# Why do apartment dwellers have to pay additional rent for indoor pets?
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-apartment-dwellers-have-to-pay-additional-rent-for-indoor-pets/819378
**Category:** Factual Questions
**Created:** [August 10, 2018, 4:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-apartment-dwellers-have-to-pay-additional-rent-for-indoor-pets/819378 "2018-08-10T04:42:23Z")
**Posts on this page:** 5
**Page:** 5
### Author:  [@iamthewalrus\_3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iamthewalrus_3)
#### Post date: [August 15, 2018, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-apartment-dwellers-have-to-pay-additional-rent-for-indoor-pets/819378/81 "2018-08-15T04:09:54Z")
> [@SamuelA](#):
>
> You’re still screwed if you take it to a judge if they sued and won. In the eyes of a judge, taking action against someone who _won_ in court is saying “screw you” to the entire judicial system.
Cite?
Can you produce a single court case in the US where a prospective landlord told a prospective tenant “We don’t rent to people who sued their landlords” and lost a case because of it?
Deciding not to rent to someone who has sued a landlord is like deciding not to hire someone who has sued an employer or deciding not to date someone who sued a former lover. It’s not “taking action against” them. It’s refusing to enter into a voluntary association with them.
And in this country you can generally refuse to do business with someone for any reason you like as long as it’s not their membership in a protected class.
> [@](#):
>
> And as for this “protected class” nonsense : if there are 8 open units in a complex, and I get refused entry for any reason that isn’t a justifiable, documented reason that is _reasonable_ in the eyes of that judge, it’s still de facto discrimination. You’re still going to lose.
Cite? Did this ever happen to anyone, or are you just imagining that’s how this would go?
> [@Fear Itself](#):
>
> Why would I volunteer that information? Is it a crime to lie to a landlord?
It’s likely eviction-worthy to lie on your rental application. It’s _possible_ that it’s also criminal fraud? Telling material lies to get someone to do business with you that they wouldn’t have done had they known the truth sounds like fraud to me. Not sure.
I’ve seen rental applications that wanted references for the past decade of living circumstances. They could call your old landlords and ask? I suppose you could fake contact information for all those too.
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### Author:  [@Corry\_El](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Corry_El)
#### Post date: [August 15, 2018, 12:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-apartment-dwellers-have-to-pay-additional-rent-for-indoor-pets/819378/82 "2018-08-15T12:23:12Z")
> [@iamthewalrus\_3](#):
>
> Deciding not to rent to someone who has sued a landlord is like deciding not to hire someone who has sued an employer or deciding not to date someone who sued a former lover. It’s not “taking action against” them. It’s refusing to enter into a voluntary association with them.
>
> And in this country you can generally refuse to do business with someone for any reason you like as long as it’s not their membership in a protected class.
This is the legal history of it. The reason special laws were enacted for cases of racial, sex, etc discrimination is the default assumption that you can enter into a business association, such as renting somebody something, or not, with whoever you want to for whatever reason you want to. There is no obligation to accept a business arrangement with the first person who meets your basic economic terms.
Racially, etc discriminatory restaurant owners, landlords etc therefore had this defense but at a certain point society decided there was an overriding public interest to carve out race, sex, etc as unacceptable reasons. Otherwise there would always have been some set of recognized unacceptable reasons, or a history of court precedent where judges decided what were good reasons or not. In fact again the history is as you say that you don’t need a reason to refuse to initiate business with somebody, nor is it legally necessary to conceal your reason if you do have one, except those specific carve outs.
Obviously as a practical matter a landlord isn’t going to admit the reason if it’s expected litigiousness. Some people, as just demonstrated, believe they have legal cases about all kinds of stuff where they don’t really, but it’s still a hassle to be frivolously sued.
Landlord here, have never done deep background checks (besides stuff like credit score) on tenants. In reality we usually have one person or group at a time which accepts the stated rent, and no gtee of another coming fwd before the place goes empty a(nother) month. If there were two simultaneous candidates and one was known to be a lawyer, OK sorry lawyer. 🙂
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### Author:  [@watchwolf49](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/watchwolf49)
#### Post date: [August 15, 2018, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-apartment-dwellers-have-to-pay-additional-rent-for-indoor-pets/819378/83 "2018-08-15T14:39:06Z")
> [@SamuelA](#):
>
> You’re still screwed if you take it to a judge if they sued and won. In the eyes of a judge, taking action against someone who _won_ in court is saying “screw you” to the entire judicial system.
