# Why Did They Nerf the Borg?
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-they-nerf-the-borg/352852
**Category:** Cafe Society
**Created:** [April 16, 2006, 4:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-they-nerf-the-borg/352852 "2006-04-16T04:10:48Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@asterion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asterion)
#### Post date: [April 16, 2006, 4:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-they-nerf-the-borg/352852/1 "2006-04-16T04:10:48Z")
Switching between _The Ten Commandments_ and an episode of Enterprise where they find the Borg on Earth, I was wondering why the writers/producers so badly nerfed the Borg. I mean, the Borg kicked ass in “The Best of Both Worlds” though you could start seeing the nerfing by the end of the Borg-related episodes in Next Generation. Then, of course, they managed to basically become a joke in Voyager (and I’ll admit, I stopped watching Voyager about three episodes in. As someone said, the entire premise suffered from Gilligan’s Island syndrome.) Is this just another example of idiotic producers?
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### Author:  [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)
#### Post date: [April 16, 2006, 4:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-they-nerf-the-borg/352852/2 "2006-04-16T04:29:07Z")
This is an example of
**The Law of the Emasculated Sci-Fi Badass**
In science-fiction and fantasy movies and TV shows, the writers will occasionally come up with a great villain, who gains unexpected popularity. And with the pressure to create sequels and cater to the fans, the villain will make return appearances. But movies and television are overwhelmingly optimistic, and the unstoppable killing machines are always stopped in the end. The only way to keep the villains around is to soften them up a bit, even give them storylines revealing their complexities and struggles to overcome their hostile ways. Redemption is a popular theme.
It is not limited to the Borg. The following characters/groups all started as villains, became popular, and were stripped of their badass natures:
Klingons (villains in the original series, a member of the crew in next generation)
Jaws (assassin in _The Spy Who Loved Me_, saves Bond’s life in _Moonraker_)
The Terminator
and wasn’t the shark extracting righteous revenge on Mrs. Brodie by the final _Jaws_ movie?
(There are more; I’ll post them as I remember them.)
and, of course, Darth Vader. The Law is irrestible. If there were to be another Star Wars movie, it would come before episode 1 and we’d see that the Emperor wasn’t evil, he just had a bad childhood.
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### Author:  [@Balduran](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Balduran)
#### Post date: [April 16, 2006, 4:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-they-nerf-the-borg/352852/3 "2006-04-16T04:34:50Z")
> [@Robot Arm](#):
>
> Jaws (assassin in _The Spy Who Loved Me_, saves Bond’s life in _Moonraker_)
I think I read somewhere that the guy who plays this character is a born-again Christian and insists that all his characters are redeemed in the end. That also happened with his character in Pale Rider.
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### Author:  [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)
#### Post date: [April 16, 2006, 4:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-they-nerf-the-borg/352852/4 "2006-04-16T04:36:30Z")
Well, in _Silver Streak_ he got shot with a spear gun and fell off the roof of a train. Not very redemptive.
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### Author:  [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)
#### Post date: [April 16, 2006, 4:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-they-nerf-the-borg/352852/5 "2006-04-16T04:42:43Z")
> [@Robot Arm](#):
>
> Well, in _Silver Streak_ he got shot with a spear gun and fell off the roof of a train. Not very redemptive.
He was probably hit by the Spear of Longinus and repented during the fall to earth.
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### Author:  [@Procyon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procyon)
#### Post date: [April 16, 2006, 5:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-they-nerf-the-borg/352852/6 "2006-04-16T05:38:56Z")
I honestly believe that the very nature of the show _Voyager_ was the true cause of the incredible weakening of the Borg. Admittedly, there was a lot of “nerfing” in the movie _First Contact_, but _Voyager_ is where the Borg truly lost their (its?) fearsome quality.
Throughout the entire series, the starship Voyager is portrayed as on its own in the wilds of the galaxy. They have no maps, no allies, no knowledge of the alien cultures they encounter, no fuel, and so forth. Voyager is one ship in the heart of Borg space. Voyager cannot reinforce her crew and armaments. Voyager is under attack from all sides. The people who made the show went out of their way to make Voyager the underdog of all underdogs.
