# why didnt any Dinosaurs survive? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [December 28, 2017, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-didnt-any-dinosaurs-survive/805479 "2017-12-28T19:24:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2018, 3:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-didnt-any-dinosaurs-survive/805479/101 "2018-01-23T03:19:12Z")
Evolution is not a ladder with humanity at the top. By any measure of success, dinosaurs (including their modern forms) have it all over us, having existed roughly 20 times as long as we have. A big brain is not an objective win. ---
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2018, 5:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-didnt-any-dinosaurs-survive/805479/102 "2018-01-23T05:19:38Z")
“If whales are soo smart why haven’t they invented steam powered bicycles yet?” CMC fnord! ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2018, 5:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-didnt-any-dinosaurs-survive/805479/103 "2018-01-23T05:36:08Z")
A woman needs a man like a whale needs a bicycle. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2018, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-didnt-any-dinosaurs-survive/805479/104 "2018-01-23T14:28:00Z")
But it’s misleading and anthropocentric to say things like “Humans have only lasted a couple of millions of years, while dinosaurs lasted 200 million”. We only think that makes sense because we have a Big Important Category just for us, and think that it takes all of the dinosaurs combined to make up a category of comparable importance. But it’s fairer to compare us to another single species, or to compare a larger group that includes us and many other species to a comparable larger group that contains a similar number of species. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2018, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-didnt-any-dinosaurs-survive/805479/105 "2018-01-23T16:02:53Z")
Let’s go with primates vs. maniraptors. ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2018, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-didnt-any-dinosaurs-survive/805479/106 "2018-01-23T16:07:08Z")
Or mammals vs saurians. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2018, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-didnt-any-dinosaurs-survive/805479/107 "2018-01-23T16:07:55Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > Let’s go with primates vs. maniraptors. In those terms the maniraptors (which include birds) have been far more successful, having endured almost 200 million years, to around 65 million for the primates. (Even if you exclude birds they would have lasted twice as long as primates ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2018, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-didnt-any-dinosaurs-survive/805479/108 "2018-01-23T16:20:07Z")
> [@Jonathan\_Chance](#): > > Or mammals vs saurians. That’s going to depend on how exactly you define mammal and saurian. However, the clade that includes mammals is the sister clade of the “Reptilia” in the broad sense, including the traditional reptiles, dinosaurs, and birds, so they are by definition equal in duration. However, this exercise is kind of pointless, since it depends on a somewhat arbitrary definition of groups. What we can say is that “intelligence” as such is no real indicator of evolutionary success. The apes, which are more intelligent than monkeys, have been in decline in terms of diversity and range compared to the more versatile monkeys for millions of years. And humans remained a rare and insignificant species for a very long time until we finally figured out agriculture. ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2018, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-didnt-any-dinosaurs-survive/805479/109 "2018-01-23T16:32:15Z")
I’d be willing to offer that plasticity - flexibility and adaptability - are better long-term indicators than intelligence, yes. A species that can adapt to new territories and find food sources is better adapted to dealing with changing circumstances. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2018, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-didnt-any-dinosaurs-survive/805479/110 "2018-01-23T17:23:52Z")
Of course, intelligence itself can help with flexibility and adaptability, especially if you have the means to pass down what you’ve learned to your descendants. Ideas can take hold in a population a lot more quickly than genes. ---
**Author:** ![Sailboat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sailboat/32/461_2.png) [@Sailboat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sailboat)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2018, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-didnt-any-dinosaurs-survive/805479/111 "2018-01-23T23:26:56Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > Yet for all hundreds of millions of years, their never was a “smart” dinosaur. One that grew intelligent enough to use fire, tools, the wheel, or show any other development. Well, someone already linked to hawks using fire. [Crows use tools](https://www.google.com/search?source=hp&ei=J8NnWv7yN8_wsQXR8Z-YDQ&q=crows+using+tools+in+the+wild&oq=crows+using+too&gs_l=psy-ab.1.1.0l2j0i22i30k1l3.2674.7907.0.10016.20.17.2.0.0.0.120.1279.14j3.17.0..2..0...1.1.64.psy-ab..1.19.1296.0..46j35i39k1j0i131k1j0i20i264k1j0i131i20i264k1j0i131i46k1j46i131k1j0i46k1j0i13k1j0i13i30k1j0i13i5i30k1j0i8i13i30k1.0.g971FXj20fk). Nobody with wings needs a wheel. Parrots have d[emonstrated abilities with human language](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alex_(parrot)), and we humans now admit that several species of birds [use names](https://www.npr.org/sections/krulwich/2014/04/15/300136332/can-it-be-parrots-name-their-children-and-those-names-like-ours-stick-for-life) (although many other species have shown distinct sounds for specific individuals). Cling to your wheel, Mankind. It’s all you have left. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-didnt-any-dinosaurs-survive/805479.md?page=5)