>
> And as for this “protected class” nonsense : if there are 8 open units in a complex, and I get refused entry for any reason that isn’t a justifiable, documented reason that is _reasonable_ in the eyes of that judge, it’s still de facto discrimination. You’re still going to lose.
>
> If a clean cut individual walks into a restraunt and you refuse them service because you know they sued another restauraunt across town and won, that’s not gonna fly.
This might surprise you, but discrimination is legal in the United States _except for_ about a half dozen reasons and only in business activities … “Republicans need not apply” … also surprising is that the judge’s opinion is all but meaningless in court, they have to follow the law (and/or precedence) just like the rest of us … and I’ve had judges say they’d like to do such-and-such for me but the law doesn’t allow it …
I’m sorry … unless there’s a law that _specifically_ forbids restaurants from not serving people who sue restaurants … it does fly … discrimination is lawful except for a few reasons …
Mind you … discrimination of all types is bad for business … refusing to bake gay wedding cakes will cost you money …
> [@Fear\_Itself](#):
>
> Why would I volunteer that information? Is it a crime to lie to a landlord? If they want to hire a private detective to sniff out the public records in all jurisdictions, that is up to them.
>
> As a sidebar, I once got a restraining order against a landlord, preventing her from entering my house unless it was for an emergency repair. It was served on her by a uniformed officer in a marked law enforcement vehicle in front of her house. It didn’t affect my next rental in the least.
Not only can lying on your rental application get it refused tenancy, it can get you evicted after the fact if the truthful information would have gotten you refused in the first place … I find out after I rented to someone they weren’t homeless that year but ripped off a landlord for $2,500 … I’m evicting lest the tenant rips me off for that kind of money …
I said “may” have consequences … big apartment complexes and rental management companies typically do a professional job, and winning a civil case says nothing about you, and everything about who you sued … tenant wins against a landlord, that’s a shit-hole landlord …
There are screening services … for $75 you can get judicial records for all 50 states, Canada and some will pull up Mexican records … and the tenant pays for this through screening fees …
> [@iamthewalrus\_3](#):
>
> Cite?
>
> Can you produce a single court case in the US where a prospective landlord told a prospective tenant “We don’t rent to people who sued their landlords” and lost a case because of it? … [snip]
First you’ll need to find a state where this is outlawed … that was my correction above … I thought Oregon was one of those states but I can’t find the law that says so …
> [@iamthewalrus\_3](#):
>
> [snap] … I’ve seen rental applications that wanted references for the past decade of living circumstances. They could call your old landlords and ask? I suppose you could fake contact information for all those too.
Keep in mind 90% of my business was with townies with local rental references … call up all the landlords listed and get the positive results, check employment and off to the court house to check records there … then down to land records to verify these landlord names and OOPS, different name … one more call to get the real rental reference and refuse the application … I’m sure the friend will always give a good reference, but it’s still a material falsehood on the application …
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### Author:  [@watchwolf49](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/watchwolf49)
#### Post date: [August 15, 2018, 2:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-apartment-dwellers-have-to-pay-additional-rent-for-indoor-pets/819378/84 "2018-08-15T14:44:46Z")
There’s an important point that gets lost in all the weeds … a surprising number of state legislators are landlords … I collect rent on the 1st of the month, pay bills on the 2nd … that leaves me one hell of a lot of free time to either go nag my own legislator or just simply get elected myself … doctors have to doctor, lawyers have to lawyer, real estate agents have to real estate agent … landlord get 28 days paid vacation time every month …
_ **Landlords write the laws …** _ not just rental laws, _ **all** _ the laws …
Just a few hundreds years ago, landlords were also given all powers of the judiciary over the common class … late with rent, it’s off with your head …
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### Author:  [@iamthewalrus\_3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iamthewalrus_3)
#### Post date: [August 15, 2018, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-apartment-dwellers-have-to-pay-additional-rent-for-indoor-pets/819378/85 "2018-08-15T16:34:22Z")
> [@Corry\_El](#):
>
> Landlord here, have never done deep background checks (besides stuff like credit score) on tenants. In reality we usually have one person or group at a time which accepts the stated rent, and no gtee of another coming fwd before the place goes empty a(nother) month. If there were two simultaneous candidates and one was known to be a lawyer, OK sorry lawyer. 🙂
Sounds like you’re a landlord in a functioning housing market.
Where I live the rental vacancy rate often hovers around 1%, and it’s not uncommon to get 50+ applicants for a single property. That lets landlords pick and choose.
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