# Why co-conspirator? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [September 8, 2016, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-co-conspirator/765307 "2016-09-08T00:15:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![california\_jobcase](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9d8465/32.png) [@california\_jobcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/california_jobcase)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2016, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-co-conspirator/765307/1 "2016-09-08T00:15:55Z")
The online Macmillan dictionary defines conspirator as “someone who secretly makes a plan with another person or group to do something bad or illegal, especially in politics.” Merriam-Webster defines a conspirator as “a person who is involved in a secret plan to do something harmful or illegal : a person who is involved in a conspiracy.” Conspiracy is defined as “a secret plan by a group of people to do something bad or illegal, especially in politics.” Why, then, do lawyers speak of co-conspirators? Isn’t the “co-” unnecessary? ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2016, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-co-conspirator/765307/2 "2016-09-08T00:37:13Z")
Yes and no. Suppose we’re talking about Bob and Frank. Bob and Frank are conspirators. If you have Bob on the stand and you’re talking about him, he’s a conspirator. If you also want to talk about Frank, you can refer to him as Bob’s co-conspirator, to indicate that he is the specific person (or one of the people) Bob conspired with. Referring to Bob directly as a co-conspirator is redundant, since he didn’t conspire with himself. ---
**Author:** ![GiantRat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@GiantRat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GiantRat)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2016, 4:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-co-conspirator/765307/3 "2016-09-08T04:04:42Z")
I can’t resist referencing Bob Dylan’s “Joey.” “They got him on conspiracy / they were never sure who with.” When I worked in Federal law enforcement, darn near every charge started with “conspiracy to.” You can’t move drugs around the world alone… ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2016, 6:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-co-conspirator/765307/4 "2016-09-08T06:18:45Z")
> [@Ethilrist](#): > > Yes and no. Suppose we’re talking about Bob and Frank. Bob and Frank are conspirators. If you have Bob on the stand and you’re talking about him, he’s a conspirator. If you also want to talk about Frank, you can refer to him as Bob’s co-conspirator, to indicate that he is the specific person (or one of the people) Bob conspired with. Referring to Bob directly as a co-conspirator is redundant, since he didn’t conspire with himself. Similar usage to co-defendant, presumably. So the fact that co-conspirator is a double “co” is somewhat incidental. The first co- indicates shared status relative a person directly under discussion. ---
**Author:** ![california\_jobcase](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9d8465/32.png) [@california\_jobcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/california_jobcase)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2016, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-co-conspirator/765307/5 "2016-09-08T17:37:23Z")
But if two people plan mischief together, they are conspirators. I usually read phrasing such as “Bill and Ted are being charged as co-conspirators”. Why wouldn’t conspirators do the job here? ---
**Author:** ![Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hilarity_n.suze/32/6223_2.png) [@Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hilarity_N.Suze)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2016, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-co-conspirator/765307/6 "2016-09-08T18:41:01Z")
Oh my god. I had never thought about this before. Now it’s going to become my next “flammable/inflammable.” And it will enter my mind every time I go to the ATM machine and enter my PIN number. This is good; inflammable/flammable has been stuck there for years, replaced only fitfully by “thaw/unthaw” (and yes, I know “unthaw” is not widely used). ---
**Author:** ![Tired\_and\_Cranky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a87d85/32.png) [@Tired\_and\_Cranky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tired_and_Cranky)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2016, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-co-conspirator/765307/7 "2016-09-08T19:02:54Z")
My usage dictionary notes that “co-conspirator” is shorter than saying “fellow conspirator,” which would otherwise fit the bill. Anyone involved in any of a number of different conspiracies could be described as a “conspirator.” They are only “co-conspirators” if they are engaged in the same conspiracy. “Co-conspirator” helps to remove any ambiguity about whether they were conspiring with one another. It’s probably unnecessary in most contexts because there is only one conspiracy at issue but in some cases, it might be clearer. ---
**Author:** ![Tired\_and\_Cranky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a87d85/32.png) [@Tired\_and\_Cranky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tired_and_Cranky)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2016, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-co-conspirator/765307/8 "2016-09-08T19:07:03Z")
> [@california\_jobcase](#): > > But if two people plan mischief together, they are conspirators. I usually read phrasing such as “Bill and Ted are being charged as co-conspirators”. Why wouldn’t conspirators do the job here? If you read only that “Bill and Ted are being charged as conspirators,” the sentence might indicate that Bill is being charged with conspiracy to import drugs while Ted is being charged with a different conspiracy to sell guns. You couldn’t tell. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2016, 8:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-co-conspirator/765307/9 "2016-09-08T20:09:05Z")
