# Why do police not show up in court for traffic cases? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [March 13, 2018, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-police-not-show-up-in-court-for-traffic-cases/810490 "2018-03-13T14:52:21Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2018, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-police-not-show-up-in-court-for-traffic-cases/810490/61 "2018-03-15T17:11:18Z")
> [@pkbites](#): > > I’m down there every other week and have never seen this. And if it’s so I have to wonder what their tolerance is. Somewhere above 80 is usually when they might start to care. That’s why, in my experience again, the flow of traffic tends to level off at that speed. That said, I’ve been pulled over by a state trooper and given a written warning (which I didn’t even know cops did around here) for doing 70 in a 55, just outside city limits on I-55. (Somewhere between the intersection of 294 and Harlem.) ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2018, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-police-not-show-up-in-court-for-traffic-cases/810490/62 "2018-03-15T17:17:26Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > (Somewhere between the intersection of 294 and Harlem.) Somewhere between the intersections of I-55 and 294 and I-55 and Harlem. I just realized that was a butchered sentence. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2018, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-police-not-show-up-in-court-for-traffic-cases/810490/63 "2018-03-15T18:01:39Z")
> [@zimaane](#): > > My wife disputed a traffic ticket for stopping to drop off people in the middle of the street in Washington D.C. The officer showed up, in uniform. My wife disputed an expired registration ticket and the cop showed up in uniform - **and a flak jacket.** Then took the opportunity to “question” her by asking “How dare you drive in MY city with an unregistered car. Why were you driving it?” FTR: It was because the dealer never delivered the title and we could not register it properly and had to jump through hoops every 4 weeks to register it in person - and in Colorado you have to go to the county office it is registered in so fuck you if you work 80 miles away from 8 to 5 and can’t take off one day a month to re-register your car. FTFR: We found out that Colorado is a strict liability state so it doesn’t matter that the seller screwed you over and how impossible the law is. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2018, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-police-not-show-up-in-court-for-traffic-cases/810490/64 "2018-03-15T18:43:27Z")
> [@Saint\_Cad](#): > > My wife disputed an expired registration ticket and the cop showed up in uniform - **and a flak jacket.** Then took the opportunity to “question” her by asking “How dare you drive in MY city with an unregistered car. Why were you driving it?” > > FTR: It was because the dealer never delivered the title and we could not register it properly and had to jump through hoops every 4 weeks to register it in person - and in Colorado you have to go to the county office it is registered in so fuck you if you work 80 miles away from 8 to 5 and can’t take off one day a month to re-register your car. > FTFR: We found out that Colorado is a strict liability state so it doesn’t matter that the seller screwed you over and how impossible the law is. That’s not how I understand strict liability. It is the responsibility of the driver to ensure the vehicle is registered and insured (if needed)and in good working order. Strict liability doesn’t mean that the person you think screwed up is responsible. If anything I would think strict liability would mean the owner would get the ticket regardless of who is driving. Maybe a lawyer can clarify that. Doubtful it’s a flak jacket. Probably an outer vest carrier. Smart departments who ignore the idiotic it looks military arguement are going more towards outer vest carriers. It is much more effective at preventing chronic back and hip pain over a 20-30 year career. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2018, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-police-not-show-up-in-court-for-traffic-cases/810490/65 "2018-03-15T18:55:21Z")
I’m a magistrate in a large Ohio city, and handle traffic and criminal cases, among others. Police fail to appear in court in maybe a quarter to a fifth of all traffic cases here. They are indeed paid to appear, and a few years back there was a big stink about officers’ large OT payments for court appearances, which was becoming a significant budget issue for the city. When officers FTA (fail to appear), city prosecutors used to make notes of that and Police HQ was notified for the officers to get a tongue-lashing, but I think they’ve stopped doing that. If officers FTA on a minor misdemeanor (no jail time possible) charge, prosecutors never object to a dismissal at the pretrial or trial stage, but if it’s a jailable offense the prosecutor will often ask for a continuance to take further steps to ensure the officer’s attendance. I routinely grant such continuances on first request, but am more