Yet in the midst of all this trouble, we still have to have a TV show, right? That is, Voyager can never lose. They are up against all odds, but they can never lose. As a result, a lot of the shows went something like this:
**Some crew member** : Captain, we have a horrible problem.
**Janeway** : Try and fix it.
(_fifteen minutes pass_)
**Some crew member** : The problem has gotten worse by several orders of magnitude.
**Janeway** : We might never make it home!
(_twenty minutes pass_)
**Some crew member** : We are absolutely doomed. There is no possible way for us to escape our current predicament.
**Janeway** : Modulate the shield frequencies. That might buy us some time.
(_twenty minutes are bought_)
**Some crew member** : Captain, I have discovered a miraculous solution.
**Janeway** : Do it.
**Some crew member** : We are saved!
(_roll credits_)
It is this kind of episode model that cursed the Borg to seem completely nugatory throughout the series. Any obstacle would spend an episode slowly becoming worse and worse only to be undone at the last minute thanks to some crew-member audacity and gusto. Sometimes the problem might be so bad that the miraculous solution would take until the end of two episodes to show itself. In particular, I’m thinking of when Voyager encountered the Borg-smashing Species 8472. These malevolent, extradimensional fluids had “bio-ships” that could vaporize a cube squadron in one shot and an entire planet in a few more. So evil and powerful was Species 8472 that it took the intrepid crew of Voyager two whole episodes to figure out how to disable their bio-ships with a single modified photon torpedo.
But that’s not even the worst scenario. _The Next Generation_ introduced the Q Continuum, a race of all-powerful entities who exerted complete mastery over space, time, reality, and all that. For the most part, they use this power to make mischief for the Enterprise, but it is pretty clear that they operate on a level far above human comprehension. Then, Voyager runs into a spate of supernovae that turns out to be a consequence of a civil war between two factions of Q. Naturally, Voyager gets involved in this struggle, which I will remind you is a war between beings of godlike powers, and are “recruited” by one of the factions. We witness this struggle in a sort-of “this is not real but it is the only way your human mind can comprehend it” way and apparently the way we can comprehend it is as the American Civil War, with almighty beings running around with muskets and cannots. At one point, an injured Q tells some crew member: “if these weapons can make me bleed, imagine what they can do to you.” We ominously remember the supernovae.
Yet the whole ordeal, the whole universe-shaking, reality-shattering upheaval that is a _war between the omnipotent_, comes to an end when some Q and Voyager crew members storm the enemy camp. Chakotay actually points his Q-musket at the opposing Q-general and tells him to put an end to the conflict. It seems to me that if I am holding God’s musket and pointing it at God, all I can really do is pull the trigger and hope for the best. One might think that God has a few more options when faced with this scenario.
This might be more than anyone really wanted to read, so let me get to the point: Any villain you can think of could be made to look pathetic when up against Voyager. Every villain I can remember Voyager encountering did look pathetic. I submit it’s because the writers simultaneously wanted _Voyager’s_ universe to be fraught with danger at every turn and the crew to triumph over all the odds.
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### Author:  [@Snooooopy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snooooopy)
#### Post date: [April 16, 2006, 6:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-they-nerf-the-borg/352852/7 "2006-04-16T06:02:08Z")
> [@asterion](#):
>
> Switching between _The Ten Commandments_ and an episode of Enterprise where they find the Borg on Earth, I was wondering why the writers/producers so badly nerfed the Borg. I mean, the Borg kicked ass in “The Best of Both Worlds” though you could start seeing the nerfing by the end of the Borg-related episodes in Next Generation.
See Hugh starring in “The Cuddliest Little Borg in the Universe”!
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### Author:  [@Incubus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Incubus)
#### Post date: [April 16, 2006, 6:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-they-nerf-the-borg/352852/8 "2006-04-16T06:29:52Z")
I liked the pre-nerfed borg- they were scary! They really gave me this feeling of a hopeless battle. In ‘First Contact’ I really liked Picard’s resolve against the borg. Of course, he kind of had an axe to grind.
