# Why didn't everyone in pre-industrial times die of skin cancer? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [January 17, 2015, 12:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-didnt-everyone-in-pre-industrial-times-die-of-skin-cancer/710032 "2015-01-17T00:54:15Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![NinjaChick](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/71c47a/32.png) [@NinjaChick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NinjaChick)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2015, 12:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-didnt-everyone-in-pre-industrial-times-die-of-skin-cancer/710032/1 "2015-01-17T00:54:15Z")
There have been [studies](http://www.who.int/uv/faq/skincancer/en/index1.html) showing that that rates of all types of skin cancer have been increasing over the past few decades. I have no reason to doubt this. However. We’ve had effective sunblock for about seventy years or so; before that we had no real means of effectively blocking UVA or UVB radiation from the skin. Go back to pre-industrial times, and a lot more people are going to be spending a lot more time outside, because in a pre-industrial society there really weren’t that many office jobs. If I’m a typical joe in 1680, chances are I’m going to be spending the entire summer out working in the fields, tending to the chickens, whatever my subsistence agrarian lifestyle requires. So is my family. So why weren’t rates of particularly non-melanoma skin cancers (as I understand that low-level, prolonged exposure increase the risk of non-melanomas more) absolutely massive by comparison? Obviously, your 17th century barber isn’t going to identify that weird growth on someone’s face as basal cell carcinoma, so is it merely an issue of nothing having been recorded as skin cancer? Is it possible that there was a dramatically higher rate but it’s hard to prove (as that was still a long ways away from what we consider epidemiology)? ---
**Author:** ![DingoelGringo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9d8465/32.png) [@DingoelGringo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DingoelGringo)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2015, 12:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-didnt-everyone-in-pre-industrial-times-die-of-skin-cancer/710032/2 "2015-01-17T00:57:03Z")
Maybe it has something to do with that hole in the Ozone layer? II don’t know, just inventing that! ---
**Author:** ![chacoguy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/50afbb/32.png) [@chacoguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chacoguy)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2015, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-didnt-everyone-in-pre-industrial-times-die-of-skin-cancer/710032/3 "2015-01-17T01:03:18Z")
Did you ever wonder why those women carried parasols on sunny days? ---
**Author:** ![Slithy\_Tove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slithy_tove/32/18248_2.png) [@Slithy\_Tove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slithy_Tove)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2015, 1:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-didnt-everyone-in-pre-industrial-times-die-of-skin-cancer/710032/4 "2015-01-17T01:05:54Z")
They died of other things before cancer set in, that we’ve alleviated? ---
**Author:** ![HeXen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@HeXen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HeXen)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2015, 1:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-didnt-everyone-in-pre-industrial-times-die-of-skin-cancer/710032/5 "2015-01-17T01:19:21Z")
Didn’t most people in 1600’s, even through the 1800’s wear full clothing? Hats also seemed to be common, most outside workers typically would wear long sleeves to aid in cooling. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2015, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-didnt-everyone-in-pre-industrial-times-die-of-skin-cancer/710032/6 "2015-01-17T01:26:56Z")
Didn’t Cecil just address this? [Why is skin cancer more prevalent now than in ancient times?](http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/3192/why-is-skin-cancer-more-prevalent-now-than-in-ancient-times) ---
**Author:** ![kopek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kopek/32/337_2.png) [@kopek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kopek)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2015, 2:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-didnt-everyone-in-pre-industrial-times-die-of-skin-cancer/710032/7 "2015-01-17T02:01:15Z")
Don’t know about ancient but for say 1400 on my vote is on the fact that even plowing, you didn’t expose that much skin. Hats, long sleeves as a rule – had to count for something. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2015, 2:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-didnt-everyone-in-pre-industrial-times-die-of-skin-cancer/710032/8 "2015-01-17T02:08:52Z")
That, and when people did get leisure time they didn’t make it a point to strip nearly naked and back in the sunlight. People tended to wear more clothing, cover up, some cosmetics used back then were thick enough to probably act as a sunblock to some degree… People died of a lot of other stuff back then, often at what we’d consider a young age. It’s possible quite a few of them had skin cancer at the time they died but it wasn’t what killed them. ---
