# Why did English borrow so few German words? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [March 10, 2001, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-english-borrow-so-few-german-words/57461 "2001-03-10T18:20:18Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Dr\_Paprika](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr_paprika/32/3042_2.png) [@Dr\_Paprika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr_Paprika)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2001, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-english-borrow-so-few-german-words/57461/1 "2001-03-10T18:20:18Z")
English is a scavenger tongue that borrowed _boondocks_ from Filipino Tagalog and _poppycook_ from the Dutch. Many of the words are stolen from the French and anglicized, same goes fro Aboriginal place names. Why so few words borrowed from the Germans despite the sizable emigration? Was it because our salivary glands weren’t big enough? ---
**Author:** ![Rayne\_Man](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/df705f/32.png) [@Rayne\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rayne_Man)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2001, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-english-borrow-so-few-german-words/57461/2 "2001-03-10T18:35:45Z")
Could it be that English is partly of German (or Anglo Saxon) origin anyway ?. So the German words are already there. ---
**Author:** ![Dr\_Paprika](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr_paprika/32/3042_2.png) [@Dr\_Paprika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr_Paprika)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2001, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-english-borrow-so-few-german-words/57461/3 "2001-03-10T19:01:58Z")
Maybe, I don’t doubt there are similarities between Old English and Old German. But they diverged a long time ago, no? ANyway, Bill Bryson in his book _Mother Tongue_ describes this as a great linguistic puzzle, so I thought I’d throw it out. ---
**Author:** ![Evnglion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f04885/32.png) [@Evnglion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evnglion)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2001, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-english-borrow-so-few-german-words/57461/4 "2001-03-10T19:08:33Z")
I think that there are a lot more German words than we think in the roots of everyday words. There is also a much stronger Latin base than I would’ve thought. Our language is so diverse that it is hard to say something like “so few words borrowed from the Germans” because there are so many words in our crazy language. I think it is a shame that so many ARE borrowed, rather than made up or built-up on other words. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2001, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-english-borrow-so-few-german-words/57461/5 "2001-03-10T19:33:48Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Evnglion \* > \*\*I think that there are a lot more German words than we think in the roots of everyday words. There is also a much stronger Latin base than I would’ve thought. Our language is so diverse that it is hard to say something like “so few words borrowed from the Germans” because there are so many words in our crazy language. I think it is a shame that so many ARE borrowed, rather than made up or built-up on other words. \*\* I’ve said this before, and I’ll probably keep saying it, but the borrowing is what makes English such a rich language. It’s the difference between a question and an interrogation. It’s the difference between sadness and sorrow. It’s the difference between a trip, a journey, and a voyage. It’s the difference between cows and beef, deer and venison, pigs and pork, sheep and mutton. It’s the difference between guiding someone, leading someone, or conducting someone. It’s the difference between writing and scribbling. It’s the difference between forever and eternity on the one hand, and forever and infinity on the other. Did you know that there is nothing that directly corresponds to the English thesaurus in any other language? English has the largest available vocabulary in the world, even if you leave out specialized jargon. English is capable of showing the most subtle degrees of meaning based on word choice. The borrowing is what made English what it is. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2001, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-english-borrow-so-few-german-words/57461/6 "2001-03-10T20:19:52Z")
I am not sure why anyone thinks German has not contributed many words. I suspect that, as alluded to, above, many Germanic borrowings are simply seen as “native” English. In addition, many Germanic words are certainly cognate with English words so that to borrow a German _meaning_ for an English word is often missed when counting borrowed words. (Mencken, for example, notes that Americans use “shoe” in several instances where British use “boot” and traces the selection of which word to use to German usage.) There follows a short list of borrowings from German (some of which are composites matching German and English parts in a single word). (I also note that many of these words were common in English earlier, but have been pushed out by later borrowings and coinages). sauerkraut noodle pumpernickel hausfrau beer-garden lager wienerwurst (wiener and weener, to say nothing of wienie) frankfurter (frank) bock (beer) sauerbraten schnitzel liverwurst (_leberwurst_) bloodwurst (_blutwurst_) dachsund zwieback stein rathskeller delicatessen (deli) hamburger (burger) kindergarten katzenjammer loafer (giving “to loaf”) bum gesundheit yodel prosit! nix (from _nichts_) check (as a restaurant bill) fresh (when used to mean impudent) ouch! (from _autsch_ and, of course, flak blitzkrieg u-boat (_u-boot_) and various other military borrowings that did not survive WWII such as _jabo_ and _baedeker_ ---
