# Why Do Companies Double Dip?? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [October 9, 2003, 3:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-companies-double-dip/206419 "2003-10-09T03:57:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2003, 3:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-companies-double-dip/206419/1 "2003-10-09T03:57:04Z")
I have a “sister” post to this question in MPSIMS or what ever it is. But I think a General Question can be formed from it. (I also noticed the What can I buy in Canada that I cant buy in US post elsewhere… same vein, but different enough. Why on Earth do companies Re-invent the wheel depending on where they are located at the time? Why Does Circle K gas stations own 76 gas stations… Does Shell own Texaco? But even non-gas companies do this. Why are there Carl Jr.'s and Hardee’s? Why is there Best Foods and Hellmanns? Why on earth do companies do this? It seems to be a waste in money in bradning this or that for one state or location only. I think I deduced that Checkers Hamburgers and Rally’s are the same when just this problem occured. ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2003, 4:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-companies-double-dip/206419/2 "2003-10-09T04:10:34Z")
Demographics. ---
**Author:** ![Nametag](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nametag/32/406_2.png) [@Nametag](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nametag)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2003, 4:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-companies-double-dip/206419/3 "2003-10-09T04:13:49Z")
Best Foods and Hellman’s were separate brands, belonging to separate companies. They have tremendous brand loyalty in their respective markets, and the owners would be incredibly stupid to discard that. The same thing applies to any branded product; some people just won’t buy a new brand, even if it’s the same stuff with a new name. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2003, 5:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-companies-double-dip/206419/4 "2003-10-09T05:11:58Z")
What Nametag said. In most cases, there was an existing brand in a particular market that got bought out by some other company. Instead of going through the trouble of rolling out a whole new unknown brand in those markets, they use the “brand equity” of the old brand to market their new stuff- in other words, they take advantage of the brand recognition and trust of the old brand to sell the newer products. ---
**Author:** ![Duckster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duckster/32/1244_2.png) [@Duckster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duckster)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2003, 5:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-companies-double-dip/206419/5 "2003-10-09T05:57:53Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Nametag \* > **Best Foods and Hellman’s were separate brands, belonging to separate companies.** Ah, no, not for the last 71 years. > [@](#): > > Hellmann’s® and Best Foods® products have been staples in American kitchens for generations. The brands’ flagship products, Hellmann’s® and Best Foods® Real Mayonnaise, are the best-selling mayonnaises in the United States. > > Mayonnaise is said to be the invention of the French chef of the Duke de Richelieu in 1756. While the Duke was defeating the British at Port Mahon, his chef was creating a victory feast that included a sauce made of cream and eggs. When the chef realized that there was no cream in the kitchen, he improvised, substituting olive oil for the cream. A new culinary masterpiece was born, and the chef named it “Mahonnaise” in honor of the Duke’s victory. > > In 1905, two years after arriving in the United States, German immigrant Richard Hellmann opened up a delicatessen in New York City. His wife’s delectable recipe for mayonnaise was featured in salads and sold in the deli, and the condiment quickly became so popular that Hellmann began selling it in “wooden boats” that were used for weighing butter. > > Originally, two versions of the recipe were sold, and to distinguish between them, Hellmann put a blue ribbon around one. The “ribbon” version was in such high demand that in 1912, Hellmann designed what is today the iconic “Blue Ribbon” label, to be placed on larger glass jars. > > At the same time that Hellmann’s® Mayonnaise was flourishing in the east, Best Foods, Inc., introduced mayonnaise to Californian consumers. As Hellmann’s® expanded on the east coast, Best Foods® proved to be a smashing success in the west. It was nearly inevitable then, that in 1932, Richard Hellmann Inc., was acquired by Best Foods, Inc. To this day, Hellmann’s® Mayonnaise is sold east of the Rockies and Best Foods® Mayonnaise is sold west. Source: [http://www.mayo.com/corporate/history.asp](http://www.mayo.com/corporate/history.asp) Both brand names are owned by one company, Unilever Best Foods, a division of Unilever. However, the rest of what **Nametag** said is key. People will stick with a brand name, even as companies buy and sell each other, merge, etc. Companies play on consumer loyalty (and ignorance), selling the exact same product under different names, and often, different prices. This same concept applies to “house brands” or no name products. Many people think no name brands are inferior products because of their no name labeling, cheaper prices, whatever. In some cases this is true. In many other cases it is not. Case in point. The no name brand teflon-coated shaving razor blade cartridges I buy cost me $2.50 for ten. You can buy the exact same blades under the brand name for $15.00 for five cartridges. ---
**Author:** ![commasense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/commasense/32/3017_2.png) [@commasense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/commasense)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2003, 6:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-companies-double-dip/206419/6 "2003-10-09T06:11:54Z")
I’m sorry, **Duckster** , but unless I’m missing something, doesn’t the last paragraph of your quotation prove that **Nametag** ’s statement is true? They _were_ separate brands, made by separate companies, until, as you quixotically point out, 71 years ago. Thanks for the interesting info, though. I didn’t know that about Richelieu’s chef or the derivation of the word. ---