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### Author:  [@Terrifel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terrifel)
#### Post date: [April 16, 2006, 6:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-they-nerf-the-borg/352852/9 "2006-04-16T06:35:54Z")
\*\*asterion: \*\* Be honest now, you just wanted to use the phrase “nerf the Borg” didn’t you? “Let us now nerf the Borg! Prepare to jump the shark! Now, you must narfle the garthok!”
I contend that the Borg were inherently unsustainable as repeat villains. Their whole _leitmotif_ was faceless hive-mind uniformity, which certainly makes for an intimidating opponent at first, but doesn’t really inspire much in the way of storytelling hooks. The simple fact that the Borg didn’t have the capacity or inclination to debate or communicate meaningfully sort of straightjacketed the concept for an idea-based program like **Star Trek**. The Borg were effectively Jason from \*\*Friday XIII \*\* in space (before the actual Jason went into space, that is). They ultimately fell into the same category of relentless, unstoppable threat as a giant meteor or killer plague that the **Enterprise** or **Voyager** crew would have to scramble around and find a solution for. That’s fine for one or two episodes, but after that it just isn’t very interesting.
Ironically, the one feature of the Borg that I think could have salvaged them as villains was never really exploited. Early on, they were presented as having the ability to adopt the technology of other cultures and use it for their own ends; yet throughout the various series they never managed to successfully _assimilate_ anything of consequence. They might have been more effective villains if their appearances were limited to maybe one show per season, and every time they appeared they were significantly _more_ powerful and capable. Instead the writers tried to make the Borg more interesting by giving them flaws and making them more human; in effect, making them \*less \* intimidating with each appearance. Eventually the original concept was diluted down until there was nothing left but an arch, aloof woman in an improbably snug catsuit.
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### Author:  [@saoirse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/saoirse)
#### Post date: [April 16, 2006, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-they-nerf-the-borg/352852/10 "2006-04-16T16:40:31Z")
> [@Terrifel](#):
>
> an arch, aloof woman in an improbably snug catsuit.
Oh, man it looks like that oufit was **assimilated** onto her.
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### Author:  [@Hypno-Toad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hypno-Toad)
#### Post date: [April 16, 2006, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-they-nerf-the-borg/352852/11 "2006-04-16T17:10:11Z")
> [@Terrifel](#):
>
> Ironically, the one feature of the Borg that I think could have salvaged them as villains was never really exploited. Early on, they were presented as having the ability to adopt the technology of other cultures and use it for their own ends; yet throughout the various series they never managed to successfully _assimilate_ anything of consequence. They might have been more effective villains if their appearances were limited to maybe one show per season, and every time they appeared they were significantly _more_ powerful and capable. Instead the writers tried to make the Borg more interesting by giving them flaws and making them more human; in effect, making them \*less \* intimidating with each appearance. Eventually the original concept was diluted down until there was nothing left but an arch, aloof woman in an improbably snug catsuit.
So if the Borg had simply assimilated a DVD of “Invasion of the Body Snatchers” or “The Terminator” they might have infiltrated the federation and taken over that way?
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### Author:  [@Larry\_Borgia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Borgia)
#### Post date: [April 16, 2006, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-they-nerf-the-borg/352852/12 "2006-04-16T17:20:49Z")
> [@saoirse](#):
>
> Oh, man it looks like that oufit was **assimilated** onto her.
Her being the lovely and talented [Alice Krige](http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000481/), who shows up occaisionally in oddball SF projects and art films. She’s very sexy in an odd, almost perverse way. Check her out in the very strange flick [Habitat](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0119243/).
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### Author:  [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)
#### Post date: [April 16, 2006, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-they-nerf-the-borg/352852/13 "2006-04-16T17:58:33Z")
> [@saoirse](#):
>
> Oh, man it looks like that oufit was **assimilated** onto her.
Heh, good one.
