[QUOTE=HPL]
Atheism is refusing to play at all.
[/QUOTE]
Except that theists seem to see refusing to play as smashing the board.
[QUOTE=Der Trihs]
Not to mention, I recall a 60 minutes episode involving a religious school, where several parents said they’d prefer they’re children to be dead instead of atheists - on national television. Then there’s the common attempt to claim that atheism = Communism = mass murder, therefore all atheists are murderers. It’s also common to claim that Hitler and the Nazis were atheistic.
[/QUOTE]
I am going to go out on a limb and assume that those parents were not sending their children to a religious school for the highly nutritional meals. People that are that passionate about their religious beliefs are going to feel very threatened by anyone who questions the fundamentals of their belief system.
[QUOTE=Der Trihs]
Also, unlike other religions we are free to point out that their religion is stupid and delusional, without being equally vulnerable to the same accusation.
[/QUOTE]
To me this statement best answers the question posed in the OP. People make use of stereotypes daily and they tend to use the most vocal and memorable members of certain groups when formulating these stereotypes. Calling someone’s beliefs stupid is a great way to get you remembered. Why should a religious person respect you if you call them stupid every time they open their mouth?
[QUOTE=Der Trihs]
As well, we’re a group of rationalists they can all agree to hate, and the core of religion is irrationality and hatred.
[/QUOTE]
This is a great statement for building a relationship of understanding and mutual respect. I would also like to see citations from all religions as evidence of their basis on hatred.
[QUOTE=Der Trihs]
Finally, atheists aren’t organized; easy victims for a bunch of bullies.
[/QUOTE]
I do agree with this statement. No one is going to organize marches and boycotts if someone speaks against atheism on television. As much as a religious person may hate another religion, they generally know better than to go out in public spewing hateful rhetoric.
Welcome to the Straight Dope, Iris Rings. If you hang around here, you will at least find some religious folk who are on friendly terms with the atheists. It’s been a while since I’ve seen a outright attack by a regular.
Speaking only for myself, I’m much more likely to remember one’s political mindset, credibility, sense of the absurd, and personal gifts of insight than I am to remember who is an atheist. It just doesn’t register with me.
[QUOTE=Frosted Glass]
People that are that passionate about their religious beliefs are going to feel very threatened by anyone who questions the fundamentals of their belief system.
[/quote]
That doesn’t justify wishing death upon their own children.
[QUOTE=Frosted Glass]
Calling someone’s beliefs stupid is a great way to get you remembered. Why should a religious person respect you if you call them stupid every time they open their mouth?
[/quote]
They won’t respect me anyway, they insult my beliefs all the time ( this is still a country where “godless” is an insult ), and their beliefs are stupid. I refuse to pretend otherwise just because I’m outnumbered by delusional bullies.
[QUOTE=Frosted Glass]
This is a great statement for building a relationship of understanding and mutual respect.
[/quote]
I don’t respect them, nor do I want any relationship with them. They neither respect nor understand me.
[QUOTE=Frosted Glass]
I would also like to see citations from all religions as evidence of their basis on hatred.
[/quote]
It is the essence of religion itself I speak of, not the doctrine of this or that priesthood.
In Christianity, it is required that you love and forgive your “enemies.” I would imagine that something similar is taught in other religious faiths.
I do understand what you are saying. I know that “what is required of us” is doctrine and what we actually do doesn’t measure up.
But do you dismiss all religious people? Do you think we are all alike? I don’t think you are that naive.
[QUOTE=Zoe]
But do you dismiss all religious people? Do you think we are all alike? I don’t think you are that naive.
[/QUOTE]
No, some are far worse than others. Most I regard as fools, indoctrinated since childhood to be victims. Many are scum, such as those parents I mentioned above. Some are outright predators and monsters, like pedophile priests and those who cover for them.
[QUOTE=Der Trihs]
That doesn’t justify wishing death upon their own children.
[/QUOTE]
Nor was I trying to justify it. I was attempting to explain the extreme degree to which these people were willing to go to “protect” their beliefs. Citing this type of fundamentalism as evidence of nationwide atheist persecution is similar to me citing statements by the KKK as evidence of nationwide racism. Extremist views do not reflect the views of the majority.
