# Why do English people sing like Americans? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [November 8, 2002, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-english-people-sing-like-americans/135804 "2002-11-08T00:28:16Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2002, 1:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-english-people-sing-like-americans/135804/41 "2002-11-09T13:50:54Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Nametag \* > \*\*Rancid and Green Day are punks from California and they sing like California punks. That accent is not even remotely British. \*\* That’s funny. I **was** a California punk. And they sound English to me. ---
**Author:** ![Coilean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f6c823/32.png) [@Coilean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Coilean)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2002, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-english-people-sing-like-americans/135804/42 "2002-11-09T18:41:12Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Larry Mudd \* > \*\*There is a fundamental difference between singing and speaking – generally, regional accents don’t come into play. (Often, people who have a severe stuttering problem can sing with no difficulty… I seem to recall reading that this is because a different part of the brain is being used, although this is only a dim memory and should not be taken as gospel.) > \*\* And the dim recollection gets a little brighter (though still not gospel). IIRC there’s been many examples of aphasics who loose the ability to speak fluently but can still sing just fine. In these cases, it’s generally Broca’s area that’s suffered the damage but other parts of the brain are still fully functional (warning: I’ve oversimplified for the sake of argument). I went looking for the specific areas that might be involved in singing but alas, the library’s closed and I can’t turn up anything on the net that doesn’t involve songbirds. However, I did come across [this article](http://www.publications.villanova.edu/Concept/2002/html/christopherlotis.html) that discuss a few case studies of people with amusia. Pretty neat stuff actually. ---
**Author:** ![TitoBenito](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2acd7d/32.png) [@TitoBenito](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TitoBenito)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2002, 4:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-english-people-sing-like-americans/135804/43 "2002-11-11T04:19:28Z")
On the other hand choir boys and girls always sound british no matter where you are. I remeber being yelled at once for saying “garden” or something like that instead of “gaah-den” or “our father” instead of " awe fathah". Hermits Hermits always sound very british to me. I’ve heard that the Ramones tried to copy there vocal style when they first came out, but I don’t really hear it . ---
**Author:** ![hazel-rah](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/73ab20/32.png) [@hazel-rah](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hazel-rah)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2002, 9:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-english-people-sing-like-americans/135804/44 "2002-11-11T09:18:42Z")
> [@](#): > > **An Arky** : Nor do you have to do that to be able to discern that a singer sounds American or British. Well, the whole point of my post was to say that actually, you do have to do just that. Otherwise you end up with the following: A: Rancid and Green Day are punks from California and they sing like California punks. That accent is not even remotely British. B: That’s funny. I was a California punk. And they sound English to me. I’m happy to hear everyone’s thoughts, but is this really helping to answer the question in the OP? Eventually you have to decide what it is exactly that makes you think a line from a song is being sung in a particular accent, and then check to see if those features are not only present in the sung accent, but also uncommon in the spoken dialect of the singer. -fh ---
**Author:** ![An\_Arky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/87869e/32.png) [@An\_Arky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/An_Arky)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2002, 12:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-english-people-sing-like-americans/135804/45 "2002-11-11T12:29:31Z")
**Hazel-rah:** You’re right about the subjectivity of listener’s opinions on this. I guess we would need an actual linguist or something to make that determination. But those people’s opinions can be subjective, too, so where does it end? Myself, I think if it smells like s@# and looks like s@#, it’s very likely to be s@#$. 🙂 Oh, and sorry I was curt in my original reply. I am a musician and songwriter, and sometimes I bristle at attempts to quantify or analyze these things… ---
**Author:** ![Spoke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a88e57/32.png) [@Spoke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoke)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2002, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-english-people-sing-like-americans/135804/46 "2002-11-12T16:01:19Z")
Well at the risk of making **An Arky** all bristly, I’ll give you a quick example, **hazel-ra** (off the top of my head). There is a **Green Day** lyric: _Do you have the time To listen to me whine_ …which to my ears is sung with an English accent. (In more or less the style of Joe Strummer.) “time” comes out almost (but not quite) “toym” “whine” comes out almost (but not quite “whoyne” There’s something English about the pronunciations of “do” and “listen” in those verses as well. ---
**Author:** ![Spoke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a88e57/32.png) [@Spoke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoke)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2002, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-english-people-sing-like-americans/135804/47 "2002-11-12T16:07:57Z")
Also from the same song, in a later verse, the word “control” gets a cockney pronunciation, with the ‘r’ in that word getting a pronunciation that is somewhere between ‘r’ and ‘w’. ---
**Author:** ![Spoke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a88e57/32.png) [@Spoke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoke)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2002, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-english-people-sing-like-americans/135804/48 "2002-11-12T16:17:56Z")
From the same song (which, by the way, is “Basket Case” from the Dookie CD): _Sometimes I give myself the creeps_ “sometimes” is almost “sometoymes” “myself” is “mysewf” and the ‘r’ in “creeps” is a cross between ‘r’ and ‘w’ It’s obvious that these guys cut their teeth on The Clash, because their vocalizations are very close to those of Joe Strummer. Listen to a Clash album, then listen to a Green Day or Rancid album, and you’ll see what I mean. ---
**Author:** ![jjimm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba8739/32.png) [@jjimm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jjimm)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2002, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-english-people-sing-like-americans/135804/49 "2002-11-12T16:34:20Z")
As an English fan of Green Day, I have to say those lads sound American to me. They may be _trying_ to sound English, but they fail. ---