skeptical for a second or subsequent request. If you’re charged here with unsafe motor vehicle (broken windshield, taillight out, headlight out, stuck door, etc.), the charge is usually dismissed at your first or subsequent court appearance if you show proof of having made repairs, such as a mechanic’s receipt or photo. > [@t-bonham@scc.net](#): > > …friends who are police officers have told me that scummy lawyers\*… > > \*Is there any other kind? Objection sustained. > [@Loach](#): > > …If you pay the fine online or through the mail you pay the amount on the ticket which is the minimum amount for that statute. If you come in to court you will also pay court costs. Although here the court costs are no where near doubling the amount of the fine. It’s not unusual in my court to get a fine of $50-100, if convicted, but court costs always start at $141 and only go up from there. If you plead not guilty, come back for pretrial or trial, and the case is ultimately dismissed or you’re found not guilty after trial, you owe nothing at all in fine or costs. ---
**Author:** ![anomalous1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e56c9b/32.png) [@anomalous1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/anomalous1)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2018, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-police-not-show-up-in-court-for-traffic-cases/810490/66 "2018-03-15T20:02:53Z")
> [@pkbites](#): > > I’m down there every other week and have never seen this. And if it’s so I have to wonder what their tolerance is. Traffic flow in Wisconsin is never above 85 like it is in the Flatlands. If troopers are around so much folks must not give a spit. > > Is he the actual Sheriff or a Sheriffs Deputy? It’s a significant difference. But yeah, the state boys up here don’t honor professional courtesy either. Good friend of mine actually got cited by one while in a marked squad car speeding without lights/siren. I shit you not! > > Wisconsin uses them. They use VASCAR in them and then radio a squad down below about a violator. Your Valentine One isn’t going to help you with that either. Yeah, a Deputy. Had Sheriff plates, but thought wouldn’t help… “piss-ant CO” lol. Damn, in a marked car too? Ouch. Yeah, I don’t rely on those detectors anyway, I guess I’ll just Henry Hill it and peek to see if anything is flying around. I usually don’t speed often. If I do just in the Margins, up to 5 over or I keep with traffic if I am. Do they look for those going 10+ over or something like that? Sorry to pester you with questions, just curious. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2018, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-police-not-show-up-in-court-for-traffic-cases/810490/67 "2018-03-15T20:57:33Z")
> [@Loach](#): > > That’s not how I understand strict liability. It is the responsibility of the driver to ensure the vehicle is registered and insured (if needed)and in good working order. Strict liability doesn’t mean that the person you think screwed up is responsible. If anything I would think strict liability would mean the owner would get the ticket regardless of who is driving. Maybe a lawyer can clarify that. You’re right. That is why the judge upheld the ticket despite all of the obstacles place in our way to keep it registered. ---
**Author:** ![Musicat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/musicat/32/20189_2.png) [@Musicat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Musicat)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2018, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-police-not-show-up-in-court-for-traffic-cases/810490/68 "2018-03-15T21:09:36Z")
> [@CookingWithGas](#): > > But then the question shifts away from the individual officers to our law enforcement system. If the system won’t compensate officers to prosecute the tickets, why are they sending them out there to write them? It’s merely a question of relative rewards. Since most people who get tickets don’t contest them, the state (county, city, whatever) benefits by the forfeit. Better odds (for the state) than Vegas. What the state pays officers to write tickets is less than the rewards. ---
**Author:** ![Alley\_Dweller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alley_dweller/32/430_2.png) [@Alley\_Dweller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alley_Dweller)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2018, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-police-not-show-up-in-court-for-traffic-cases/810490/69 "2018-03-15T22:24:02Z")
> [@pkbites](#): > > Is he the actual Sheriff or a Sheriffs Deputy? It’s a significant difference. When I’ve been in court in Illinois, the judges always addressed them as “Sheriff.” Basically, the Sheriff’s office staffs the court building and there is a person in a Sheriff’s uniform with a gun and badge working in every court room. The judge always says “hand your documents to the Sheriff” or “Sheriff Jones, please show the jury to their quarters,” etc. The word “deputy” never got used. I thought that was kind of weird, but all I know is from old TV shows where the head of the department was called “Sheriff” and everyone else was called “Deputy” (Deputy Dog!). I meant to ask the Sheriff/Deputy about that when we were sitting around, but never remembered. ---
