# Why did god create Jesus? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 23, 2012, 6:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-god-create-jesus/626040 "2012-06-23T06:14:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Steken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e274bd/32.png) [@Steken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steken)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2012, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-god-create-jesus/626040/21 "2012-06-23T19:04:49Z")
> [@clairobscur](#): > > He already knew how hard i was. I think you meant to write “it.” How hard _it_ was. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2012, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-god-create-jesus/626040/22 "2012-06-23T20:03:41Z")
> [@grude](#): > > Well then you see my issue? If god is omnipotent, then why was Jesus needed at all? A agreement with satan to abide by certain rules, which god is loopholing? > > I can buy that god won’t uncreate satan, but tricking satan to steal something makes no sense. > > I admitted I am coming at this from the outside. > > Another thing that bugged me was how demons and other supernatural evils are fallen angels, so god lets renegade beings he created torture humanity? This would be like me loosing rabid dogs in my neighborhood and saying whatever happens I am not responsible. I agree it’s hard to see the necessity of it. According to Christian belief, God made the rules and he has sole control over them. So if he wanted to change his rules, he could have just done it. It’s hard to see why he needed to send Jesus to Earth to be crucified to accomplish anything. The best explanation I’ve ever heard is that Jesus was sent as an apology. It was God’s way of saying _“I realize I was overly harsh in my judgment. And to show you that I “get it” I’ll come down to Earth and let myself be crucified.”_ Here’s another question for you though. Why did God wait to send Jesus? God’s omnipotent, right? So from the moment he created the universe, he already knew what was going to happen. At the moment he was charging Adam and Eve with Original Sin, he knew he was going to regret doing it and change his mind. So why didn’t he stop right then and not do it? ---
**Author:** ![ExcitedIdiot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ea5d25/32.png) [@ExcitedIdiot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ExcitedIdiot)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2012, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-god-create-jesus/626040/23 "2012-06-23T22:11:37Z")
> [@kanicbird](#): > > Jesus is man in oneness with the Father. It is God bringing divinity to humanity and a power over Satan’s power to man. This is why it’s not just Jesus the man, but that Jesus lives inside us, we are conformed by God to be Jesus. At which point we are placed in power above Satan, bypassing Satan’s plans for humanity. This is also why we are given the name of Jesus (as it is common in prayer to pray in the name of Jesus - but what it means is we are Jesus to the Father). We are given the name with power higher then the archangels. > > It is God not abandoning us, even though Satan never wanted us to know God, tried everything he could to stop us from knowing God including restricting access to the holy of holies under penalty of death. But God simply sidestepped Satan’s plan and gave humanity His power. Cool story bro. ---
**Author:** ![samclem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a9a28c/32.png) [@samclem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/samclem)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2012, 12:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-god-create-jesus/626040/24 "2012-06-24T00:36:51Z")
Moved from General Questions to IMHO. **samclem** ---
**Author:** ![ZipperJJ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zipperjj/32/211_2.png) [@ZipperJJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZipperJJ)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2012, 3:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-god-create-jesus/626040/25 "2012-06-24T03:53:49Z")
I always figured that the non-Jews were just really thick and couldn’t figure out how to do what God wanted and so He sent down Jesus as a sort of “here, let me SHOW you!” type thing. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2012, 5:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-god-create-jesus/626040/26 "2012-06-24T05:20:49Z")
> [@ZipperJJ](#): > > I always figured that the non-Jews were just really thick and couldn’t figure out how to do what God wanted and so He sent down Jesus as a sort of “here, let me SHOW you!” type thing. So it was a lead-by-example thing? The message we were supposed to get was that God wanted us all to arrange to have ourselves crucified? If that was the intended message, I guess I’m just as happy we misunderstood it. ---
**Author:** ![ZipperJJ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zipperjj/32/211_2.png) [@ZipperJJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZipperJJ)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2012, 6:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-god-create-jesus/626040/27 "2012-06-24T06:10:21Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > So it was a lead-by-example thing? The message we were supposed to get was that God wanted us all to arrange to have ourselves crucified? > > If that was the intended message, I guess I’m just as happy we misunderstood it. FWIW I am a Christian. Yes, lead by example. But not to have ourselves crucified - that is ignoring Jesus’s life and only focusing on his death. His death was God’s love for us. His life was to show us by example how to live. WWJD all the way. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2012, 7:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-god-create-jesus/626040/28 "2012-06-24T07:18:29Z")
> [@ZipperJJ](#): > > His death was God’s love for us. And this is the point where non-Christians ask WTF? Okay, I can accept when a cat drops a dead mouse on a the living room carpet as a sign of love. But I expect more from God. Flowers or a box of candy would have been nice. But nobody asked for a crucifixion so there’s no reason for God to give us one and say he did it because he loves us. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2012, 7:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-god-create-jesus/626040/29 "2012-06-24T07:26:37Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > And this is the point where non-Christians ask WTF? > > Okay, I can accept when a cat drops a dead mouse on a the living room carpet as a sign of love. But I expect more from God. Flowers or a box of candy would have been nice. But nobody asked for a crucifixion so there’s no reason for God to give us one and say he did it because he loves us. The idea is that, by suffering and dying, God showed that, even though he lets bad things happens to us, he knows how bad it can be, and he’s not asking us to go through anything he’s not been through himself. Furthermore, as I said, without the death, he would not feel justified in granting mercy, and thus would still be the vengeful God of the Old Testament. (The whole justification thing is my way of explaining the idea of an omnipotent God having rules for his own behavior). BTW, there are alternate interpretations. One book I want to finish describes God coming to Earth as his attempt to atone for his past sins. He can’t really die, but he can at least go through the worst death imaginable at that time. I can’t find the name of the book in a quick Google search, but it was recommended to me here on the Dope, so I’m sure someone else will bring it up. ---