**Author:** ![Spoke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a88e57/32.png) [@Spoke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoke)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2002, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-english-people-sing-like-americans/135804/50 "2002-11-12T16:40:29Z")
Yeah, well, the Beatles version of “American” is flawed as well. ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2002, 3:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-english-people-sing-like-americans/135804/51 "2002-11-14T03:50:32Z")
I maintain that the Beatles (excepting Ringo) didn’t really attempt to sing “American” as such. They sang with the artificial “Mid-Atlantic” pronunciation, which is a compromise between British and American and sounds equally normal on either side of the Atlantic. Artificial, because not native to any place. Not many people are born and raised in the middle of the ocean. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2002, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-english-people-sing-like-americans/135804/52 "2002-11-14T03:59:12Z")
But, on second thought, what does the accent spoken in Bermuda sound like? Bermuda is a British colony out in the Atlantic Ocean; the nearest mainland is North Carolina. Could it be the native land of the Mid-Atlantic accent? ---
**Author:** ![everton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ecb155/32.png) [@everton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/everton)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2002, 4:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-english-people-sing-like-americans/135804/53 "2002-11-14T04:15:13Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Jomo Mojo \* > **…a compromise between British and American and sounds equally normal on either side of the Atlantic…** Or equally _ab_normal perhaps? I suspect Ringo might have tried harder to disguise his accent because he had a stronger accent to begin with. And that’s an interesting idea about the Bermudan accent being definitively mid-Atlantic, **Jomo** , but in fact it doesn’t sound like a cross between American and British as a R&R singer’s might - it sounds West Indian. And in case anyone is in doubt, that doesn’t mean punctuating every sentence with “mon”. ---
**Author:** ![TwistofFate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/cdc98d/32.png) [@TwistofFate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TwistofFate)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2002, 1:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-english-people-sing-like-americans/135804/54 "2002-11-14T13:22:52Z")
when did Ringo hide his accent? He sounded as scouse as could be on “Octopus’ garden”. on mid-atlantic: That is not to be confused with the american “mid-atlantic” region accent, which I found out about to my detriment recently 🙂 I think it has to do with the culture ofthe music. While the Beatles were trying to sound like American Rock and Roll bands, they just couldn’t pull it off. their “Yeah, Yeah Yeah”'s in “she loves you” are pure scouse. ---
**Author:** ![everton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ecb155/32.png) [@everton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/everton)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2002, 1:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-english-people-sing-like-americans/135804/55 "2002-11-14T13:40:08Z")
Yes, you’re right about Ringo’s accent - I realised that after posting. Same story on _Act Naturally_, _With A Little Help From My Friends_ and _Yellow Submarine_ (a school bus favourite that one as I recall). He’s a bit more Californian when he speaks these days though. ---
**Author:** ![Milton\_De\_La\_Warre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e480ec/32.png) [@Milton\_De\_La\_Warre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Milton_De_La_Warre)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2002, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-english-people-sing-like-americans/135804/56 "2002-11-14T14:52:07Z")
Re: Green Day sounding “British”. To me, they sound Northern Californian (And they are from Berkeley CA), as opposed to more mumbly Southern Californian. It might be that they are somewhat British influenced, but IMHO it’s more a matter of musical style than pronounciation. Their musical style influences their delivery of the lyrics and probably also how (and when) the singer breathes while singing. That may have something to do with the “sound” referred to in the OP. In this, I have to agree with Hazel-Rah; the core of the answer is in the comment: "Britons and Americans sound similar when they sing because the prosody of singing masks features that distinguish the dialects from one another. Stress and intonation contribute to the character of dialects much more than people generally realize. Of course there are different degrees of singing. Some vocalists basically talk over the music, others actually sing." ---
**Author:** ![everton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ecb155/32.png) [@everton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/everton)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2002, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-english-people-sing-like-americans/135804/57 "2002-11-14T15:38:16Z")
Yes, the observation that _Britons and Americans sound similar when they sing because the prosody of singing masks features that distinguish the dialects from one another_ explains the phenomenon up to a point, but there are still plenty of examples of British singers deliberately attempting to sound like American ones (whether competantly or not). I’m less aware of Americans trying to sound British, but other posters have claimed that that is their impression at least. ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2002, 11:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-english-people-sing-like-americans/135804/58 "2002-11-15T23:24:40Z")
Sorry, my writing was sloppy. I meant that Ringo was the only one who didn’t try very much to compromise his accent when he sang. ---
**Author:** ![Lobsang](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobsang/32/4067_2.png) [@Lobsang](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobsang)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2002, 12:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-english-people-sing-like-americans/135804/59 "2002-11-16T00:27:36Z")
A thread that **I** started is still on the ‘front’ page even after over a week of me not venturing to the SDMB? Should I be proud of that? Probably not because it’s probably sheer fluke that I started a conversation that is worthwhile. I’m off to check where all the other threads I started on the one day of excessive SDMB posting have ended up. P.S. Isn’t it a **bitch** when you are typing away without realizing that the insert key had been inadvertantly pressed and all the text after what you are typing is disappearing. P.P.S Back to the discussion guys… ---
**Author:** ![Ins\_Outs\_What-have-yous](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/8797f3/32.png) [@Ins\_Outs\_What-have-yous](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ins_Outs_What-have-yous)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2002, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-english-people-sing-like-americans/135804/60 "2002-11-16T01:09:19Z")
A song that came to mind as I read this thread is “Wind-Up” on the _Aqualung_ album by Jethro Tull (a very British group). Singer Ian Anderson pronounces “half-assed” as if it were “hoff-assed.” The inconsistent pronunciation of the short “a” makes me laugh every time I hear that song. I suppose it would have been even funnier if he sang “half-ossed.” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-english-people-sing-like-americans/135804.md?page=2)