# Why do people join fringe groups? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [May 9, 2012, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-join-fringe-groups/621405 "2012-05-09T16:44:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2012, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-join-fringe-groups/621405/1 "2012-05-09T16:44:14Z")
I’m talking _really_ fringe groups- like open Neo-Nazis. Have any studies been done? I wonder if, through research, anyone has come up with a conclusion like “Most people in fringe groups had X happen in their upbringing”, or “most were abused as children”, or something like that. ---
**Author:** ![dolphinboy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dolphinboy/32/330_2.png) [@dolphinboy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dolphinboy)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2012, 4:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-join-fringe-groups/621405/2 "2012-05-09T16:58:14Z")
I am not a psychologist or an anthropologist, but I would guess it all has to do with wanting to be a member of a tribe… any tribe. For social misfits there are a limited number of groups that would accept them, however a neo-Nazi group may be looking for some new members and friends or relatives of existing members may be invited to join. While most people wouldn’t want anything to do with a fringe group there are always a few that are lonely or isolated enough that they would be interested in joining. I think some people love the attention they get being a member of a hated group. In short, I think that all humans instinctively want to be a member of a group or tribe, and for some that means a fringe group or cult. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2012, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-join-fringe-groups/621405/3 "2012-05-09T17:16:39Z")
On any kind of curve or scale you can measure, a small number of people will be found at the far fringes. To put a number on it, 0.27% of the population will be more than three standard deviations from the norm assuming a normal distribution. There are over 200,000,000 adults in America. That’s 540,000 at the extremes. A half million people will fill up scads of nut groups purely by chance. You don’t need to presume that they were all abused or any other childhood trauma. It’s possible that trauma will led to aberrant behavior, of course. But you somehow have to sort that out from the high background noise of people just being naturally different. ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2012, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-join-fringe-groups/621405/4 "2012-05-09T17:22:17Z")
> [@dolphinboy](#): > > … > In short, I think that all humans instinctively want to be a member of a group or tribe, and for some that means a fringe group or cult. I’m not sure I ever wanted to be a member of a group or tribe. I’m not being flippant. ---
**Author:** ![dolphinboy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dolphinboy/32/330_2.png) [@dolphinboy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dolphinboy)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2012, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-join-fringe-groups/621405/5 "2012-05-09T17:29:24Z")
> [@Leaffan](#): > > I’m not sure I ever wanted to be a member of a group or tribe. I’m not being flippant. So you never felt that you were part of your family? You are a true loner with no desire to associate with other people? I don’t think a true anti-social person would join any kind of group, fringe or otherwise… ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2012, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-join-fringe-groups/621405/6 "2012-05-09T17:32:33Z")
> [@dolphinboy](#): > > So you never felt that you were part of your family? You are a true loner with no desire to associate with other people? > > I don’t think a true anti-social person would join any kind of group, fringe or otherwise… By default I was part of my family. I never joined any clubs or gangs or tribes or anything. I played softball and hockey. I guess that might count. ---
**Author:** ![Si\_Amigo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/si_amigo/32/2877_2.png) [@Si\_Amigo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Si_Amigo)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2012, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-join-fringe-groups/621405/7 "2012-05-09T17:50:50Z")
> [@Leaffan](#): > > By default I was part of my family. I never joined any clubs or gangs or tribes or anything. I played softball and hockey. I guess that might count. I was more less forced to play baseball and participate in gym classes myself; never had any desire join team sports of my own choice. I don’t even follow sports teams (local or proven winners) and could care less if teams win or lose; even when we are in the finals. But I am functional in society, have friends, date and do individual type actives like swimming, jogging and working out. So no, not everyone wants to be part of a tribe. The people I’ve known who join fringe groups were mostly had some sort of prejudice in some way; either racial or a religious bias/slant. They basically couldn’t hang out with “normal” crowds without getting into confrontations; thus they hang out with there own and justify each others beliefs. Screwed up though they may be. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2012, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-join-fringe-groups/621405/8 "2012-05-09T17:58:50Z")
You’re here, aren’t you? We’re a tribe. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2012, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-join-fringe-groups/621405/9 "2012-05-09T18:43:33Z")
Tribes in sociology cover thousands of different types of associations. You - all you who are saying you don’t want to be part of a tribe - are probably part of dozens, if not hundreds of tribes. And to re-emphasize what Alessan said, the mere fact you are here shows that you want to be part of a tribe. Once you understand that, you can look at your life and start seeing the dozens of other tribes it implies. ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2012, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-join-fringe-groups/621405/10 "2012-05-09T18:45:15Z")
Dozens? I seriously doubt that, let alone hundreds. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2012, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-join-fringe-groups/621405/11 "2012-05-09T19:20:51Z")