**Author:** ![Markxxx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/5daacb/32.png) [@Markxxx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Markxxx)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2003, 6:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-companies-double-dip/206419/7 "2003-10-09T06:18:58Z")
Don’t know if it is true (a guy I know who works at Jewel Food told me) but when Albertson’s bought out Jewel Foods (Also Osco Drugs) they tried to convert their Sav-On stores to Osco and the public resisted. But also brings rise to the thread in reverse. Why do some companies change a stable brand. For instance when British Petroleum bought Amoco. They changed the Amoco stations to BP. Amoco is quite an established brand. ExxonMobil and ChevronTexaco seem to be keeping their brands seperate. (though to complicate things Texaco was to be rebranded Shell but that agreement didn’t go ahead full force.) ---
**Author:** ![sailor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a587f6/32.png) [@sailor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sailor)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2003, 7:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-companies-double-dip/206419/8 "2003-10-09T07:29:44Z")
> [@](#): > > Originally, two versions of the recipe were sold, and to distinguish between them, Hellmann put a blue ribbon around one. The “ribbon” version was in such high demand that in 1912, Hellmann designed what is today the iconic “Blue Ribbon” label, to be placed on larger glass jars. The origin of “blue ribbon” was discussed in a recent thread and it ain’t this one. ---
**Author:** ![Cardinal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cardinal/32/4000_2.png) [@Cardinal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cardinal)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2003, 8:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-companies-double-dip/206419/9 "2003-10-09T08:01:19Z")
Well, in anything approaching a Hispanic area, naming your store Osco is incredibly stupid. “Asco” means “disgust”. Really. ---
**Author:** ![scm1001](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c4cdca/32.png) [@scm1001](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scm1001)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2003, 10:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-companies-double-dip/206419/10 "2003-10-09T10:19:31Z")
Unilever is a past master at branding. E.g. in the UK it has at least 6 high profile brands of washing liquids, the casual consumer would think that they were actually from different companies. It is to give the illusion of choice and swamp the opposition. E.g if Unilever and Procter & Gamble say had one high profile washing powder then they would probably get 1/2 of the business each. By Unilever having so any brands, they may increase their share of the market to say 6/7 in the above example. ---
**Author:** ![Huerta88](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/82dd89/32.png) [@Huerta88](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Huerta88)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2003, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-companies-double-dip/206419/11 "2003-10-09T14:30:44Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by scm1001 \* > \*\*Unilever is a past master at branding. E.g. in the UK it has at least 6 high profile brands of washing liquids, the casual consumer would think that they were actually from different companies. It is to give the illusion of choice and swamp the opposition. E.g if Unilever and Procter & Gamble say had one high profile washing powder then they would probably get 1/2 of the business each. By Unilever having so any brands, they may increase their share of the market to say 6/7 in the above example. \*\* I think this, along with the “artifact of multiple brands/regional brands being conglomerated,” is the explanation. **scm1001** ’s point also implicitly goes to one of the big issues for retail consumer products, which is shelf space. No store is going to give 6/7 of their total detergent space to one brand (if nothing else, consumers would think it was stupid – though having read about some of the chicanery that goes on as far as de facto bribes for shelf space, [http://www.cranberrystressline.com/slotting\_fees.html](http://www.cranberrystressline.com/slotting_fees.html) [http://www.fool.com/news/2000/pep001204.htm](http://www.fool.com/news/2000/pep001204.htm) I wouldn’t put it past the stores to try, if given the right incentives). But if the stores can claim to be displaying 7 distinct brands, Unilever can get the same shelf space dominance while still giving consumers the illusion of diversity/choice. ---
**Author:** ![wnorthr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ecccb3/32.png) [@wnorthr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wnorthr)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2003, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-companies-double-dip/206419/12 "2003-10-09T15:55:31Z")
Some companies do it to appeal to a slightly different public. Marshalls and T J Maxx are the same company and a lot of what they have is the same(though Marshalls seems to be slightly higher scale) but I’ve known people who always go to Marshalls who would never go to T J Maxx. As far as gas stations go a lot of that was laws way back when that prohibited oil companies from using the same name in different parts of the country. I remember when I was a kid EXXON spent buku dollars to change their name to one they could use nationwide. They chose the double x because it existed in only one language so the chance of coming up with a word that offended someone were minimized. ---
**Author:** ![CurtC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ce73a5/32.png) [@CurtC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CurtC)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2003, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-companies-double-dip/206419/13 "2003-10-09T16:04:48Z")
The classic case of dual-branding, which no one has even mentioned, are cars. Ford/Mercury and all the GM brands. It doesn’t seem like it would be worth the trouble, but hey, I’m not a marketing genius. ---