**Author:** ![dofe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7ba0ec/32.png) [@dofe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dofe)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2015, 2:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-didnt-everyone-in-pre-industrial-times-die-of-skin-cancer/710032/9 "2015-01-17T02:31:13Z")
> [@kopek](#): > > Don’t know about ancient but for say 1400 on my vote is on the fact that even plowing, you didn’t expose that much skin. Hats, long sleeves as a rule – had to count for something. Likely: [The Havesters](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Harvesters_%28painting%29#mediaviewer/File:Pieter_Bruegel_the_Elder-_The_Harvesters_-_Google_Art_Project.jpg) (1565) ---
**Author:** ![kopek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kopek/32/337_2.png) [@kopek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kopek)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2015, 4:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-didnt-everyone-in-pre-industrial-times-die-of-skin-cancer/710032/10 "2015-01-17T04:34:40Z")
> [@dofe](#): > > Likely: > > [The Havesters](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Harvesters_%28painting%29#mediaviewer/File:Pieter_Bruegel_the_Elder-_The_Harvesters_-_Google_Art_Project.jpg) (1565) My google-fu is failing me tonight - how does say the Amish community compare to the US as a whole in skin cancers? If its significantly lower (say 50%) we could be onto something. ---
**Author:** ![Bill\_Door](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/50afbb/32.png) [@Bill\_Door](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bill_Door)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2015, 4:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-didnt-everyone-in-pre-industrial-times-die-of-skin-cancer/710032/11 "2015-01-17T04:41:06Z")
[This is the one I immediately thought of.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Gleaners#mediaviewer/File:Jean-Fran%C3%A7ois_Millet_-_Gleaners_-_Google_Art_Project_2.jpg) The Gleaners - 1757 ---
**Author:** ![NinjaChick](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/71c47a/32.png) [@NinjaChick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NinjaChick)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2015, 4:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-didnt-everyone-in-pre-industrial-times-die-of-skin-cancer/710032/12 "2015-01-17T04:55:41Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > Didn’t Cecil just address this? [Why is skin cancer more prevalent now than in ancient times?](http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/3192/why-is-skin-cancer-more-prevalent-now-than-in-ancient-times) :smack: Well, look at that. > [@Broomstick](#): > > That, and when people did get leisure time they didn’t make it a point to strip nearly naked and back in the sunlight. People tended to wear more clothing, cover up, some cosmetics used back then were thick enough to probably act as a sunblock to some degree… > > People died of a lot of other stuff back then, often at what we’d consider a young age. It’s possible quite a few of them had skin cancer at the time they died but it wasn’t what killed them. I understand the surface logic of this, but a wool or cotton shirt doesn’t do a whole lot to protect against UV radiation. It’s a better barrier than nothing, of course, but I don’t imagine it would have held up very well against long-term exposure. ---
**Author:** ![vomit\_comet](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/73ab20/32.png) [@vomit\_comet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vomit_comet)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2015, 8:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-didnt-everyone-in-pre-industrial-times-die-of-skin-cancer/710032/13 "2015-01-17T08:42:09Z")
I don’t imagine it takes more than one or two good sun burns for someone to figure out that most people aught to protect themselves… [http://i1234.photobucket.com/albums/ff407/GeneralDiskError/jean-luc-picard-20080618025824822-0001\_zps4065aa74.jpg](http://s1234.photobucket.com/user/GeneralDiskError/media/jean-luc-picard-20080618025824822-0001_zps4065aa74.jpg.html) ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2015, 11:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-didnt-everyone-in-pre-industrial-times-die-of-skin-cancer/710032/14 "2015-01-17T11:29:19Z")
> [@NinjaChick](#): > > I understand the surface logic of this, but a wool or cotton shirt doesn’t do a whole lot to protect against UV radiation. It’s a better barrier than nothing, of course, but I don’t imagine it would have held up very well against long-term exposure. Small protection over the long term is going to be better than no protection over the long term. Also note the bit about not baking oneself as a form of recreation. The explanation is likely a number of factors whose influence adds up over time. ---
