# Why Crappy Actors in a few of John Wayne's Movies? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [March 26, 2001, 4:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-crappy-actors-in-a-few-of-john-waynes-movies/59491 "2001-03-26T04:07:59Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 10\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![SpyderA48](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/35a633/32.png) [@SpyderA48](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SpyderA48)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2001, 4:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-crappy-actors-in-a-few-of-john-waynes-movies/59491/1 "2001-03-26T04:07:59Z")
Remember John Wayne? Consummate actor, maker of many films? _The_ national movie hero in WW2. How come, in several of his films, he used actors in primary roles that could not act? Rio Lobo: The Confederate (Spanish) Captain and the lead lady (Shasta) of the film acted like they were reading their lines for a 6th grade play. The contrast from his normal films was so dramatic that it was stunning. Always, in every one of his films, his costars were experienced actors and actresses. These two were not, nor did they ever appear in any films afterwards. Now, in Big Jake, he poked in his son, who was not a good actor when it came to presentation, but he appeared in one or two other films before apparently deciding that he wasn’t real good. So that one is understandable, but the second actor, who portrayed his second son (movie son), who rode the motorcycle in the scenes, was again a change in his style, because the kid was a poor actor and also never showed up in films again. The same with the kid who played his young grandson. Not remarkable talent for the quality of Wayne’s regular films and he had other big name actors in it, like Maurine O’Hara and several well known cowboy leads. Anyone know why this was? Out of all of the Duke’s films, those two stand out for having crappy actors. So, it could not have been because of low budget, but, then, Wayne never had to play in low budget flicks. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2001, 4:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-crappy-actors-in-a-few-of-john-waynes-movies/59491/2 "2001-03-26T04:38:18Z")
[hijack] > [@](#): > > Wayne never had to play in low budget flicks. Ever see any of the **Three Mesquiteers** flicks? [/hijack] ---
**Author:** ![samclem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a9a28c/32.png) [@samclem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/samclem)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2001, 4:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-crappy-actors-in-a-few-of-john-waynes-movies/59491/3 "2001-03-26T04:49:08Z")
In Rio Lobo, Jennifer O’Neill was probably hired because she was a hot model-turned actress. She played the lead in _Summer of '42_ the next year, which made her kinda a star at the time. Her movies went downhill gradually, and she turned to tv and still acts. So the Duke always used good actors, eh? Such as Ricky Nelson, in _Rio Bravo_? Frankie Avalon, in _the Alamo_? Constance Towers in _The Horse Soldiers_? And both of the actor you mention, appeared in quite a few movies afterward. See [IMDB](http://www.imdb.com/). ---
**Author:** ![mangeorge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d78d45/32.png) [@mangeorge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mangeorge)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2001, 5:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-crappy-actors-in-a-few-of-john-waynes-movies/59491/4 "2001-03-26T05:12:49Z")
Sorry, but I gotta ask. Who say’s John Wayne was any great shakes as an actor himself? IMO he played John Wayne in virtually every movte he made. _True grit_ and _Green Berets_, same guy. Ever watch him in an interview? Same guy. 🙂 Well, there was _Big Jake_. At least he kissed the girl in that one. 😃 Maybe I’ve given the impression that I didn’t like the man. Wrongo. I liked a lot of his movies when I was a kid. I just don’t think of him as a standout actor. Peace, mangeorge ---
**Author:** ![Sir\_Rhosis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d9b06d/32.png) [@Sir\_Rhosis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sir_Rhosis)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2001, 5:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-crappy-actors-in-a-few-of-john-waynes-movies/59491/5 "2001-03-26T05:26:31Z")
Gonna squeeze in an endorsement of mangeorge’s well-stated post before hi goes over to the opinion side of the building. Love John Wayne and most of his movies, however, he was, at best, a fair-to-occasionally good actor, with one or two damn fine performances (True Grit). His son Patrick had a fairly respectable 70s B-Movie/Disney career. And did John Wayne have control over everyone cast in his films (not including the ones he directed/produced himself)? Perhaps a say in matters, considering his status, but probably not real control. Sir ---
