# Why do people engage in long exchanges with trolls? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [January 15, 2018, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-engage-in-long-exchanges-with-trolls/806719 "2018-01-15T21:46:39Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2018, 12:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-engage-in-long-exchanges-with-trolls/806719/21 "2018-01-16T00:19:29Z")
I don’t really argue with people who are combative or unlikely to see reason, but I have a hard time applying the label ‘‘troll’’ in a lot of cases. I kind of extend the benefit of a doubt. I’m stupid naive, and I’m okay with that. I once almost sold my laptop to a scammer on ebay. He had me ship to Indonesia and paid with an Austrailian checking account he said with his cousin’s account. ebay called me tell me it was a scam right after I dropped off the package, but I got it back. This is a true story. This is the level of naivety you are dealing with. My husband never lets me hear the end of it. The answer ''why do I engage trolls?" is because I’m not convinced they are trolls. And I think a lot of time people are deemed to be trolls just because of an unpopular opinion. I don’t buy into that school of thought. People hold some wacky sincerely held beliefs. As long as people are respectful I’m interested in exploring those beliefs. For science. The only time I did the back and forth with a now banned poster was this guy who seriously felt like he came out of the 1850s with regard to his racism. I kept that thread going a long time just to scream insults at him (I think it’s an Omnibus thread now.) I eventually apologized for screaming insults at him, cuz that’s how I roll. But he was banned not long after. I’d like to think I contributed. My only real regret is apologizing. But even like 45 pages deep into that thread I was still like, ‘‘oh, but this is a person.’’ ---
**Author:** ![F.U.Shakespeare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/aca169/32.png) [@F.U.Shakespeare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/F.U.Shakespeare)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2018, 12:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-engage-in-long-exchanges-with-trolls/806719/22 "2018-01-16T00:21:42Z")
Debating with people I disagree with can force me to test my beliefs, which strengthens and/or corrects them. Exchanges with trolls offer less of this benefit. But some debates start out as substantive discussions, and deteriorate into trollfests, often when invaded by trolls. In such settings, it can be hard to know when (and with whom) to end the dialog. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2018, 12:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-engage-in-long-exchanges-with-trolls/806719/23 "2018-01-16T00:22:22Z")
@ **Spice** I certainly don’t intend to be demeaning here, but when I read your posts, the word that comes to mind most often is “adorable”, meant in the best possible way. I think you’re awesome! ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2018, 12:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-engage-in-long-exchanges-with-trolls/806719/24 "2018-01-16T00:34:00Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > @ **Spice** I certainly don’t intend to be demeaning here, but when I read your posts, the word that comes to mind most often is “adorable”, meant in the best possible way. I think you’re awesome! Thanks! I enjoy our conversations. Diversity of opinion is rather important, I think. ---
**Author:** ![HoneyBadgerDC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/honeybadgerdc/32/1033_2.png) [@HoneyBadgerDC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HoneyBadgerDC)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2018, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-engage-in-long-exchanges-with-trolls/806719/25 "2018-01-16T00:42:51Z")
> [@Spice\_Weasel](#): > > Thanks! I enjoy our conversations. Diversity of opinion is rather important, I think. I enjoy your posts as well, you have always struck me an objective voice of reason. Most of the time anyway. ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2018, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-engage-in-long-exchanges-with-trolls/806719/26 "2018-01-16T01:01:05Z")
> [@Balthisar](#): > > I don’t know if I’m the troll, or if the other guy is the troll. For the purpose of this discussion, it doesn’t matter. As I said in the OP: > [@ThelmaLou](#): > > … I realize troll-ishness is (somewhat) in the eye of the beholder, so let me slightly rephrase my question this way: why do you (if you are one who does this) go back and forth and back and forth page after page post after post with someone who is on the opposite side of your belief and who has never shown any side of budging or changing? … Do you go back and forth endlessly with someone who disagrees with you and has never shown any signs of changing or even seeing your point? ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2018, 1:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-engage-in-long-exchanges-with-trolls/806719/27 "2018-01-16T01:08:25Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > Maybe this belongs in ATMB. Not sure. > > Serious question. I realize troll-ishness is (somewhat) in the eye of the beholder, so let me slightly rephrase my question this way: why do you (if you are one who does this) go back and forth and back and forth page after page post after post with someone who is on the opposite side of your belief and who has never shown any side of budging or changing? In some threads, these back-and-forths can go on for many pages. Eventually the exchanges deteriorate into name-calling, “Your mother wears army boots!” “No, YOUR mother!” “You’re a puppet!” “No, YOU’RE the puppet!” And worse. Sometimes ending (temporarily) with a mod warning. > > And these exchanges often go on between the same pair of posters and among the same groups of posters. > > I want to understand why. > > Is it because each side thinks it will have the last word? Surely, it’s not because either side thinks it can change the other side’s mind. > > And for the people who do it here, do you do the same thing IRL? Do you argue with your right-wing or left-wing cousin, mother-in-law, neighbor, colleague, pastor, coach, offspring ENDLESSLY when neither of you has budged on the topic… well, _ever_? > > They say that rats in a maze will eventually stop going down a tunnel when the cheese is removed. Not so, people. So I hypothesize that \*someone \*is getting metaphorical/symbolic cheese from this practice… what is the payoff? Why do you care what others do with their time? But to answer your question, sometimes a so-called troll, has points worth responding to. ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2018, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-engage-in-long-exchanges-with-trolls/806719/28 "2018-01-16T01:30:42Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > @ **Spice** I certainly don’t intend to be demeaning here, but when I read your posts, the word that comes to mind most often is “adorable”, meant in the best possible way. I think you’re awesome! And this qualifies her to be a moderator… How? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![jerez](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/c68b51/32.png) [@jerez](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jerez)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2018, 8:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-engage-in-long-exchanges-with-trolls/806719/29 "2018-01-16T08:12:54Z")
Maybe sometimes they’re the same person? In the 1980s, in the “personals” section of The Reader, there was a long-standing exchange between two people who signed as “The Bootmaster” and “The Footman” and shared a foot fetish, as I recall. It used to make me laugh to think they were the same person. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2018, 10:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-engage-in-long-exchanges-with-trolls/806719/30 "2018-01-16T10:09:05Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > That makes a \*little \*sense. > I guess you’ve figured out that \*that \*doesn’t work. > > Every now and then someone on this board admits they’re wrong (I have) or does change their mind, but I don’t think it’s ever been one of the authentic trolls. I’ve never had someone admit to changing their mind, but plenty have stopped trolling or left in a storm. I can’t recall any of mine, but I recall Bricker taking out Beryl\_Mooncalf. ---
**Author:** ![Grrr](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grrr/32/146_2.png) [@Grrr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grrr)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2018, 10:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-engage-in-long-exchanges-with-trolls/806719/31 "2018-01-16T10:19:08Z")
Boxers usually need someone to spar with before their title fight. ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2018, 10:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-engage-in-long-exchanges-with-trolls/806719/32 "2018-01-16T10:48:42Z")
There’s also _quasi_-trolling. People who argue in circular, self-indulgent ways, where it takes a while to realize what they’ve been really saying is “I don’t like X, so prove otherwise while I judge.” ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2018, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-engage-in-long-exchanges-with-trolls/806719/33 "2018-01-16T14:55:32Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > MI realize troll-ishness is (somewhat) in the eye of the beholder, so let me slightly rephrase my question this way: why do you (if you are one who does this) go back and forth and back and forth page after page post after post with someone who is on the opposite side of your belief and who has never shown any side of budging or changing? In some threads, these back-and-forths can go on for many pages. You need to distinguish between cases where it’s the same arguments being repeated again and again and cases where it’s new arguments in support of the same broader position. ---