**Author:** ![BwanaBob](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bwanabob/32/2985_2.png) [@BwanaBob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BwanaBob)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2003, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-companies-double-dip/206419/14 "2003-10-09T16:18:31Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Markxxx \* > \*\*But also brings rise to the thread in reverse. Why do some companies change a stable brand. For instance when British Petroleum bought Amoco. They changed the Amoco stations to BP. Amoco is quite an established brand. > \*\* Yes, here in the US, but the rest of the world knows BP. They want it all under one umbrella. Remember that Nissan’s were called Datsun here in the US. Same thing happened, condensed to one world-wide brand. ---
**Author:** ![Balthisar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/balthisar/32/2825_2.png) [@Balthisar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Balthisar)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2003, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-companies-double-dip/206419/15 "2003-10-09T16:38:52Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by CurtC \* > \*\*The classic case of dual-branding, which no one has even mentioned, are cars. Ford/Mercury and all the GM brands. It doesn’t seem like it would be worth the trouble, but hey, I’m not a marketing genius. \*\* Well, strictly speaking the cars aren’t completely identical. There are small differences, and a whole, valid strategy behind it. I think we’ve had a lot of discussions about “badge engineering” here on the SDMB. ---
**Author:** ![lieu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c2a13f/32.png) [@lieu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lieu)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2003, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-companies-double-dip/206419/16 "2003-10-09T16:47:52Z")
Shell bought some of the downstream retail operations (gas stations) from Texaco. They remain seperate companies. ---
**Author:** ![yabob](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yabob/32/2821_2.png) [@yabob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yabob)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2003, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-companies-double-dip/206419/17 "2003-10-09T20:31:34Z")
Hardee’s was also a separate company until bought by CKE Restaurants (Carl’s Jr.). As already observed, the acquiring company would be foolish to throw away the brand in many cases, although they probably hope to streamline the business to make money from it by using common suppliers with their other brands, etc. A very good example would be Cadbury-Schweppes, which owns an enormous number of overlapping soft drink brands - they are essentially on a mission to dominate the non-cola soft drink market, letting Pepsi and Coke battle over the colas. They own: 7-Up Canada Dry Schweppes A&W Hires IBC Stewart’s Crush RC (they have SOME colas) Squirt Dr Pepper Vernors and a few more, along with a whole stable of fruit juice companies like Mott’s, Snapple and Nantucket Nectars. They would have been absolute fools to have killed brands as they acquired these various companies (some of which were already composite companies with multiple brands when they bought them - A&W bought Squirt, and was in turn bought by Dr Pepper/7 Up before Cadbury Schweppes got to them, for instance). ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2003, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-companies-double-dip/206419/18 "2003-10-09T21:12:28Z")
> [@](#): > > For instance when British Petroleum bought Amoco. They changed the Amoco stations to BP. They made the same blunder when they bought out Sohio. > [@](#): > > laws way back when that prohibited oil companies from using the same name in different parts of the country. The laws haven’t changed. The fact is that after the breakup of Standard Oil in 1911, several different companies had rights to the name “Standard Oil” (or any name incorporating such, such as “Esso”) in different parts of the country. If any of those companies wanted to expand to another Standard’s territory, they would have to come up with a new name. In order to be able to use one name for all their operations, they eventually all changed – Standard Oil of New Jersey --\> Eastern States Standard Oil (Esso) --\> Exxon --\> ExxonMobil Standard Oil of New York --\> Socony --\> Mobil --\> ExxonMobil Standard Oil of California --\> Chevron --\> ChevronTexaco Standard Oil of Ohio --\> Sohio --\> BP America --\> BP Amoco Standard Oil of Indiana --\> American Oil --\> Amoco --\> BP Amoco Continental Oil --\> Conoco Atlantic Oil --\> Atlantic Richfield --\> Arco --\> Sun There is nothing “back then” about the trademark laws that made this come about. Trademarks are restricted by geography. Even today there are many businesses that have rights to the same trademark in different geographical areas. If any one of them is going to start moving into another’s territory, it’s going to face the issue of having a competitor who has superior rights to your name in a new territory. ---
**Author:** ![Bob55](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e9c0ed/32.png) [@Bob55](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bob55)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2003, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-companies-double-dip/206419/19 "2003-10-10T04:09:50Z")
Why is it called Checkers in the southeast, but Rallys here in Memphis? ---
**Author:** ![Duckster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duckster/32/1244_2.png) [@Duckster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duckster)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2003, 4:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-companies-double-dip/206419/20 "2003-10-10T04:23:39Z")
> [@](#): > > This chain has two names. Generally speaking, the restaurant is known as Rally’s in the west and Checker’s in the east. The menus are the same, except for different names. For example, Rally’s “Big Buford” is called a “Champ” at Checker’s. Source: [http://www.fastfoodsource.com/burgers/rallys-checkers/rallys.htm](http://www.fastfoodsource.com/burgers/rallys-checkers/rallys.htm) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-companies-double-dip/206419.md?page=2)