# Why did Obi-Wan call Vader "Darth" **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [June 23, 2009, 9:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-obi-wan-call-vader-darth/500698 "2009-06-23T09:20:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![rocking\_chair](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rocking_chair/32/2918_2.png) [@rocking\_chair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rocking_chair)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2009, 2:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-obi-wan-call-vader-darth/500698/41 "2009-06-24T02:19:58Z")
tatooine would be a bit difficult for darthy-boy. all that sand getting into his delicate mechanical bits. he had more important things to do force choking people, hunting hidden jedi, kissing up to the emperor… ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Carrot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f0a364/32.png) [@Captain\_Carrot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Carrot)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2009, 2:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-obi-wan-call-vader-darth/500698/42 "2009-06-24T02:28:30Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > And a lot of Tatooine natives had names like Skywalker, Darklighter, Fardreamer, Whitesun, Blyskipper, Goldenfield, Sandskimmer, Starkiller (which was supposed to be Luke’s last name, originally), Windtide, etc. So it’s not like “Skywalker” would have been such an unusual name, or have stood out on Tatooine. So they’re a bit like space hobbits? ---
**Author:** ![sjc](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e5b9ba/32.png) [@sjc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sjc)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2009, 5:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-obi-wan-call-vader-darth/500698/43 "2009-06-24T05:31:49Z")
> [@Merijeek](#): > > …in a galaxy with thousands or millions of inhabited planets. Darth Vader was no longer Anakin Skywalker - this is a huge part of everything through four of the six movies. > > Why is Darth Vader going to swing by Owen’s farmstead? To discuss the moisture crop? He’s the number two ruler of the First Galactic Empire and has no reason to think he has any relatives (Mom, wife, and unborn children are dead, remember?) so why bother? Besides, even if Anakin Skywalker had some relatives, who cares? Darth Vader didn’t. > > -Joe Well yes, that makes a certain amount of sense, but at the same time that seems to be an awfully big gamble for Obi-Wan to make. Even if he’s pretty sure that Anakin doesn’t know about his son and even if he’s pretty sure that he has no interest in returning to Tatooine, I don’t think he can be positive. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Q](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/898d66/32.png) [@Johnny\_Q](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Q)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2009, 6:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-obi-wan-call-vader-darth/500698/44 "2009-06-24T06:16:25Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > Calling him what his beloved and very dead wife called him would be rather stupid, only piss him off. Two things: 1. A pissed off enemy is more likely to make mistakes, and that might increase your life expectancy while he blunders into stupid moves. Especially if he outclasses you as a swordsman and bears a grudge. 2. As Vader himself pointed out, “Escape was not his intention.” Ben fully expected(or intended?) to fall to Vader’s blade. He was basically holding off his old buddy until the rest of his friends could get away, as ol’ Darthy Boy(or is it Dorothy, if the thing about guys with girly nicknames is true) could’ve wasted them all with his pinky. Perhaps literally. ---
**Author:** ![cactus\_waltz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/74df32/32.png) [@cactus\_waltz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cactus_waltz)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2009, 8:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-obi-wan-call-vader-darth/500698/45 "2009-06-24T08:21:29Z")
> [@Johnny\_Q](#): > > Two things: > > 1. A pissed off enemy is more likely to make mistakes, and that might increase your life expectancy while he blunders into stupid moves. Especially if he outclasses you as a swordsman and bears a grudge. > > 2. As Vader himself pointed out, “Escape was not his intention.” Ben fully expected(or intended?) to fall to Vader’s blade. He was basically holding off his old buddy until the rest of his friends could get away, as ol’ Darthy Boy(or is it Dorothy, if the thing about guys with girly nicknames is true) could’ve wasted them all with his pinky. Perhaps literally. “Only a master of evil, _Dorothy_”. I can go with that. However. I think the only reason Kenobi calls Darth Vader “Darth” is to signify that they have a past together. They are the only ones in the story arc to do so, hence Kenobi is the only one to use a different name. Simple as that - he is being personal, since they go way back. It is akin to calling somebody by their first name. ---