**Author:** ![Balthisar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/balthisar/32/2825_2.png) [@Balthisar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Balthisar)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2018, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-engage-in-long-exchanges-with-trolls/806719/34 "2018-01-16T15:04:41Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > Do you go back and forth endlessly with someone who disagrees with you and has never shown any signs of changing or even seeing your point? Sometimes, but so does the other guy! ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2018, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-engage-in-long-exchanges-with-trolls/806719/35 "2018-01-16T15:25:08Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > Every now and then someone on this board admits they’re wrong (I have) or does change their mind, but I don’t think it’s ever been one of the authentic trolls. There have been trolls that pretend to come to an epiphany and showily apologize, only to keep on with their former opinions/behavior in later threads. ---
**Author:** ![DrCube](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a3d4f5/32.png) [@DrCube](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrCube)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2018, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-engage-in-long-exchanges-with-trolls/806719/36 "2018-01-16T15:26:43Z")
I don’t do the hundreds of posts back and forth like the OP is referring to, but I do sharpen my debating skills (and my teaching/writing/speaking skills) by practicing online. Often with people who turn out to be trolls, or else such morons that they might as well be trolls. I still think there’s some value to other readers, even if the troll won’t ever change their mind. So it’s mainly something I do for myself (“if you can’t teach it to a freshman, you don’t really understand it yourself” – Feynman, paraphrased), but also because I do think it helps clarify or convince bystanders, even if the person you’re debating will never change their mind. ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2018, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-engage-in-long-exchanges-with-trolls/806719/37 "2018-01-16T15:47:28Z")
> [@Fotheringay-Phipps](#): > > You need to distinguish between cases where it’s the same arguments being repeated again and again and cases where it’s new arguments in support of the same broader position. Oh, that’s hilarious coming from you! 😃 I’m not qualified to do that, but you are the expert, so by all means, have at it. \ The phrase “dog with a bone” leaps to mind. > [@Balthisar](#): > > Sometimes, but so does the other guy! Yeah! So there! _“Ma, He’s touching me-- make him stop!-- he started it!”_ You guys are cracking me up. > [@DrCube](#): > > I don’t do the hundreds of posts back and forth like the OP is referring to, but I do sharpen my debating skills (and my teaching/writing/speaking skills) by practicing online. Often with people who turn out to be trolls, or else such morons that they might as well be trolls. I still think there’s some value to other readers, even if the troll won’t ever change their mind. > > So it’s mainly something I do for myself (“if you can’t teach it to a freshman, you don’t really understand it yourself” – Feynman, paraphrased), but also because I do think it helps clarify or convince bystanders, even if the person you’re debating will never change their mind. That makes a certain amount of sense. Thank you. \ ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2018, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-engage-in-long-exchanges-with-trolls/806719/38 "2018-01-16T15:59:28Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > Oh, that’s hilarious coming from you! 😃 I’m not qualified to do that, but you are the expert, so by all means, have at it. \ That goes a ways towards explaining the OP. ---
**Author:** ![kopek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kopek/32/337_2.png) [@kopek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kopek)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2018, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-engage-in-long-exchanges-with-trolls/806719/39 "2018-01-16T17:54:34Z")
> [@F.U.Shakespeare](#): > > Debating with people I disagree with can force me to test my beliefs, which strengthens and/or corrects them. > > Exchanges with trolls offer less of this benefit. But some debates start out as substantive discussions, and deteriorate into trollfests, often when invaded by trolls. > > In such settings, it can be hard to know when (and with whom) to end the dialog. This. I have done it a time or two, mostly on other boards, basically to flesh out for myself just what I think and why - an exercise in organizing my thoughts. Even with an obvious troll I can get some benefit from it as long as I remember to hit the escape key at the appropriate time. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2018, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-engage-in-long-exchanges-with-trolls/806719/40 "2018-01-16T22:12:19Z")
> [@Spice\_Weasel](#): > > I don’t really argue with people who are combative or unlikely to see reason, but I have a hard time applying the label ‘‘troll’’ in a lot of cases. Yes. It’s often misdefined as “people with opinions I despise and who annoy me when they fail to be convinced by my brilliance”. My tolerance for multi-page knockdown-drag-outs on the Dope has fallen to near zero, and I don’t hang out anywhere else where they still exist. Getting into occasional brief exchanges with dingbats keeps one’s rapier-like wit finely honed, plus rarely the loons can surprise you with nuttery you haven’t heard before. Once you’ve impaled them on the dazzlingly sharp points of your rhetoric, it isn’t really sporting to hang around to watch them wriggle. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-engage-in-long-exchanges-with-trolls/806719.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-engage-in-long-exchanges-with-trolls/806719.md?page=3)