**Author:** ![Quintas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/48db29/32.png) [@Quintas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quintas)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2012, 8:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-god-create-jesus/626040/30 "2012-06-24T08:41:14Z")
> [@coremelt](#): > > Well firstly, according to mainstream christianity God didn’t creation Jesus, according to the trinity doctrine Jesus has always existed eternally. People were burnt as heretics or excommunicated for believing otherwise: > [Arianism - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arianism) Its like what Jehovahs Witnesses believe about Jesus. ---
**Author:** ![FriarTed](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/friarted/32/1052_2.png) [@FriarTed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FriarTed)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2012, 11:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-god-create-jesus/626040/31 "2012-06-24T11:27:58Z")
> [@Quintas](#): > > Its like what Jehovahs Witnesses believe about Jesus. Actually, the Witnesses regard Arius as sort of a precursor. The difference is, I think, is that Arius taught that Jesus earned Divine titles & being worshipped with the Father, whereas Witnesses honor Jesus as Lord but do not worship him alongside the Father Jehovah. ---
**Author:** ![twickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2012, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-god-create-jesus/626040/32 "2012-06-24T14:08:11Z")
Moved IMHO --\> GD. ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2012, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-god-create-jesus/626040/33 "2012-06-24T18:12:41Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Here’s another question for you though. Why did God wait to send Jesus? God’s omnipotent, right? So from the moment he created the universe, **he already knew what was going to happen. At the moment he was charging Adam and Eve with Original Sin, he knew he was going to regret doing it and change his mind. So why didn’t he stop right then and not do it?** (bold added) Worse yet, it appears that God is a slow learner. After doing that, he went and destroyed the world (or much of it) in a wrathful flood, and then promptly regretted that too. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2012, 5:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-god-create-jesus/626040/34 "2012-06-25T05:44:11Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > The idea is that, by suffering and dying, God showed that, even though he lets bad things happens to us, he knows how bad it can be, and he’s not asking us to go through anything he’s not been through himself. > > Furthermore, as I said, without the death, he would not feel justified in granting mercy, and thus would still be the vengeful God of the Old Testament. > > (The whole justification thing is my way of explaining the idea of an omnipotent God having rules for his own behavior). > > BTW, there are alternate interpretations. One book I want to finish describes God coming to Earth as his attempt to atone for his past sins. He can’t really die, but he can at least go through the worst death imaginable at that time. I can’t find the name of the book in a quick Google search, but it was recommended to me here on the Dope, so I’m sure someone else will bring it up. But this fits in better with the apology theory I mentioned. I can understand the idea that forgiving us for original sin was a sign of love. I just don’t see how the crucifixion itself can be seen as a sign of love. ---
**Author:** ![Randvek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/a6a055/32.png) [@Randvek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Randvek)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2012, 5:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-god-create-jesus/626040/35 "2012-06-25T05:58:02Z")
> [@Quintas](#): > > Its like what Jehovahs Witnesses believe about Jesus. Mormons, as well. ---
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2012, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-god-create-jesus/626040/36 "2012-06-25T13:45:58Z")
According to the Nicene creed - an ancient statement of faith believed by almost all Christians - Jesus is eternally begotten of the Father, not made. Theologians have claimed that the Trinity (Father, Son and Holy Spirit) is an eternal expression of creative-ness and perfect reciprical love and community. So God did not “create” Jesus for a pupose; the Son is an inseparatable part of God that has existed eternally and was present and active in creation. ---
**Author:** ![CJJ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ecc23a/32.png) [@CJJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CJJ)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2012, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-god-create-jesus/626040/37 "2012-06-25T15:15:47Z")
> [@grude](#): > > Jesus is some kind of trojan horse/poison apple for satan, satan has the keys or power of life and death down in hell. Satan knows something is off about Jesus but can’t resist taking his soul on death which him being divine allows him to grab the keys and stroll right out of hell. Satan screams in impotent rage(see the end of Passion Of The Christ) and having learned mortal life is HARD god gets soft. Strictly from the view of Christian theology, this is a decent summary of the [Ransom Theory](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atonement_(ransom_view)) of atonement, which was the prevailing theory among the early Church fathers regarding Christ’s sacrifice. Medieval theologians didn’t like this theory. It seemed ridiculous to them that (1) Satan would ever have a “justified” claim on humanity–being the embodiment of evil and all–and (2) it requires God to be both in debt to a lesser being and act deceptively, which seem to contradict his nature. Thus, they developed the [Satisfaction Theory](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atonement_(satisfaction_view)): It is humanity that owes a debt to God for original sin (rather than Satan having “won” the power of life/death in the Garden of Eden). There are theological arguments that clarify that humanity can neither satisfy this debt, nor can God simply forgive/ignore it, therefore Christ’s voluntary sacrifice acts as a substitute for this debt. The substitution theory, I believe, is the conservative view of the atonement in most Christian churches, though other theories (e.g. the [Moral Influence theory](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atonement_(moral_influence_view))) have been proposed by more liberal theologians. And don’t ask me to defend any of this–my knowledge comes from a youth spent foolishly studying this stuff… [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-god-create-jesus/626040.md?page=1)