> [@Leaffan](#): > > By default I was part of my family. I never joined any clubs or gangs or tribes or anything. I played softball and hockey. I guess that might count. I thought you were a Maple Leaf fan? ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2012, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-join-fringe-groups/621405/12 "2012-05-09T19:23:21Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > I thought you were a Maple Leaf fan? Whatever made you think that? 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2012, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-join-fringe-groups/621405/13 "2012-05-09T19:35:52Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > I thought you were a Maple Leaf fan? Identifying with a sports team is pretty tribal (in my experience).🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Svejk\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ea666f/32.png) [@Svejk\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Svejk_1)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2012, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-join-fringe-groups/621405/14 "2012-05-09T20:07:21Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > On any kind of curve or scale you can measure, a small number of people will be found at the far fringes. To put a number on it, 0.27% of the population will be more than three standard deviations from the norm assuming a normal distribution. There are over 200,000,000 adults in America. That’s 540,000 at the extremes. > > A half million people will fill up scads of nut groups purely by chance. You don’t need to presume that they were all abused or any other childhood trauma. > > It’s possible that trauma will led to aberrant behavior, of course. But you somehow have to sort that out from the high background noise of people just being naturally different. Why do you assume that American adults are 1) normally distributed along a political spectrum; 2) that the position on that spectrum that one occupies is more or less randomly determined? You make it sound as though some people will just end up on the fringes because someone has to be there by definition. That is not an explanation, though, as it does not address why some individuals end up around the median whereas others don’t. The same is true for the ‘belonging’ argument - sure, people like to belong to groups larger than themselves, I’ll buy that, but why _those_ groups? I’m only fleetingly familiar with the political psychology literature that studies this, but on the basis of what I know I would argue that one would have to take individual level factors such as personality into account to explain that. In addition, a key factor is going to be association or socialization. People join fringe groups much in the way they join other groups: once they’re invited to do so by friends or family, people they admire or trust, This then raises the question - how did the friends join? Because of _their_ friends? What about _those_ friends? Where did the cycle start? It moves the question towards that of leadership - who has the sense of political efficacy, the belief they can accomplish things politically, the feeling that they matter, in a way that is sufficient to belie scepticism and start up a political movement? That is a fundamentally different question, of course, than the question of why people join movements, even fringe ones, that are already there, which is a matter of followership rather than leadership. ---
**Author:** ![Si\_Amigo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/si_amigo/32/2877_2.png) [@Si\_Amigo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Si_Amigo)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2012, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-join-fringe-groups/621405/15 "2012-05-09T20:43:06Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > You’re here, aren’t you? We’re a tribe. A small but mighty tribe; one where you rarely if ever meet each other; that’s my speed. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2012, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-join-fringe-groups/621405/16 "2012-05-09T23:59:41Z")
> [@Svejk\_1](#): > > That is a fundamentally different question, of course, than the question of why people join movements, even fringe ones, that are already there, which is a matter of followership rather than leadership. If accounts are accurate, Adolf Eichmann became a Nazi because he didn’t get into the Masons. But why assume that people join fringe groups for reasons different than non-fringe groups? ---
**Author:** ![samclem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a9a28c/32.png) [@samclem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/samclem)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2012, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-join-fringe-groups/621405/17 "2012-05-10T00:23:24Z")
Moving this from General Questions to IMHO. While there will be many factual answers, there will be many opinions. This move will allow both. **samclem** , Moderator ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2012, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-join-fringe-groups/621405/18 "2012-05-10T01:28:18Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > I thought you were a Maple Leaf fan? I thought he was a Ryan Leaf fan? But yeah, putting your fringe group affiliation into your own username is a sort of a dead giveaway. As anyone who recognizes mine can figure out. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2012, 1:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-join-fringe-groups/621405/19 "2012-05-10T01:42:18Z")
> [@Leaffan](#): > > By default I was part of my family. I never joined any clubs or gangs or tribes or anything. I played softball and hockey. I guess that might count. You a fan of any sports teams, Leaffan? All kidding aside, that’s tribalism in a VERY weak form. Being a fan of a sports team is exactly what the OP is talking about - except that you aren’t on the fringe, you’re in a really common, accepted sort of group. The reason you like things like hockey games instead of Nazi rallies probably has a lot to do with your first response - that you feel like a member of your family and have found companionship in mundane things like softball. You don’t need to join fringe groups or groups with really high social barriers of entry, because as a normally adjusted person, you don’t need them. You have family and friends and acquaintances in profusion. Most people are like that. People who join neo-Nazi groups, or other fringe groups, generally lack the well adjusted nature and experiences of you or me. They are often socially maladjusted, have weak parental examples, are outcasts, or have psychological problems or emotional traumas that make them seek out extremely strong bonds with others in unusual circumstances. ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2012, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-join-fringe-groups/621405/20 "2012-05-10T01:52:54Z")
I never really associated being a fan of a particular team as being a member of a club or group. Do fans of say, Desperate Housewives consider themselves to be part of an exclusive club? Your comments on fringe groups makes perfect sense **RickJay**. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-people-join-fringe-groups/621405.md?page=2)