It didn’t help that every Borg episode (but the first) and every Q episode (but the first) contradicted something presented earlier. The complexity of such characters really required a single writer or very tight-knit group of writers who had in mind a clear story arc that steadily built to a clear and dramatic conclusion. The piecemeal approach only raises the question of why galaxy-spanning powers like the Borg and Q waste even a microsecond thinking about Janeway and company, let alone clash with them over and over. The Kazon thing in the first two seasons of _Voyager_ was comparatively reasonable (though one season would’ve been better)- you’ve come in conflict with a local power, you run like hell across their space, and you gradually leave them behind, never to be seen again. Done.
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### Author:  [@brianjedi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brianjedi)
#### Post date: [April 16, 2006, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-they-nerf-the-borg/352852/14 "2006-04-16T17:58:49Z")
> [@Larry Borgia](#):
>
> Her being the lovely and talented [Alice Krige](http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000481/), who shows up occaisionally in oddball SF projects and art films. She’s very sexy in an odd, almost perverse way. Check her out in the very strange flick [Habitat](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0119243/).
I really think that was a reference to Seven of Nine.
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### Author:  [@Larry\_Borgia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Borgia)
#### Post date: [April 16, 2006, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-they-nerf-the-borg/352852/15 "2006-04-16T18:03:58Z")
> [@brianjedi](#):
>
> I really think that was a reference to Seven of Nine.
Oops. Oh well, as an Alice Krige fan, I appreciate the opportunity to mention her, regardless of my misunderstanding.
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### Author:  [@Tarrsk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tarrsk)
#### Post date: [April 16, 2006, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-they-nerf-the-borg/352852/16 "2006-04-16T18:05:39Z")
> [@Larry Borgia](#):
>
> Her being the lovely and talented [Alice Krige](http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000481/), who shows up occaisionally in oddball SF projects and art films. She’s very sexy in an odd, almost perverse way. Check her out in the very strange flick [Habitat](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0119243/).
I think more likely, “her being” Seven of Nine.
This is why I always preferred Deep Space Nine to the other Trek series. The writers were free to _let the heroes screw up_- hell, one of the season finales has the entire intrepid crew fleeing with their tails between their legs! And when they do win, it’s often because Sisko does something ranging from morally ambiguous to downright evil (for a given value of “evil”), rather than through courage and pluck.
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### Author:  [@Terrifel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terrifel)
#### Post date: [April 16, 2006, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-they-nerf-the-borg/352852/17 "2006-04-16T18:39:08Z")
> [@Larry Borgia](#):
>
> Oops. Oh well, as an Alice Krige fan, I appreciate the opportunity to mention her, regardless of my misunderstanding.
Not at all. That’s the beauty of the reference; it applies equally well to either one! Neat, eh?
STAR TREK SCREENWRITERS: “What?! Viewers are growing disenchanted with the Borg? How can we possibly restore their interest? Hmm… what about a Borg who isn’t a hideously deformed cyberzombie, but instead is a stacked babe in shiny skintight bondage gear?”
(LATER) "It’s not working?! Inconcievable! How can these viewers be \*\*Star Trek \*\* fans, and yet not rally behind a gorgeous woman in Theisswear? Err… we must need… _another one!_ Yeah, that’s the ticket… "
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### Author:  [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)
#### Post date: [April 16, 2006, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-they-nerf-the-borg/352852/18 "2006-04-16T19:42:06Z")
7 of 9 worked for me to bringing interest to the series. But that had more to do with her being the only character who stood out as an interesting character besides the hologram doctor. (And ignoring Janeway who was just annoying.)
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### Author:  [@Gadarene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gadarene)
#### Post date: [April 17, 2006, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-they-nerf-the-borg/352852/19 "2006-04-17T01:00:25Z")
Great post, **Procyon**.
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### Author:  [@Talon\_Karrde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Talon_Karrde)
#### Post date: [April 17, 2006, 5:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-did-they-nerf-the-borg/352852/20 "2006-04-17T05:21:03Z")
> [@Procyon](#):
>
> This might be more than anyone really wanted to read…
Nah, it was an entertaining post.
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