# Why do people do this? (Computer related) **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [February 12, 2009, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-do-this-computer-related/485464 "2009-02-12T01:29:15Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Lakai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/9de0a6/32.png) [@Lakai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lakai)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 7:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-do-this-computer-related/485464/21 "2009-02-12T07:08:58Z")
I became fearless with computers after I dealt with the following computer problems: 1. Blue screen of death. 2. Random shutdowns. 3. Black screen with the message “missing file \_\_\_\_”. 4. No internet. 5. Google results kept taking me to a porno page. Once you know what to do for each of these, testing every option in a new application isn’t so scary. It’s also amazing how many different ways you can lose an internet connection, and how focused you get when you don’t have one. However, my computer at work ran on Windows 98. If that thing broke down that meant we might lose our sale records (at least for the day, which is still bad.) Knowing that Windows 98 just crashes whenever it feels like it, I didn’t take many chances on that one. If a restart or alt+ctrl+del did not work we would call the computer guy. ---
**Author:** ![imfloating](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/bc79bd/32.png) [@imfloating](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/imfloating)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 7:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-do-this-computer-related/485464/22 "2009-02-12T07:34:37Z")
> [@Kaio](#): > > Nah. My father was the king of learned helplessness when it came to computers. Typical conversations went like this: > > dad: How do you do X on the computer? > me: Go to the File menu– > dad: --I can’t do that! File menu? Just show me. > me: _sits down and opens File menu_ The File menu is up here and then you go– > dad: I can’t do that! You do it! Just make it work. > me: :rolleyes: > > Seriously, he wouldn’t even _try_ to learn what I was teaching him. Drove me nuts. I’m probably older than dad, the king of learned helplessness, as you call him. I’m not interested in every little nuance of this damn computer. The only things I know how to do are Flight Simulator and photo shop. This computer might look to him like a two wheeler looked to you when YOU were the king of learned helplessness. ---
**Author:** ![Kaio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/c68b51/32.png) [@Kaio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kaio)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 8:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-do-this-computer-related/485464/23 "2009-02-12T08:03:55Z")
> [@imfloating](#): > > I’m probably older than dad, the king of learned helplessness, as you call him. I’m not interested in every little nuance of this damn computer. The only things I know how to do are Flight Simulator and photo shop. This computer might look to him like a two wheeler looked to you when YOU were the king of learned helplessness. Yeah, I don’t see why you feel that taking pot shots at me are necessary. If it helps, the aforementioned king of learned helplessness was like this for _years_. We got a computer at home when I started high school or thereabouts, he would still do this all the way up til I left for college. He also used a computer at work (so it wasn’t an entirely foreign object even when our home computer was new), and I have to think if he’s asking me how to do something on the computer, it’s something he actually wants to do on the computer; and if he’s asking to be taught, it would be to his benefit to actually attempt to learn. My mom, on the other hand, would actually listen and attempt to learn what you were trying to explain. And usually would learn, simply by virtue of the fact that she tried. On the other hand, I learned how to ride a two-wheeler without any help from my dad (he couldn’t be bothered), and it didn’t take me four years (or even two months) to do so. I’m not sure where you’re getting the idea that _I_ developed learned helplessness – you do know [what it means](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Learned_helplessness) right? That it’s different from real helplessness, or simply not having learned a skill yet? ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 1:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-do-this-computer-related/485464/24 "2009-02-12T13:49:38Z")
I was always fearless with computers (I’m over 50, BTW). I’d just try things and see what happened. Never had a problem. But I know that people worry they might break a computer. I once taught a class in computer graphics and the first thing I told them was “treat your computer like you do your TV set. If what you do would break your TV, then it will break your computer. If what you do wouldn’t break your TV, it won’t break your computer.” I also pointed out that no one ever broke a TV by pressing the wrong button on the remote. It helped them a lot. ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-do-this-computer-related/485464/25 "2009-02-12T14:40:40Z")
As a tech support guy, I’m a lot less bothered by very simple how-to questions (they make for an easy day) and very much more bothered by; “I’ve had this computer for five years, I’m not under warranty or paying for support, I have my whole life poured into it, I’ve never backed up or copied off a single thing _and it just crashed. GET IT BACK FOR ME!!! NOW!!! I don’t care if I’m not entitled to support! It’s all your fault! My life is ruined! Waaaaaaaaaaahhhhh!_” The worst of those were the female college students during finals week. :smack: ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-do-this-computer-related/485464/26 "2009-02-12T16:00:12Z")