**Author:** ![keeper0](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/b19c9b/32.png) [@keeper0](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/keeper0)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2001, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-english-borrow-so-few-german-words/57461/7 "2001-03-10T20:48:56Z")
We didn’t **borrow** them, we **stole** them and we refuse to give them back. I just finished reading a book about England in the year 1000 (titled, amazingly, “The year 1000”). Based on what I learned in there, here is my conjecture. Old English (Anglo Saxon) is Germanic and similar to what the folks around the Rhine used. Then England was invaded by the Vikings, and English was enhanced with words and sounds from Scandinavia. Then England was invaded by the Normans, and English was enhanced with words from France (and by extension… Latin). (now into the realm of my WAG) England fights many wars with France over the next few centuries. French is the language of diplomats. More French words enter the English language. About 1600, England becomes a major naval power. The Netherlands are also a major naval power. Between alliances and confrontations, a lot of communication between England and Holland results in the acceptance of many Dutch words. England controls the Netherlands for a good length of time. (Remember William of Orange? The Orange refers to the Netherlands). Occupation results in more language crossover. Germany was never a sea power until this century. England has never been invaded and occupied by Germany/Prussia, and vice versa. Which means the primary means for German words to enter into English after the Anglo-Saxon settlement was through trade and commerce. Many words enter this way (such as taboo from IIRC Polynesian), but it is less efficient than making folks with different languages live next to each other and talk to each other for generations. ---
**Author:** ![robby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robby/32/11048_2.png) [@robby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robby)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2001, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-english-borrow-so-few-german-words/57461/8 "2001-03-11T00:04:51Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by jayjay \* > I’ve said this before, and I’ll probably keep saying it, but the borrowing is what makes English such a rich language. > > It’s the difference between a question and an interrogation. It’s the difference between sadness and sorrow. It’s the difference between a trip, a journey, and a voyage. It’s the difference between cows and beef, deer and venison, pigs and pork, sheep and mutton. It’s the difference between guiding someone, leading someone, or conducting someone. It’s the difference between writing and scribbling. It’s the difference between forever and eternity on the one hand, and forever and infinity on the other…\*\* I just had to comment… What an eloquent post! And on the same subject, I noticed when taking German in high school how many English words translated to the same German word. ---
**Author:** ![Coldfire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a587f6/32.png) [@Coldfire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Coldfire)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2001, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-english-borrow-so-few-german-words/57461/9 "2001-03-11T00:35:36Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by keeper0 \* > **England controls the Netherlands for a good length of time. (Remember William of Orange? The Orange refers to the Netherlands). Occupation results in more language crossover.** I know you just mixed them up unintentionally, but I’ll correct it anyway: William of Orange went to England, not the other way around. The OP says English took “poppycook” from Dutch. Would you mind telling this Dutchman what the hell that word means? 😉 English is indeed a language that is able to convey subtle differences in feelings brilliantly. Remember that scene in “Sophies Choice”, where the two guys go off on a Thesaurus Spree, quoting synonyms for “fast”? Amazing. On the other hand, it is interesting to know that there are many Dutch words for which there isn’t a _direct_ translation. Not in English, and often not in **any** language. It takes me an entire 5 minutes to explain what _gezellig_ translates to in English. In short: it means “cosy”, but not quite. I think tomndebb did an excellent job quoting German words that made it into English. Nothing to add there. ---
**Author:** ![Dr\_Paprika](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr_paprika/32/3042_2.png) [@Dr\_Paprika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr_Paprika)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2001, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-english-borrow-so-few-german-words/57461/10 "2001-03-11T00:45:53Z")
A **poppycook** is a middleman who takes unprocessed opium and purifies it through a chemical reaction involving dehydrolysed acetic acid. I thought you were from Amsterdam and understood these things. ---
**Author:** ![Coldfire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a587f6/32.png) [@Coldfire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Coldfire)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2001, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-english-borrow-so-few-german-words/57461/11 "2001-03-11T00:51:36Z")
I am from Amsterdam, but I left the opium business behind me in 1986 when I became a banker. 😉 Looks like a little jargon I’m unaware of. But it doesn’t _sound_ like a Dutch word I know of. ---
**Author:** ![dtilque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d6d6ee/32.png) [@dtilque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dtilque)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2001, 12:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-english-borrow-so-few-german-words/57461/12 "2001-03-11T00:52:59Z")
IIRC, Bryson said something to the effect that there were only two common English words (_kindergarten_ and _hinterland_, I believe) that are borrowed from German. I have no idea what he based this on, but it’s easily the most ridiculous statement in that book. As Tom demonstrated, we have borrowed many words from German. Some time back I visually scanned pretty much all the etymologies in Webster’s 10th Collegiate Dictionary. I wasn’t looking for German-derived words in particular, but keeping Bryson’s statement in mind, I noted that there were lots of them. At a rough estimate, I’d say that there’s almost as many German-derived words as there are Italian- or Spanish-derived. I could add many words to Tom’s list, but will just give two that came from wars: snorkel (WWII) strafe (WWI) The latter has an interesting etymology. It comes from a sentence common to German propanganda during that war: “Gott strafe England” (God punish England). So the next time you see an airplane make a strafing run in a movie, remember that it’s really punishing the people on the ground. > [@](#): > > _from Coldfire_ > The OP says English took “poppycook” from Dutch. Would you mind telling this Dutchman what the hell that word means? It should be spelled _poppycock_ and means “nonsense” in English. Comes from the Dutch dialectal word _pappekak_, “soft dung”. ---
