Why didn't Native Americans develop alcohol?

Orujo sounds a little familiar if it’s pronounced ah-roo-hoe. Maybe there’s a Portuguese name that’s similar.

I don’t think they’re confusing percent with proof, I think they’re old men and if they mention a number in describing their personal feats, you can usually divide it in half.

Sorry, I don’t understand English phonics when given like that, I need references. Orujo is pronounced orujo, no aes, but who knows what word you were thinking of when you said “ah”… (sorry, but with the amount of threads on dialectal pronunciations and having seen people here say that “Spanish de is pronounced day” where I’d Spanish-phonics day as déi, I realized I can’t make any assumptions about how any of you pronounce anything).

This is funny. We’re in the same boat with each other’s languages.
But I think Orujo is the right stuff. The wiki doesn’t offer a pronunciation, but it does mention it is like grappa which has also been used.

What about freeze distillation? The link I posted earlier noted that American colonists made applejack with alcohol content of 30-40%. From what I can glean from the article, it looks to me as if the colonists had the same basic resources available to them (fruit, a cold winter, jars) that the Indians would have had before them. Correct me if I’m wrong, but it doesn’t even look as if yeast was involved. (Although maybe the Indians would have even had that, in some form . . .)

Outside of Europe, or outside the Old World?

Because China and Japan certainly had distillation technology. The Arab nations as well. But most of the traditional alcohols were still fermented, much like in Europe. I’m unaware of any distilled beverages outside the Old World however.

Also, distilled beverages were traditionally considered medicinal, and drunkenness was usually looked down upon as foolish and irresponsible. The ancient Greeks for example would even cut their wine with water - they thought pure wine was dangerous in large quantities.
And yes, native Americans north of Texas knew alcohol. Keep in mind they were pre-literate, and usually preferred more functional, less delicate forms of pottery with simple geometric designs. References to alcohol are therefore sparse, but we do have references - usually from tapestries or religious stories. The Iroquois brewed a kind of beer from tree sap, as has been mentioned. I’m sure if I looked hard enough I could find something in the Northwest as well, but it’d probably take a while to sift through the modern info and the false stuff.

Those are called fortified wines - a wine with a distilled alcohol mixed in. Usually brandy, to keep the flavor.

It doesn’t usually (unless it’s fortified). The highest I’ve seen is around 15 to 15.5% for a really dry zin or similar. Usually, there’s not enough sugar in the must to get it higher than that, and adding sugar to your grape juice (to raise potential alcohol levels) is generally not considered desirable.

However, there are plenty of yeasts that will eat through sugar and survive at near 20% alcohol ranges. See here for a list of winemaking yeasts and their alcohol ceilings.

I wondered that myself. Maybe a soursop fruit fell from a tree, fermented in the tropical heat, and someone walking through the forest slipped on the soursop peel and sat on the stinky puddle real fast. :wink:

It was a million to one chance, doc! A MILLION TO ONE!

So, the question that still appears to be unresolved is this:
Did any indigenous North American people in the area now known as the USA brew wine or beer prior to contact with other cultures?

ack… That wasn’t precise enough.

OK, let me try again.

Let me pick a time… how about 1200 CE?
Let me pick a culture… how about the Creek?

Did they or any of their trading partners brew wine or beer?

If so, why is this unknown to us?
If not, then why not, given the inevitable result of natural fermentation?

That is somewhat better.
I am distracted. There are children present.
I must leave now.

(Worse than CATS!)

ETA: Even worse is to be nijaed on this while dealing with a nerf pistol wielding 6 year old.