**Author:** ![coremelt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4491bb/32.png) [@coremelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/coremelt)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2015, 11:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-didnt-everyone-in-pre-industrial-times-die-of-skin-cancer/710032/15 "2015-01-17T11:45:46Z")
Note that the same is true nowadays for agricultural workers in less developed countries. This is the typical garb of workers in rice paddies across south east asia. Long flowing sleeves and big hat, there is no skin exposed to the sun at all: [![](https://davidowens.typepad.com/.a/6a00e551a5402988340133f2765c5f970b-500wi) ](https://davidowens.typepad.com/.a/6a00e551a5402988340133f2765c5f970b-500wi) ---
**Author:** ![vomit\_comet](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/73ab20/32.png) [@vomit\_comet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vomit_comet)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2015, 11:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-didnt-everyone-in-pre-industrial-times-die-of-skin-cancer/710032/16 "2015-01-17T11:59:09Z")
> [@NinjaChick](#): > > :smack: Well, look at that. > I understand the surface logic of this, but a wool or cotton shirt doesn’t do a whole lot to protect against UV radiation. It’s a better barrier than nothing, of course, but I don’t imagine it would have held up very well against long-term exposure. I think you may be confusing clothing with clouds. Light cloud cover will let through UV radiation but I would beg to differ on the cotton and wool clothing doing the same. ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2015, 1:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-didnt-everyone-in-pre-industrial-times-die-of-skin-cancer/710032/17 "2015-01-17T13:24:50Z")
I recall reading something that Coco Chanel, French fashion designer, was the person who popularized the suntan as a facet of the luxury lifestyle somewhere around WWI. Before that a tan was associated with peasantry toiling in the fields (at least, hands and face) and lily-white skin was a mark of the aristocrat who never had to go out and work in the sun. Of course, all that changed with the industrial revolution anyway, and mere factory workers sported that aristocratic fish-belly look; which would therefore make basking in the sun the mark of luxury. ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2015, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-didnt-everyone-in-pre-industrial-times-die-of-skin-cancer/710032/18 "2015-01-17T18:19:14Z")
From what I’ve read, the vast majority of skin cancer deaths are from melanoma, but the vast majority of skin cancers are not melanoma. > **[Skin cancer](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skin_cancer#Prognosis)** > > Skin cancers are cancers that arise from the skin. They are due to the development of abnormal cells that have the ability to invade or spread to other parts of the body. It occurs when skin cells grow uncontrollably, forming malignant tumors. The primary cause of skin cancer is prolonged exposure to ultraviolet (UV) radiation from the sun or tanning devices. Skin cancer is the most commonly diagnosed form of cancer in humans. There are three main types of skin cancers: basal-cell More than 90... > [@](#): > > The mortality rate of basal cell and squamous cell carcinoma are around 0.3% causing 2000 deaths per year in the US. In comparison the mortality rate of melanoma is 15–20% and it causes 6500 deaths per year.[39]:29,31 Even though it is much less common, malignant melanoma is responsible for 75% of all skin cancer-related deaths.[40] > **[Skin Cancer Facts & Statistics](https://www.skincancer.org/skin-cancer-information/skin-cancer-facts/)** > > Get the latest skin cancer facts and skin cancer statistics. Learn more about the most common cancer in the U.S. and worldwide. Cancer facts. > [@](#): > > Melanoma accounts for less than two percent of skin cancer cases, but the vast majority of skin cancer deaths.2 So 2% of skin cancers make up 75% of deaths, the other 98% make up the other 25% of deaths. I don’t know the terminology well, but I have no idea what % of that 2% is ‘malignant melanoma’. It could be a fraction of 1% of skin cancers that cause 75% of deaths. ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2015, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-didnt-everyone-in-pre-industrial-times-die-of-skin-cancer/710032/19 "2015-01-17T18:39:29Z")
Did a healthy layer of grime act as a sunscreen? Most folks had one. :eek: ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2015, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-didnt-everyone-in-pre-industrial-times-die-of-skin-cancer/710032/20 "2015-01-17T18:44:54Z")
Most skin cancers (particular basal cell carcinoma) advance at a relatively slow pace, and in “pre-industrial” times, by the time they got large enough to be more than disfiguring and become a threat to life, the patient may well have died of something else. We don’t have too good a handle on skin cancer incidence rates long ago, because diagnosis wasn’t very reliable. It’s been estimated for instance that only a small fraction of supposed leprosy cases in the Middle Ages were actually due to Mycobacterium leprae. Most of the unfortunates who were killed or herded into sanitariums probably had noncontagious inflammatory skin disorders, or skin cancer. Lifestyle factors in ancient times differed considerably from current ones. I’m pretty sure that peasants in the 14th century didn’t spend a lot of time soaking up sun at the beach or using tanning beds. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-didnt-everyone-in-pre-industrial-times-die-of-skin-cancer/710032.md?page=2)