> [@RealityChuck](#): > > But I know that people worry they might break a computer. I once taught a class in computer graphics and the first thing I told them was “treat your computer like you do your TV set. If what you do would break your TV, then it will break your computer. If what you do wouldn’t break your TV, it won’t break your computer.” I also pointed out that no one ever broke a TV by pressing the wrong button on the remote. > > It helped them a lot. Unfortunately, in general, that’s not true. When was the last time your TV set got a virus that messed up the registry? I think much of the problem is that people, myself included, don’t know how to ask the question. “I want to make the text bigger.” I go to Firefox Help and type in “make text bigger”. > [@](#): > > 0 search results for "make text bigger " > No pages matched the search criteria > > Can’t find what you’re looking for? Ask a support question instead! So I go to “Ask a support question” and type “make text bigger”. I get exactly the same screen. I get this with my dad all the time. He is really trying to learn, but he doesn’t know where to start. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Hypno-Toad](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b2d939/32.png) [@Hypno-Toad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hypno-Toad)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-do-this-computer-related/485464/27 "2009-02-12T16:00:25Z")
The learned helplessness comes close to the reason why some people are like this. They don’t want you to _teach_ them how to do it. They want _you_ to do it. Therefore, they won’t learn. Give a man a fish, and he eats for a day. Teach a man to fish, and now he has to work for his food. ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-do-this-computer-related/485464/28 "2009-02-12T16:10:32Z")
I’m quite fearless myself when it comes to tampering with the software side, but I don’t like opening up the innards of my laptop. I always end up with extra screws! In the interest of learning something else while I’m in here, could anyone tell me where the error messages from BSOD’s are kept within the hard drive? Also is there a folder that stores all your firefox bookmarks - apart from the ones you create within the program? ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Mudd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f14d63/32.png) [@Larry\_Mudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Mudd)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-do-this-computer-related/485464/29 "2009-02-12T17:14:35Z")
> [@Hypno-Toad](#): > > The learned helplessness comes close to the reason why some people are like this. They don’t want you to _teach_ them how to do it. They want _you_ to do it. Therefore, they won’t learn. > > Give a man a fish, and he eats for a day. > Teach a man to fish, and now he has to work for his food. I tend to provide options for both personality types. Here’s a recent example. (We moved our database to a new server, breaking people’s shortcuts.) > [@](#): > > From: Ann \*\*\*\*\* > Sent: February-11-09 12:11 AM > To: Larry \*\*\*\* > Subject: yardi > > Hi Larry, > > My Yardi doesn’t work anymore…help? > > * * * > > From: Larry \*\*\*\* > Sent: February-11-09 9:51 AM > To: Ann \*\*\*\*\* > Subject: RE: yardi > > Hi, Ann - > > You have two options for fixing this, pick whichever one works better for you: > > A: > > • Right-click the short-cut you use to get to Yardi, and select “properties.” > • Change the URL to http://[SERVER]/Voyager/Pages/Login.aspx > • Click “Apply” > • Click “OK” > > B: > > • When you get into the office and log in, call the monkey to come downstairs. He doesn’t mind. > > * * * > > From: Ann \*\*\*\*\* > Sent: February-11-09 10:08 AM > To: Larry \*\*\*\* > Subject: RE: yardi > > I think I need the monkey…I am completely computer illiterate. > > Ann \*\*\*\*\* Some people like to be as self-reliant as possible, and other people have just decided that they’re better off not touching _anything_. Anyone could follow the instructions above, but some people are always going to prefer to let someone else do it. ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-do-this-computer-related/485464/30 "2009-02-12T17:31:29Z")
Eh, the other day I had a retired military officer attempting to order me to violate federal laws and company policies because while she claimed to have worked with computers in the military, she clearly didn’t know how to actually use them. She only knew how to very loudly and angrily order other people to use them. She was trying to access government sites to get at her pension and retirement information. At the user prompt, she was typing in her (free public company) e-mail address and e-mail password. (:p) When I asked her if she had her accounts set up on the government servers, she screamed at me that she didn’t care what the problem was, she wanted me to fix it. She got quite upset when I stated that I could not set up accounts on _federal government_ computers for her. Since I’m not allowed to speak my mind to such people like I could with previous tech support jobs, I just let her get upset at me and hang up. Bye bye! I’m certain that this person is going to enjoy the real world a whole lot if she’s not capable of doing anything herself and just knows how to scream at others to make it happen. And on the other end, I’m quite certain that our military is better off having one less of these jackasses in it’s officer ranks. ---
**Author:** ![GusNSpot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gusnspot/32/436_2.png) [@GusNSpot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GusNSpot)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-do-this-computer-related/485464/31 "2009-02-12T17:34:49Z")
I like to know how to do stuff and find 16 different ways to make the computer do them. But … I’m old, I forget, things don’t go wrong regularly, I forget how I fixed them cause I don’t practice fixing them, I know I used to know how to fix that because I did it before, so now I’m pissed at myself and start doing things without thinking about it and then it is gone for good, or lets all the smoke out and then I have to buy new things with the smoke still inside and I have lost the stuff I want inside them and then I go pound my head against the wall. This cause blood to flow and make a mess on the floor and wall. Computers are bad for my health, ☹ ---