**Author:** ![CookingWithGas](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cookingwithgas/32/485_2.png) [@CookingWithGas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CookingWithGas)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2018, 1:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-police-not-show-up-in-court-for-traffic-cases/810490/70 "2018-03-16T01:49:51Z")
> [@Alley\_Dweller](#): > > I thought that was kind of weird, but all I know is from old TV shows where the head of the department was called “Sheriff” and everyone else was called “Deputy” (Deputy Dog!). I meant to ask the Sheriff/Deputy about that when we were sitting around, but never remembered. Sheriff Taylor and Deputy Fife. ---
**Author:** ![pkbites](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pkbites/32/204_2.png) [@pkbites](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pkbites)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2018, 4:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-police-not-show-up-in-court-for-traffic-cases/810490/71 "2018-03-16T04:49:37Z")
> [@Alley\_Dweller](#): > > I thought that was kind of weird. It is weird. The Sheriff is [almost] always an elected constitutional office and those who work for/under him or her are Sheriff Deputies or Sheriff Officers. Referring to them as just Sheriff is disrespect to the actual Sheriff. But I never argue with a judge. 😉 > [@anomalous1](#): > > Do they look for those going 10+ over or something like that? Depends on the jurisdiction. What the prosecutor will charge and what a judge will convict at. During my first career I was a Dep for 25 years, (a little over 19 on the road, 4 in the bureau and about 2 in the jail). Our tickets were run through circuit court and it was well known that judges wouldn’t convict for anything less than 13 over. After I retired I started a 2nd career with another agency. Our tickets go through muni court and the judges there will convict at 11 over. When the max speed limit on our freeways was 65 counties and State Patrol weren’t tagging anyone in that zone until they were going at least 80. Now that the max limit is 70 nobody gets a citation in that limit zone unless they are going at least 80. Yep. Nothings changed. . ---
**Author:** ![anomalous1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e56c9b/32.png) [@anomalous1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/anomalous1)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2018, 7:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-police-not-show-up-in-court-for-traffic-cases/810490/72 "2018-03-16T07:14:11Z")
> [@pkbites](#): > > It is weird. The Sheriff is [almost] always an elected constitutional office and those who work for/under him or her are Sheriff Deputies or Sheriff Officers. Referring to them as just Sheriff is disrespect to the actual Sheriff. > > But I never argue with a judge. 😉 > > Depends on the jurisdiction. What the prosecutor will charge and what a judge will convict at. During my first career I was a Dep for 25 years, (a little over 19 on the road, 4 in the bureau and about 2 in the jail). Our tickets were run through circuit court and it was well known that judges wouldn’t convict for anything less than 13 over. After I retired I started a 2nd career with another agency. Our tickets go through muni court and the judges there will convict at 11 over. > > When the max speed limit on our freeways was 65 counties and State Patrol weren’t tagging anyone in that zone until they were going at least 80. Now that the max limit is 70 nobody gets a citation in that limit zone unless they are going at least > > 80. Yep. Nothings changed. . Fascinating stuff, thanks for sharing! Now it makes sense why everyone drives 10 over at all times. Lol. All that being said, its strange how rarely I see city cops pull people over, i suppose a lot is reliance on red light cameras and speed trap cams. On highways, all the time. ---
**Author:** ![pkbites](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pkbites/32/204_2.png) [@pkbites](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pkbites)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2018, 8:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-police-not-show-up-in-court-for-traffic-cases/810490/73 "2018-03-16T08:13:04Z")
> [@pkbites](#): > > Our tickets go through muni court and the judges there will convict at 11 over. Of course, most of the speed cites that go through municipal court are for exceeding on lower limit city streets, not highways. That’s an explanation for the lower tolerances by muni judges. > [@anomalous1](#): > > i suppose a lot is reliance on red light cameras and speed trap cams. On highways, all the time. Both are illegal in Wisconsin. Thank gwad. There has been a push recently to legalize red light cameras but so far the legislature has wisely resisted introducing us to that nightmare. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-police-not-show-up-in-court-for-traffic-cases/810490.md?page=3)