**Author:** ![TV\_time](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f17d59/32.png) [@TV\_time](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TV_time)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2001, 1:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-crappy-actors-in-a-few-of-john-waynes-movies/59491/6 "2001-03-26T13:25:51Z")
I think I have mentioned in a couple of other threads that in my youth I appeared in a handful of “Duke” Wayne films. While I do not consider myself an expert on either him or films in general I can respond to a couple of questions here. Wayne was a very generous man. He said he liked giving chances to newcomers and unknowns. He said one time that someone took a chance on him when he was a stunt man and put him into a leading role and he never forgot it and tried to pay back by giving others a chance. Another time, he said one time he liked singers around him. He often shot on location and late in the evening or between takes (especially in his “B” picture days) everyone would gather around and sing. He said it helped make a happy set which on long shoots was important. He said that was the reason that he hired such people as the Sons of the Pioneers, Glen Campbell, Dean Martin, Rick Nelson, Frankie Avalon, and Fabian. In addition, family was important to him. He would hire his own children to keep them close to him and give a chance to the children of fellow actors. James Mitchem (Robert Mitchem son)was the actor on the motorcycle in Big Jake. John Wayne always said that he was a “reactor” rather than an “actor” which simplified his acting style more than it should have. And often he acted a part during interviews about his films or his life. He said he knew that was what people wanted to see. But watch him when he is performing with “good” actors like Lawrence Harvey in The Alamo. Who do you see? He was, however, much more complex than that characters he often protrayed might let on. I once had a discussion with him about opera that showed him to be extremely knowledgeable on the subject. He was also extremely knowledgeable about history and art. ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2001, 1:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-crappy-actors-in-a-few-of-john-waynes-movies/59491/7 "2001-03-26T13:48:16Z")
I believe it’s **Chris** Michum (ok, so I don’t know how to spell), Bob’s son, who plays John’s son in that movie. Chris and Patrick Wayne appeared in a couple of movies together, IIRC. Suspect this is more of a IMHO topic, tho’ since quality of acting is a pretty objective thing. However, how much influence do you think John Wayne **had** on the casting in his films? Some other WAGss, could be: If I’ve spent most of my budget on hiring John, there’s not a lot left over to hire the ‘a’ list folks as support. or Since John Wayne’s (charitably put) acting stlye is of one genre, it wouldn’t do to have others ‘clash’. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2001, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-crappy-actors-in-a-few-of-john-waynes-movies/59491/8 "2001-03-26T13:54:43Z")
> [@](#): > > Who say’s John Wayne was any great shakes as an actor himself? Because he was. Don’t get confused by the fact that he often played similar characters. At his best, Wayne was great at giving subtle clues and deeper meanings into what he was saying and doing. (Acting is more than emoting, you know.) Example: In **Fort Apache** , there is a moment at the end of the movie when a newspaper reporter asks about the account of Henry Fonda’s death in the movie, about how he died a hero. Wayne knew that Fonda was foolish, almost suicidal and there is a close up of him just before he answers the question where you can see his urge to set the record straight. But Wayne stands up and says “That’s exactly how it happened,” projecting that, even though the death was unnecessary, it would have been a disservice to those who died to say so. Or how about the scene in **She Wore a Yellow Ribbon** where he writes up the formal protest to his commander’s action. He knows nothing will come of it, but you can see the respect and friendship between the two, despite it never being referred to. ---
**Author:** ![D18](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c57346/32.png) [@D18](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D18)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2001, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-crappy-actors-in-a-few-of-john-waynes-movies/59491/9 "2001-03-26T14:32:07Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by RealityChuck \* > \*\* > > > [@](#): > > > > Who say’s John Wayne was any great shakes as an actor himself? > > Because he was. \*\* How about the Shootist - particularly the line “I’m just a dying old man who’s afraid of the dark”. ---
**Author:** ![manhattan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/manhattan/32/7_2.png) [@manhattan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/manhattan)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2001, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-crappy-actors-in-a-few-of-john-waynes-movies/59491/10 "2001-03-26T16:28:37Z")
I think this one will get a better reception in IMHO. So I’ll just shoot it on over there, pardner.