[QUOTE=Frosted Glass]
Citing this type of fundamentalism as evidence of nationwide atheist persecution is similar to me citing statements by the KKK as evidence of nationwide racism. Extremist views do not reflect the views of the majority.
[/QUOTE]
When we elect religious fundies and their sycophants to power, I see no reason to believe they aren’t the majority; they are certainly one of the most powerful groups in the country. At one point the KKK was rather mainstream; these days, it’s religion.
[QUOTE=Der Trihs]
At one point the KKK was rather mainstream; these days, it’s religion.
[/QUOTE]
The KKK was never a mainstream organization. They would not have found the need to exist if their interests were protected by a majority of the populous. This is why they were founded following the Reconstruction instead of earlier. I apologize for having started this tangent.
[QUOTE=Der Trihs]
When we elect religious fundies and their sycophants to power, I see no reason to believe they aren’t the majority; they are certainly one of the most powerful groups in the country.
[/QUOTE]
They are an intimidating and powerful group that has acquired significantly more support based on platforms denouncing abortion and gay marriage than on anti-atheist propaganda.
You may consider me naive but I think that communities are better off when its citizens respect each other.
[QUOTE=Loopydude]
At least publically, Jews are kind of off limits, though, right? I mean, nobody wants to be seen as a Nazi or a Klansman, so it’s just incredibly un-P.C. to harsh on Jews for the whole “Jesus wasn’t G_d incarnate” thing.
What if you told them you were a Wiccan?
[/QUOTE]
I’ve tried saying I’m Jewish. Next time the bitch tried to give me special pamphlets for Jews and went on about how her pastor used to be Jewish.
[quote]
Yes, I suppose so. Does that about cover it for religious people?
If so, that’s some interesting black and white thinking for a “liberal.” They don’t make 'em like they used to.
Friendly wager. You were born after the troops came home from Vietnam.
[QUOTE=Zoe]
Friendly wager. You were born after the troops came home from Vietnam.
[/QUOTE]
I was born on December 9, 1968; it’s in my profile.
[QUOTE=alphaboi867]
I’ve tried saying I’m Jewish. Next time the bitch tried to give me special pamphlets for Jews and went on about how her pastor used to be Jewish.
[/QUOTE]
Hehehe. They also have pamphlets for people who say they are Christians. The most effective solution I have seen is the approach taken by my older brother. Knowing the Bible inside and out he just quotes scripture until their head pops out of confusion.
Then you win by about five years. I remember that December very well. It was a time of transition for me. Those years were for a lot of people. What a time you were born into! But I digress.
Pax
I think the OP is a bit misstated and hence confusing its own question. Atheism, heresy, apostasy, being of a different sect, and being of a different religion are all different conditions. I’d say that apostasy is generally considered worst of all (the idea that someone could and do leave a once sincerely held faith is DEEPLY threatening to ones existing faith), worse than just plain atheism. Heresy is defined very differently depending on a religion so it isn’t really a very clear term.
I think the OP is correct that non-belief is considered worse than alternate beliefs, and the reason is simply that the alternate beliefs are often not that different from each other in many ways (or at least are thought to be, often because of people’s ignorance of the religion of others and hence their assumption that they are not that different), and if we are talking sects, then the differences are often even too subtle for most laypeople to be able to explain.
[QUOTE=Iris Rings]
I don’t get it. All the people I know of all religions are less accepting of atheists than of each other.
Yet, the Hindus will freely state that they think all the Christian, Jewish, and Islamic texts are literary inventions and misunderstandings of nature.
And the others respond in kind.
Seems to me that means that in that respect they have more in common with atheists.
[/QUOTE]
In the immortal words of Walter Sobchak:
[QUOTE=Frosted Glass]
The KKK was never a mainstream organization.
[/QUOTE]
That simply isn’t the case – the original Reconstruction-era Klan was on the fringes, but the 20th century revival became a political and social power to be reckoned with.
[QUOTE=Der Trihs]
No, some are far worse than others. Most I regard as fools, indoctrinated since childhood to be victims. Many are scum, such as those parents I mentioned above. Some are outright predators and monsters, like pedophile priests and those who cover for them.
[/QUOTE]
At least we’re all accepting of each other, though, right?
[QUOTE=Othersider]
At least we’re all accepting of each other, though, right?
[/QUOTE]
Since when ?