> [@california\_jobcase](#): > > But if two people plan mischief together, they are conspirators. I usually read phrasing such as “Bill and Ted are being charged as co-conspirators”. Why wouldn’t conspirators do the job here? > [@Hilarity\_N.Suze](#): > > Oh my god. I had never thought about this before. Now it’s going to become my next “flammable/inflammable.” And it will enter my mind every time I go to the ATM machine and enter my PIN number. You two need to read Ethilrist’s comment more carefully, it was a perfect explanation. Bill and Ted conspired to commit a crime. What is Ted’s relationship to Bill? Is Ted “Bill’s conspirator”? Clearly not, that doesn’t make sense. Ted is Bill’s co-conspirator. The slight oddness arises only because “conspirator” already happens to begin with co-. Consider the parallel “defendant”. Bill and Ted are being tried together, they are both defendants in the same trial. Is Ted “Bill’s defendant”? Clearly not. Ted is Bill’s co-defendant. The initial co- is certainly not always redundant. ---
**Author:** ![mixdenny](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mixdenny/32/2962_2.png) [@mixdenny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mixdenny)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2016, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-co-conspirator/765307/10 "2016-09-09T00:09:11Z")
In seventh grade the teacher turned around just as I threw a wad of paper back to the guy who hit me with it. She called out, “Dennis, you and your cohort can step out into the hall”. I had no idea what a cohort was, and heard it as “cold horse” anyway. The perp just sat there and I went out into the hall alone, to receive a whacking. Two whacks by the dreaded gym teacher. Don’t try to lay no co-conspiracy on the king of cohortese. Dennis ---
**Author:** ![Cartoonacy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/848f3c/32.png) [@Cartoonacy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cartoonacy)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2016, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-co-conspirator/765307/11 "2016-09-09T18:36:17Z")
This brings to mind a “news” story that was[trending on Bing](https://www.bing.com/search?q=Grease+fan+theory&filters=tnTID%3a%22B06F81A0-1BA5-4fc0-80B8-1CC1701501C6%22+tnVersion%3a%221590451%22+segment%3a%22popularnow.carousel%22+tnCol%3a%220%22+tnOrder%3a%22ebd44bf5-0be0-4597-b528-9e443d27e46b%22&FORM=HPNN01) this morning. It seems that a fan of the movie _Grease_ has been spreading the idea that Sandy drowned at the start of the movie, and the whole story took place in her mind during her last moments of life. (Apparently this fan feels the need for an explanation of why the car was flying at the end of the film.) Why this is considered news, I don’t know. I guess it’s a slow day. But I’m even more confused as to why there are headlines calling this a “conspiracy theory.” Who are the conspirators? ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2016, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-co-conspirator/765307/12 "2016-09-09T19:52:30Z")
> [@california\_jobcase](#): > > The online Macmillan dictionary defines conspirator as “someone who secretly makes a plan with another person or group to do something bad or illegal, especially in politics.” Merriam-Webster defines a conspirator as “a person who is involved in a secret plan to do something harmful or illegal : a person who is involved in a conspiracy.” Conspiracy is defined as “a secret plan by a group of people to do something bad or illegal, especially in politics.” > > Why, then, do lawyers speak of co-conspirators? Isn’t the “co-” unnecessary? I used to rant about this and finally gave up. How is it not redundant to stick 2 prefixes meaning ‘with’ on the front of a word? But in reality, the word wouldn’t have arisen and stuck around if it were completely useless. That’s just how language evolves, man. ---
**Author:** ![AskNott](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asknott/32/5790_2.png) [@AskNott](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AskNott)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2016, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-co-conspirator/765307/13 "2016-09-09T22:46:33Z")
I remember learning after the trial of the Chicago Seven that conspiracy (often? sometimes?) carries a bigger penalty than the crime conspired to itself. That seems crazy to me. Of course, if two people co-operated to smuggle a big load of chocolate powder, they’d be cocoa co-conspirators. ---
**Author:** ![california\_jobcase](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9d8465/32.png) [@california\_jobcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/california_jobcase)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2016, 12:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-co-conspirator/765307/14 "2016-09-10T00:01:38Z")
> [@HMS\_Irruncible](#): > > I used to rant about this and finally gave up. How is it not redundant to stick 2 prefixes meaning ‘with’ on the front of a word? But in reality, the word wouldn’t have arisen and stuck around if it were completely useless. That’s just how language evolves, man. Oh, well. Maybe we can get people to stop saying pre-planning and pre-drilling instead. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2016, 12:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-co-conspirator/765307/15 "2016-09-10T00:34:22Z")
> [@HMS\_Irruncible](#): > > I used to rant about this and finally gave up. How is it not redundant to stick 2 prefixes meaning ‘with’ on the front of a word? But in reality, the word wouldn’t have arisen and stuck around if it were completely useless. That’s just how language evolves, man. Posts #2 and #9 explain quite clearly why it’s not redundant in some contexts. And I guess the OP is also going to continue to ignore those posts? More fun to rant, I guess. ---
**Author:** ![california\_jobcase](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9d8465/32.png) [@california\_jobcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/california_jobcase)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2016, 12:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-co-conspirator/765307/16 "2016-09-10T00:52:27Z")
As to post 2 and 9, I still don’t see why “Ted and Bill are conspirators in the crime” is any less descriptive or correct than co-conspirators. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2016, 1:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-co-conspirator/765307/17 "2016-09-10T01:14:19Z")
> [@california\_jobcase](#): > > As to post 2 and 9, I still don’t see why “Ted and Bill are conspirators in the crime” is any less descriptive or correct than co-conspirators. That’s not what the posts say. Can you refer to Ted as “Bill’s conspirator”? No, because that doesn’t make sense. But if you want to persist in ignoring that because it dilutes your claim of redundancy, feel free.