**Author:** ![AHunter3](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ahunter3/32/368_2.png) [@AHunter3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AHunter3)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-do-this-computer-related/485464/32 "2009-02-12T18:00:22Z")
I think I learned the computer at the absolute perfect time to become acquainted with computers. Just a few years prior, doing stuff on the computer meant writing your own code in fortran and making up a deck of punch cards, and all that just to do something simple like sort an array of information and print it. Just a few years later and one’s operating system and commercial program files were these sprawlingly complex things, folders inside of folders and batches of files with arcane names and shared libraries and preferences and whatnot. But for this short little golden period, the Macintosh operating system consisted of two and only two necessary files, which could be anywhere as long as they were “next to each other”, plus about 4 other less-critical files that would normally also be in the System Folder; any program (application) would be a single file unto itself and could be anywhere at all also. Without taking any course or reading any instructional materials, just from trial and error, anyone with even a fragment of curiosity could quickly find how to create a new bootable disk, how to put a copy of an application on a disk, even things like moving a font from one copy of the operating system to another. We all carried our entire computing environments in our shirt pockets back then — it was the heyday of the 800K floppy disk. I’m afraid most of us were software pirates, as the operating system itself was free and the apps that came with it as well, and the notion that software existed for which the rules were otherwise was a totally foreign concept to us. When hard disks came onto the scene in a big way, it was easy to transfer our knowledge to the environment characterized by vastly more storage space. I admit I don’t know how it is that others who did their term papers on the same 512Ke’s using the same MacWrite word processing software did not poke around and learn that if “LaserWriter” had been moved out of the System Folder that would explain why you could not print, or that if you save your term paper to the hard disk and eject the floppy and leave, your term paper is being left behind on the computer. I retain an attitude towards software: if I have to actually crack open a manual to even get started, if I can’t figure out most of it just by clicking around, it’s probably a piece of crap anyhow. Good sofware should be self-explanatory. ---
**Author:** ![Anne\_Neville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Anne\_Neville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anne_Neville)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-do-this-computer-related/485464/33 "2009-02-12T18:20:12Z")
I actually learned how to zoom in and out on pages in Firefox by putting a book in front of my computer. One of the corners was resting on the Control key. Then I tried to use the mouse wheel to move up and down in a web page, as I normally do, and- why isn’t it scrolling, and why does the text keep getting bigger and smaller? > [@kunilou](#): > > I’m in my 50s. I’ve been using computers daily for 25 years (and I wasn’t even an early adopter.) To this day, I have a nagging fear that if I try to tinker with something THE COMPUTER WILL BLOW UP, the hard drive will melt and I’ll not only lose the computer but every piece of data I ever typed – even if I typed it on a different computer and backed it up six different ways. I am also convinced that the hard copies I have in the file cabinet across the room will burst into flames. Mom? I didn’t know you were a Doper. And why are you lying about your age? My mom also believed that any email that said it came from my email address could not possibly have a virus in it, because I had a security clearance. ---
**Author:** ![TroubleAgain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e480ec/32.png) [@TroubleAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TroubleAgain)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-do-this-computer-related/485464/34 "2009-02-12T18:44:12Z")
I put it down to laziness. “Hmmm, I want to do thing A. I can either take 10 minutes reading help pages to figure it out, or I can ask someone who already knows.” ---
**Author:** ![beowulff](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/beowulff/32/542_2.png) [@beowulff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/beowulff)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-do-this-computer-related/485464/35 "2009-02-12T18:49:53Z")
> [@TroubleAgain](#): > > I put it down to laziness. “Hmmm, I want to do thing A. I can either take 10 minutes reading help pages to figure it out, or I can ask someone who already knows.” There is some truth to that… After the millionth time of answering some inane computer question for a friend of mine, I put down the phone, turned to a mutual friend and said “He’ll pick up the phone before he picks up his brain.” ---
**Author:** ![imfloating](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/bc79bd/32.png) [@imfloating](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/imfloating)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-do-this-computer-related/485464/36 "2009-02-12T18:57:06Z")
> [@Kaio](#): > > Yeah, I don’t see why you feel that taking pot shots at me are necessary. > > If it helps, the aforementioned king of learned helplessness was like this for _years_. We got a computer at home when I started high school or thereabouts, he would still do this all the way up til I left for college. He also used a computer at work (so it wasn’t an entirely foreign object even when our home computer was new), and I have to think if he’s asking me how to do something on the computer, it’s something he actually wants to do on the computer; and if he’s asking to be taught, it would be to his benefit to actually attempt to learn. My mom, on the other hand, would actually listen and attempt to learn what you were trying to explain. And usually would learn, simply by virtue of the fact that she tried. > > On the other hand, I learned how to ride a two-wheeler without any help from my dad (he couldn’t be bothered), and it didn’t take me four years (or even two months) to do so. I’m not sure where you’re getting the idea that _I_ developed learned helplessness – you do know [what it means](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Learned_helplessness) right? That it’s different from real helplessness, or simply not having learned a skill yet? Didn’t mean to take a pot shot. It just seemed like you weren’t showing any patience, but now I see how you could lose it. ---