**Author:** ![Coldfire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a587f6/32.png) [@Coldfire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Coldfire)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2001, 1:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-english-borrow-so-few-german-words/57461/13 "2001-03-11T01:18:50Z")
Pappekak? Hee! 😉 _Kak_ means “poop”, and _pap_ means “porridge”. Porridge poop, ladies and gents. 😉 Never heard it before, but it’s a genuine Dutch construction alright. It’s probably me, then. Another thought: a lot of words that the English think of as Dutch might just as well be German. The two languages share a lot of words. The abovementioned _snorkel_ is one of them, incidently. ---
**Author:** ![rocking\_chair](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rocking_chair/32/2918_2.png) [@rocking\_chair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rocking_chair)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2001, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-english-borrow-so-few-german-words/57461/14 "2001-03-11T01:26:39Z")
indeed, robby. many english words and german words are similar: mother-mutter father-vater brother-bruder sister-schwester skipper-schiffer sluice-schleuse good-gut english and german share many “easy” words see-sehen, hear-horen. it isn’t until you get into more “complex” words audio (hear) visual (see) that you find the latin commonality . ---
**Author:** ![rocking\_chair](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rocking_chair/32/2918_2.png) [@rocking\_chair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rocking_chair)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2001, 1:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-english-borrow-so-few-german-words/57461/15 "2001-03-11T01:33:41Z")
oh no! when i say kaka, i’m really speaking dutch??? well, dung (dung is german as well). ---
**Author:** ![Coldfire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a587f6/32.png) [@Coldfire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Coldfire)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2001, 1:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-english-borrow-so-few-german-words/57461/16 "2001-03-11T01:35:21Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by rocking chair \* > **sluice-schleuse** Given the influence of Dutch on naval terms throughout the world, that’s most likely from the Dutch word _sluis_. And then I looked it up. It’s from the French _ecluse_. From [Dictionary.com](http://www.dictionary.com/cgi-bin/dict.pl?term=sluice): > [@](#): > > Middle English _scluse_, from Old French _escluse_, from Late Latin _exclsa_, from Latin, feminine past participle of _excldere_, to shut out; see exclude. Goes to show it never hurts to check. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![wastelands](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/5e9695/32.png) [@wastelands](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wastelands)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2001, 1:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-english-borrow-so-few-german-words/57461/17 "2001-03-11T01:37:21Z")
This is so simple, and I’m carrying a minor in the language so I do know a bit obout it. The reason English doesn’t use many “German” words is because they’re already part of the language. Linguists almost unanimously agree that English and German are closer than any other 2 languages. English whites are referred to as Anglo-Saxon because that’s the part of the continent most came from to permantly settle. An easy example is to take any “f” or “ff” in German and simply pronounce it as a “p”. For instance: Affe is ape, scharf is sharp, harfe is harp, schiff is ship. “B” is equal to english f or v. Ex: haben is have, grab is grave and eneben is uneven. In addition the pronouns are even close: ich is I, du is you, wir is we and sie is she. I could go on but I’ll end it here and give someone else a chance. ---
**Author:** ![dtilque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d6d6ee/32.png) [@dtilque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dtilque)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2001, 1:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-english-borrow-so-few-german-words/57461/18 "2001-03-11T01:49:32Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Coldfire \* > Another thought: a lot of words that the English think of as Dutch might just as well be German. The two languages share a lot of words. The abovementioned _snorkel_ is one of them, incidently. I understand that an Amsterdam company actually invented it. The Germans used them during WWII, so that’s where they impinged on Engish-speaking consciousness. The German form of the word is _Schnorchel_. ---
**Author:** ![rocking\_chair](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rocking_chair/32/2918_2.png) [@rocking\_chair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rocking_chair)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2001, 1:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-english-borrow-so-few-german-words/57461/19 "2001-03-11T01:54:12Z")
opps. thanks for the correction, coldfire. ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2001, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-english-borrow-so-few-german-words/57461/20 "2001-03-11T02:06:05Z")
In _Metamagical Themas_, Douglas Hofstadter examined the oddities of mapping one set of symbols onto another. Some remarkable weirdness occurs when the two sets are quite similar in many respects although different. As an example, he cited English/German dialectal humor – it’s possible for this stuff to be funny because the two languages are so similar, but _not quite_ … > [@](#): > > ACHTUNG! > > Alles touristen und non-technischen lookenpeepers! Das machine is nicht fur der fingerpoken und mittengrabben. Is > easy schnappen der springenwerk, blowenfusen und popencorken mit spitzensparken. Das machine is diggen by > experten only. Is nicht fur gerwerken by das dummkopfen. Das rubbernecken sightseeren keepen das cottenpicken > hands in das pockets. Relaxen und watchen das blinkenlights. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-english-borrow-so-few-german-words/57461.md?page=2)