shouldn’t surrender on his own economic accomplishments. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 12:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736/199 "2024-05-20T12:25:42Z")
The _rate_ has gone down. That’s not very important to someone looking at that grocery cart that costs 1.5x what it used to, but their salary is just 1.6x what it used to be. To them, that inflationary price raise ate all the raise money they would have otherwise had. Which makes them angry I suspect, and when they go looking for someone to blame, the President (whoever is in office, of course) is the prime lightning rod for this sort of thinking. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736.md?page=8) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-cant-biden-get-more-traction-from-the-economy/1001736.md?page=10)