**Author:** ![Zsofia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/7bcc69/32.png) [@Zsofia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zsofia)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-do-this-computer-related/485464/37 "2009-02-12T19:04:59Z")
> [@Anne\_Neville](#): > > I actually learned how to zoom in and out on pages in Firefox by putting a book in front of my computer. One of the corners was resting on the Control key. Then I tried to use the mouse wheel to move up and down in a web page, as I normally do, and- why isn’t it scrolling, and why does the text keep getting bigger and smaller? HOLY CRAP! That’s awesome! ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-do-this-computer-related/485464/38 "2009-02-12T19:13:16Z")
Don’t keep us in suspense - what book was it? Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![iamthewalrus\_3](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/258eb7/32.png) [@iamthewalrus\_3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iamthewalrus_3)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-do-this-computer-related/485464/39 "2009-02-12T19:30:57Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > I think much of the problem is that people, myself included, don’t know how to ask the question. > > “I want to make the text bigger.” I go to Firefox Help and type in “make text bigger”. > > So I go to “Ask a support question” and type “make text bigger”. > > I get exactly the same screen. > > I get this with my dad all the time. He is really trying to learn, but he doesn’t know where to start. This is a really good point about the failings of computers trying to tell humans how to use them. You have to know what to ask. One thing you could suggest to your Dad is to think about searching for the _noun_ he wants to interact with rather than the _desired outcome_ or _action_ he wants to take. Part of the reason for this is simply that there are so many verbs that mean the same sort of thing, and a search is generally only going to match if you guessed the same word that the guy writing the documentation used. For example, you could write his question as “enlargen text”, “make text bigger”, “magnify text”, “increase text size”, etc. On an even broader scale, he could describe the problem as “can’t read text”, “words too small”, etc. The odds that you’ll hit useful help information when there are so many ways to describe the problem are low. But if you think about the _noun_ involved, it’s pretty much necessarily going to be either “text size” or “font size” Both of those search phrases, by the way, produce results in Firefox’s help search that will get you where you want to go. Now, it would be nice if help were better about this, but note that it’s not limited to automated help. Anyone who’s worked in tech support can tell you stories about how someone calls in with the stated problem of “my email won’t work”, and the resolution ends up being something like the computer’s not plugged in. People tend to be goal-driven, so we focus on what we want to do, rather than what’s actually keeping us from doing it. But the way to troubleshoot something is to figure out what’s standing in the way and resolve that. So the natural human perspective is somewhat at odds with efficient problem solving. That’s why one of the first things that a (good) tech will do is get you out of the (very human) mode of thinking about the desired outcome, and ask you specific questions about what you did (“when you say you tried to send email, do you mean that you clicked on the Send Email button?”) or what you see (“Describe what’s on the screen right now”). There are just too many ways that things can go wrong, so narrowing down to a very specific issue will make both automated and human tech support work better. ---
**Author:** ![SmartAleq](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smartaleq/32/163_2.png) [@SmartAleq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SmartAleq)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-do-this-computer-related/485464/40 "2009-02-12T19:31:54Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > I think much of the problem is that people, myself included, don’t know how to ask the question. > > “I want to make the text bigger.” I go to Firefox Help and type in “make text bigger”. > > So I go to “Ask a support question” and type “make text bigger”. > > I get exactly the same screen. > > I get this with my dad all the time. He is really trying to learn, but he doesn’t know where to start. Now, if instead of going to Firefox Help you just go straight to Google and type in “firefox make text larger” you get as the first result [this very helpful page](http://www.bbc.co.uk/accessibility/win/seeing/text/browser/sub_3.shtml). Not to mention you can set Google preferences to suggest search terms for you–if you have that enabled and start typing the search string above you’ll have it as an option when you’ve typed as far as “firefox mak.” I’m at a loss how anybody can remain totally clueless with a resource like Google just a click away. My husband does tech support from home and after listening to his calls I’ve lost all hope for mankind, technologically speaking. There’s a whole huge world of abysmal and wilfull ignorance out there just bubbling away. The fact that a substantial percentage of computer users do not know and apparently will not learn that an address bar is NOT the same thing as a search bar and will NOT give identical results if you type something in there is a strong indication that we’re all gonna be headed toward a technological apocalypse sometime soon. Age does not appear to be a common factor in this sort of ignorance–he’s had 85 year olds who were infinitely more savvy than those in their '20s and '30s. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-do-this-computer-related/485464.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-do-this-computer-related/485464.md?page=3)