Why do Catholic school girls have to wear plaid skirts?

In My Humble Opinion
61

[QUOTE=Nava]
Nah, it’s not a shirt, it’s woolen and goes over a shirt. From the discussion on page 1, it appears that the Brits call it jumper.

Wonder why they never teach your these important things in language school! :stuck_out_tongue:
[/QUOTE]
Not in U.S. vocabulary. (If I can get my scanner to work, I’ll post a picture dictionary image.) They don’t teach us the names of clothes in “language school.” In California, a jumper is like a child’s coveralls. It’s something children used to wear when they played in the dirt, to keep their clothes clean.

If the Brits want to use the word differently, that’s their prerogative. Just keep in mind that they have some strange ideas of vocabulary: (see “vest”).

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[QUOTE=guizot]
Not in U.S. vocabulary. (If I can get my scanner to work, I’ll post a picture dictionary image.) They don’t teach us the names of clothes in “language school.” In California, a jumper is like a child’s coveralls. It’s something children used to wear when they played in the dirt, to keep their clothes clean.

[/QUOTE]

What Nava’s talking about, the British “jumper”, is the American “pull-over sweater” or just “sweater”. (Hence Cicero’s joke.) It’s often an option to be worn over a t-shirt, turtleneck or collared dress shirt with a school uniform.

Brits/Aussies, what do y’all call the sleeveless dress which is traditionally - but according to current fashion, only occasionally - worn over a dress shirt or turtleneck?

63

[QUOTE=WhyNot]
What Nava’s talking about, the British “jumper”, is the American “pull-over sweater” or just “sweater”. (Hence Cicero’s joke.) It’s often an option to be worn over a t-shirt, turtleneck or collared dress shirt with a school uniform.

Brits/Aussies, what do y’all call the sleeveless dress which is traditionally - but according to current fashion, only occasionally - worn over a dress shirt or turtleneck?
[/QUOTE]
Well, I just called my mother, who is thoroughly educated as a Catholic, and she confirms that a “jumper” is a sleeveless dress-like thing worn by school girls over their regular clothes. But she’s from Boston, so I have to take it with a grain of salt (and a communion wafer).

64

My all girls Catholic high school uniform was a navy blue jumper with a white collared shirt underneath.

My high school drew from the poorest and richest areas in the state. I’m sure the uniform helped with equalization although at the time I didn’t give it much thought. I just liked the convenience of it.

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[QUOTE=GorillaMan]
I’m not sure what ‘too casual’ means. Many schools here have a uniform which, in warm weather, will simply consist of a particular polo shirt with a school symbol or shield printed or embroidered on, black trousers/skirt & shoes. Fairly casual, inexpensive, and fulfulling all the objectives of a uniform (equality, community identity etc.) to the same extent as other options.
[/QUOTE]

I meant that a school will never choose a uniform with a flower pattern, or a polka-dot pattern, or a striped pattern, for example. Maybe casual is the wrong word. Flashy? Crazy? Ostententatious?

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[QUOTE=HazelNutCoffee]
I meant that a school will never choose a uniform with a flower pattern, or a polka-dot pattern, or a striped pattern, for example. Maybe casual is the wrong word. Flashy? Crazy? Ostententatious?
[/QUOTE]

Fair point, then. This ties up with the use of school ties, at least in Britain, as a way of giving a uniform a clear unique identity, while staying within the bounds of simple plain colours elsewhere.

67

[QUOTE=guizot]
Well, I just called my mother, who is thoroughly educated as a Catholic, and she confirms that a “jumper” is a sleeveless dress-like thing worn by school girls over their regular clothes. But she’s from Boston, so I have to take it with a grain of salt (and a communion wafer).
[/QUOTE]
She also told me that on the East Coast they used to use the word “jersey” for what we here in the west simply call a “T-shirt.” I think the closest thing on the West Coast to the traditional word for “jersey” (not the sports uniform) is “knit shirt.”

And above, I mistook “jumper” for “jumpsuit.” Now that I recall, I’ve seen most private school girls in Colombia wearing jumpers, rather than plaid skirts.

I have a hard time with vocabulary of women’s ware, though it’s part of my job to know such things. My girlfriend in Colombia asked me what that thing is called (in English) which women use to tie their hair (the elastic band covered with bunched up cloth–Spanish: “mono”.) For over a year I was baffled. When I got back to L.A. I went to a Rite Aid only to see that it’s a “hair accessory.” So I asked a friend with daughters, and immediately he informed me: “scrunchie.” It makes sense.

68

[QUOTE=guizot]
Well, you’re the boss around here, so do what you want.

I still think there must be a factual answer to this factual question.

(Or maybe fighting ignorance has become a thing of the past.–that is, somebody’s getting lazy.)
[/QUOTE]

Moving this to IMHO doesn’t prevent people from providing factual information if they have it. I gave it a chance in GQ, but since little in the way of facts had emerged in the first 36 posts I didn’t think much more was likely to be forthcoming at that point.

If I had insisted that people stick to factual responses, as they should in GQ, the thread would have died almost immediately. Moving it to IMHO was the best way to keep it alive. Sometimes the factual answer is that there is no factual answer. :slight_smile:

Colibri
General Questions Moderator
General

69

[QUOTE=Colibri]
Moving this to IMHO doesn’t prevent people from providing factual information if they have it. I gave it a chance in GQ, but since little in the way of facts had emerged in the first 36 posts I didn’t think much more was likely to be forthcoming at that point.
[/QUOTE]
Thanks. At least we’re learning that in the English- speaking world half the time we’re not talking about what we think we’re talking about when it comes to clothes.

Or something like that.

But if the Pope chimes in, will you move it back to GQ?