**Author:** ![Yumblie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/76d3ee/32.png) [@Yumblie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yumblie)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2009, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-obi-wan-call-vader-darth/500698/46 "2009-06-24T16:39:38Z")
> [@Merijeek](#): > > …in a galaxy with thousands or millions of inhabited planets. Darth Vader was no longer Anakin Skywalker - this is a huge part of everything through four of the six movies. > > Why is Darth Vader going to swing by Owen’s farmstead? To discuss the moisture crop? He’s the number two ruler of the First Galactic Empire and has no reason to think he has any relatives (Mom, wife, and unborn children are dead, remember?) so why bother? Besides, even if Anakin Skywalker had some relatives, who cares? Darth Vader didn’t. > > -Joe It’s also worth noting that Vader didn’t start caring about his son until after the first death star battle. He sensed a force-strong pilot, and saw that Obi-Wan was still alive, so he came to the conclusion that Obi-Wan found his long lost son and was training him. Suddenly, this lost son of his that he otherwise would play deadbeat dad to has become a potential threat and/or ally. ---
**Author:** ![JThunder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e95f7d/32.png) [@JThunder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JThunder)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2009, 4:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-obi-wan-call-vader-darth/500698/47 "2009-06-24T16:58:59Z")
Just be thankful that he didn’t say, “Party on, Darth.” ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Q](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/898d66/32.png) [@Johnny\_Q](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Q)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2009, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-obi-wan-call-vader-darth/500698/48 "2009-06-24T18:40:10Z")
“Party on, Wan!!” Although I’m skeptical as to how well James Earl Jones could’ve pulled off the “woowoowoowoowooo” part. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2009, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-obi-wan-call-vader-darth/500698/49 "2009-06-24T19:45:57Z")
> [@Yumblie](#): > > It’s also worth noting that Vader didn’t start caring about his son until after the first death star battle. He sensed a force-strong pilot, and saw that Obi-Wan was still alive, so he came to the conclusion that Obi-Wan found his long lost son and was training him. Suddenly, this lost son of his that he otherwise would play deadbeat dad to has become a potential threat and/or ally. Or, rather, that he didn’t know he HAD a son – he didn’t there were twins, or that any child survived. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2009, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-obi-wan-call-vader-darth/500698/50 "2009-06-24T19:54:27Z")
> [@Johnny\_Q](#): > > Two things: > > 1. A pissed off enemy is more likely to make mistakes, and that might increase your life expectancy while he blunders into stupid moves. Especially if he outclasses you as a swordsman and bears a grudge. I don’t know if that strategy would work with a Sith Lord, though. Hatred and anger are, after all, the source of their power. Getting them pissed off would only make them more dangerous. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2009, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-obi-wan-call-vader-darth/500698/51 "2009-06-24T20:18:27Z")
> [@cactus\_waltz](#): > > “Only a master of evil, _Dorothy_”. I can go with that. And if you look very closely, the Storm Troopers all have “Friends of Dorothy” pinned to their armor. > [@](#): > > However. I think the only reason Kenobi calls Darth Vader “Darth” is to signify that they have a past together. They are the only ones in the story arc to do so, hence Kenobi is the only one to use a different name. Simple as that - he is being personal, since they go way back. It is akin to calling somebody by their first name. Not necessary, since the dialog made this very explicit. ---
**Author:** ![MEBuckner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mebuckner/32/2896_2.png) [@MEBuckner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MEBuckner)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2009, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-obi-wan-call-vader-darth/500698/52 "2009-06-24T22:01:25Z")
> [@cactus\_waltz](#): > > However. I think the only reason Kenobi calls Darth Vader “Darth” is to signify that they have a past together. They are the only ones in the story arc to do so, hence Kenobi is the only one to use a different name. Simple as that - he is being personal, since they go way back. It is akin to calling somebody by their first name. Yeah, all sequels, prequels, and subsequent retcons aside, that’s how I always took it. Whatever he may later claim, I’m not at all convinced that Lucas actually knew that the evil scary villain in the black breath mask was actually Luke’s father (instead of the guy who killed Luke’s father) when he made _Star Wars_. To be sure, “Darth” does sound an awful lot like a contraction of “Dark Lord of the Sith”, but the Star Wars universe strikes me as the kind of world where people wind up with incredibly foreshadow-y names just because that’s just how it works out (kind of like the Harry Potter universe): “Oh, what a beautiful baby boy–let’s name him [cue sudden thunderclap; soundtrack swells ominously into the “Imperial March” theme] _Darth_.” “Yes, and let’s change our last name from ‘Lolkitteh’ to ‘Vader’, because it sounds eviller!” “Yes, and I’m sure he’ll grow up to be a Jedi Knight, and won’t betray the Republic and murder a bunch of people or anything!” (Actually, “Vader” strikes me as more of a clue that Lucas was in fact not just making shit up as he went along than does “Darth”, since it does make the name wind up sounding suspiciously like “Dark Father”.) But anyway, if we assume Lucas was in fact pretty much just winging it, then the line makes perfect sense based solely on stuff we’re told in _Star Wars[: Episode IV: A New Hope]_: Crazy Old Ben Kenobi and Luke’s father were best buds back in the day and were badass Jedi Knights together; Darth Vader was old Ben’s brilliant protege who unfortunately turned to evil and betrayed them all, including offing Luke’s old man. So, Imperial stormtroopers respectfully address the guy as “Lord Vader”; Tarkin uses the man-to-man last name only, “Vader”; but who continues to call you by your first name, even after you’ve turned traitor and become the genocidal henchman of the totalitarian ruler of the galaxy? A.) Your mom and B.) Your old teacher. ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2009, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-obi-wan-call-vader-darth/500698/53 "2009-06-24T23:27:04Z")
> [@MEBuckner](#): > > (Actually, “Vader” strikes me as more of a clue that Lucas was in fact not just making shit up as he went along than does “Darth”, since it does make the name wind up sounding suspiciously like “Dark Father”.) That, and “Vader” is Dutch for “father”. -Joe ---
**Author:** ![Yumblie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/76d3ee/32.png) [@Yumblie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yumblie)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2009, 1:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-obi-wan-call-vader-darth/500698/54 "2009-06-25T01:39:41Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > Or, rather, that he didn’t know he HAD a son – he didn’t there were twins, or that any child survived. Well, given the pseudo-truth that binds the Star Wars galaxy together, Darth Vader didn’t have a son, Anakin Skywalker did. If ol’ Darthy were merely told he had a son he probably wouldn’t care. But a son strong in the force, that can be emotionally manipulated via a father-son connection, now that’s gold. In ESB the emperor even says “The son of skywalker shall not become a jedi” which serves as some convenient vague forshadowing but also shows that neither Darth nor the emperor consider him to be in any way related to Anakin anymore. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2009, 2:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-obi-wan-call-vader-darth/500698/55 "2009-06-25T02:55:20Z")
Obligatory shout out to read “The Secret Life of Star Wars” Reality. Darth Vader was his name and not Luke’s father in _Star Wars_. Retcons. Justify it however you want ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2009, 3:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-obi-wan-call-vader-darth/500698/56 "2009-06-25T03:11:27Z")
I wouldn’t call that a “retcon”, since it was the beginning of the saga, and the story was still developing. :rolleyes: Not every sequel is already written and planned to go. Jesus. ---
**Author:** ![robardin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/43a26b/32.png) [@robardin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robardin)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2009, 3:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-obi-wan-call-vader-darth/500698/57 "2009-06-25T03:46:49Z")
> [@Johnny\_Q](#): > > You’d think that if he really wanted to piss Vader off, Obi wan would have called him “Annie.” > > Calling the biggest badass in the galaxy by a girly nickname wouldn’t do much for Vader’s ego. Yeah. He just might have to smack you down no matter how good a friend you were back in the day. [Like this](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aTLN9ldnsUA). (ETA: fixed the link to the proper clip) ---
**Author:** ![gaffa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e68b1a/32.png) [@gaffa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gaffa)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2009, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-obi-wan-call-vader-darth/500698/58 "2009-06-25T18:09:39Z")
> [@SaintCad](#): > > Obligatory shout out to read “The Secret Life of Star Wars” > > Reality. Darth Vader was his name and not Luke’s father in _Star Wars_. > > Retcons. Justify it however you want I read a novelization of the film called “Star Wars” shortly after it came out, and back then Darth Vadar wasn’t a human at all - he breathed methane. > [@KneadToKnow](#): > > Example of how hard it would have been: > > Quote: > Kenobi Oh, so you’re a Sith Lord now? So you spend all your time killing Jedi Knights and making everyone call you “Darth”? Yeah, not even the great actor Alec Guinness could have delivered that line. As Harrison Ford said: “George, you can type this shit, but you sure can’t say it.” ---
**Author:** ![ProfessorX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@ProfessorX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ProfessorX)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2009, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-obi-wan-call-vader-darth/500698/59 "2009-06-25T18:42:10Z")
I thought Darth was a title as well, not necessarily a name. Like calling King Leonidas “king” doesn’t seem to make it more personal at all, in fact less personal. I think the story was adapted as it goes along to be quite honest, we certainly saw it with the prequel trilogy. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2009, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-obi-wan-call-vader-darth/500698/60 "2009-06-26T02:59:11Z")
> [@Jman](#): > > Unless, of course, his betrayal to the dark side hurt Obi-Wan so badly that he truly considered Anakin dead and murdered. …from a certain point of view. [QUOTE=Skald the Rhymer] I doubt she was raped. This is Lucas, after all. [/quote] Why not? He did a pretty good job of raping my childhood memories of the original films. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-obi-wan-call-vader-darth/500698.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-obi-wan-call-vader-darth/500698.md?page=4)