70

[QUOTE=guizot]
But if the Pope chimes in, will you move it back to GQ?
[/QUOTE]

Oh, absolutely. Father Guido Sarducci or Sister Mary Elephant for that matter.

71

to help the atlantic based confusion…

jumper (uk)= sweater (us)

jumper (us)=pinafore/frock (uk)

turtleneck (us)=polo neck (uk)

72

You mean it’s not gift wrap? :smiley:

::ducks and runs::

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[QUOTE=rocking chair]
turtleneck (us)=polo neck (uk)
[/QUOTE]

Oh, noes! I didn’t know that one. So what do you call this sort of shirt (US = “polo shirt”)?

74

Girls at my Protestant school had to wear plaid skirts and knee socks.

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[QUOTE=rocking chair]
to help the atlantic based confusion…

jumper (uk)= sweater (us)

jumper (us)=pinafore/frock (uk)

turtleneck (us)=polo neck (uk)
[/QUOTE]
Thanks for the clarification, rocking chair. I always thought a pinafore was some kind of ship in a really old musical.

While I can understand that the Brits call a (U.S.) sweater a “jumper,” (Where the hell did they get that from?)–and I can never understand their term for “vest.” For them, a “vest” is underwear–specifically, women’s underwear (a “teddy”*). How did this distinction arise?
[QUOTE=Colibri]
Oh, absolutely. Father Guido Sarducci or Sister Mary Elephant for that matter.
[/QUOTE]
Ah, as always, a moderator of well-balanced and even-handed judgment, who can recognize the wisdom of all theologians.

(As I’m sure you know, you could’ve stayed part of Colombia, about a hundred years ago. I’ll let you decide if that’s good or bad. In any case, you have the Canal now, and who can gainsay that??? And you’re making it bigger. Good luck on that.)

*Did you know that during the looting during the May 1992 Los Angeles riots, someone stole Madonna’s bra from the Frederick’s “Museum” of …well, I guess, museum of underwear on Hollywood Blvd.? It’s at least worth some trivia at your next cocktail party.

76

[QUOTE=guizot]
T For them, a “vest” is underwear–specifically, women’s underwear (a “teddy”*).
[/QUOTE]

Is this right? I thought a British “vest” is a sleeveless tee-shirt (aka “singlet” or, more vulgarly, a “wifebeater.”)

77

[QUOTE=Kilvert’s Pagan]
You mean it’s not gift wrap? :smiley:
[/QUOTE]
Okay, all joking aside…

I did not start this thread because I find young girls in plaid skirts attractive, nor do I want to know about the techniques of making minor girls attractive.

No. No. No.

I’m curious about the culture that led to this particular fashion, particularly the fabric pattern know as “plaid.” I’m not a student at FISM, but I know many, and the “issue” plaid comes up often.

I can appreciate (with a grain of salt) the jokes, and men (boys) will be men (boys). But I don’t find anything attractive about plaid skirts on minor females, and neither on “major” females. The picture I linked to was to me a joke–really, that was ridiculous.

I’m more interested in aesthetics and institutions and their connections–if you want, call me a post-modernist (and you can heap all the insults you want for that–I don’t care–we know what we’re talking about, even if you don’t want to take it into consideration).

But there’s not reason for that, because this thread is interesting simply because we’re discovering different English vocabulary in different places.

(Also, we just got off work, and they’re serving drinks…and, well, what the hell.)

78

[QUOTE=guizot]
Okay, all joking aside…

I did not start this thread because I find young girls in plaid skirts attractive, nor do I want to know about the techniques of making minor girls attractive.

No. No. No.

I’m curious about the culture that led to this particular fashion, particularly the fabric pattern know as “plaid.” I’m not a student at FISM, but I know many, and the “issue” plaid comes up often.

I can appreciate (with a grain of salt) the jokes, and men (boys) will be men (boys). But I don’t find anything attractive about plaid skirts on minor females, and neither on “major” females. The picture I linked to was to me a joke–really, that was ridiculous.

I’m more interested in aesthetics and institutions and their connections–if you want, call me a post-modernist (and you can heap all the insults you want for that–I don’t care–we know what we’re talking about, even if you don’t want to take it into consideration).

But there’s not reason for that, because this thread is interesting simply because we’re discovering different English vocabulary in different places.

(Also, we just got off work, and they’re serving drinks…and, well, what the hell.)
[/QUOTE]

Tend to favor the “major” females a bit exclusively (but not Female Majors, being an enlisted man, that’s entirely off limits to me and vice versa), but I’d imagine a lot of the draw towards the plaid skirts is the implication of it not being allowed, something about the relative sweetness of fruit based on whether you’re supposed to.. erm… taste it.

That said, I think more women should wear the old-school full-length solid-colored pleated skirts. With a pair of boots, they can be pretty hot. :smiley:

79

[QUOTE=pulykamell]
Is this right? I thought a British “vest” is a sleeveless tee-shirt (aka “singlet” or, more vulgarly, a “wifebeater.”)
[/QUOTE]
Can some Brits come to our aid here?

80

From a textile perspective, I think we already got a good answer: traditional wool plaid is sturdy as hell, needs little or no ironing if you hang it promptly, hides dirt and stains and was a very utilitarian fabric back in the day. All things you want when outfitting active kids. Note that places that use solids use *polyester *solids, even in today’s day and age. After wool, polyester is the top of the resists-stains, needs little ironing, sturdy as hell fabric. Polyester, however, needs to be dyed or printed with a pattern after weaving, so it’s more commonly left blank. That second step costs more. Wool can be cheaply woven into patterns - herringbone and plaid being the most common (and, again, common = cheapest in fabrics.)