# Why do restaurants skimp on portion size over time? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [June 20, 2014, 12:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-restaurants-skimp-on-portion-size-over-time/691185 "2014-06-20T00:53:59Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![race\_to\_the\_bottom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c4cdca/32.png) [@race\_to\_the\_bottom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/race_to_the_bottom)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2014, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-restaurants-skimp-on-portion-size-over-time/691185/41 "2014-06-21T18:50:16Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > Actually, food cost is pretty much tied for #1 as the _largest_ part of a restaurant’s budget. When I ran a Jack in the Box, it was expected that our food cost and our labor/payroll would each account for about 1/3rd of our total expenses, with utilities, facility maintenance, rent, marketing, shrink, taxes/municipal fees, and all the rest taking up the other third, and, at the end of the day, about 1-3% of the total gross left as profit. Yes, but there was a time when time, not so long ago, when the cost of food was BY FAR the major expense of selling food . It was a RELATIVELY much more important expense than other costs involved in running a restaurant today. ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2014, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-restaurants-skimp-on-portion-size-over-time/691185/42 "2014-06-21T23:47:09Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > … > > And the worst example of grocery-store downsizing I ever saw was with vinegar. I’m looking at two containers of white vinegar. They’re both one gallon (and it’s an actual gallon in both cases), and for white vinegar, it’s not like I care about quality, since I’m just using it for cleaning anyway. So I should buy the one that’s cheaper, right? Wrong. The cheaper one is only 4% acidity, instead of the standard 5%, and it’s not 20% cheaper. And vinegar is the sort of thing where having the wrong strength could seriously screw up a recipe. Your vinegar example is a common issue at ‘dollar’ stores, where in order to keep the price at $1/product some serious dilution sometimes occurs. Looks like the same size bottle of dish detergent or shampoo but the dollar store stuff runs out like water. Also paper towels that are rolled up very loosely and don’t contain as many sheets. ---
**Author:** ![race\_to\_the\_bottom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c4cdca/32.png) [@race\_to\_the\_bottom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/race_to_the_bottom)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2014, 1:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-restaurants-skimp-on-portion-size-over-time/691185/43 "2014-06-22T01:19:03Z")
> [@kanicbird](#): > > Your vinegar example is a common issue at ‘dollar’ stores, where in order to keep the price at $1/product some serious dilution sometimes occurs. Looks like the same size bottle of dish detergent or shampoo but the dollar store stuff runs out like water. Also paper towels that are rolled up very loosely and don’t contain as many sheets. Fred Meyer, a Kroger owned supermarket chain in Oregon sells a house brand bleach which is 6% bleach, the de facto industry standard, and a cheaper house brand which is a bit over 2%. In other words, they take a gallon of house stuff and add two gallons of water to get the el cheapo brand. People buy it. They think they are getting a deal ---
**Author:** ![ralfy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ralfy/32/600_2.png) [@ralfy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralfy)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2014, 2:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-restaurants-skimp-on-portion-size-over-time/691185/44 "2014-06-22T02:28:25Z")
Related: “Is our food shrinking?” > [@](#): > > Brands that don’t want their customers to see shrinking products as a price hike live by Weber’s law, says Mitchell. This is the idea that if you present people with a stimulus of a varying intensity – and the change is small enough – they won’t notice it. To notice the change, the variation has to have exceeded what is known as the “just noticeable difference” (JND). > **[Is our food shrinking?](https://www.theguardian.com/money/2013/jan/21/food-products-shrinking-recession)** > > Tins of tuna seem lighter, there are fewer chunks in a chocolate bar ... are food companies using a recession-fuelled strategy to reduce the size of their products rather than increasing prices? “The era of cheap food may be over” > [@](#): > > The last decade saw the end of cheap oil, the magic growth ingredient for the global economy after the second world war. This summer’s increase in maize, wheat and soya bean prices – the third spike in the past five years – suggests the era of cheap food is also over. > **[The era of cheap food may be over](https://www.theguardian.com/business/2012/sep/02/era-of-cheap-food-over)** > > A spike in prices caused by poor harvests and rising demand is an apt moment for the west to reassess the wisdom of biofuels ---
**Author:** ![Ambivalid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a5b964/32.png) [@Ambivalid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ambivalid)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2014, 2:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-restaurants-skimp-on-portion-size-over-time/691185/45 "2014-06-22T02:50:48Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > Years ago, I tried a couple of times to order a combo meal at a drive-through and told them to ‘hold the fries’. I didn’t want them; just the burger and a drink. They said they couldn’t do that. Lol. Huh? They couldnt just **not** hand you the fries? I don’t get it. ---
**Author:** ![Alley\_Dweller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alley_dweller/32/430_2.png) [@Alley\_Dweller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alley_Dweller)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2014, 4:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-restaurants-skimp-on-portion-size-over-time/691185/46 "2014-06-22T04:06:34Z")
> [@Ambivalid](#): > > Lol. Huh? They couldnt just **not** hand you the fries? I don’t get it. I can see that. They don’t want to risk their job. The bosses at low wage McJobs are often arbitrary, capricious, and irrational. The employees don’t want to get in trouble for not giving you what you ordered or for giving you the combo price when you really didn’t order a combo. To you, their jobs may be a joke. To them it means being able to pay the rent. If the rule says they must serve fries with the combo or that they can only give you the combo price when you actually order the full combo, they are going to do that. ---
**Author:** ![Incubus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/c68b51/32.png) [@Incubus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Incubus)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2014, 5:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-restaurants-skimp-on-portion-size-over-time/691185/47 "2014-06-22T05:00:33Z")
Order a Cesar salad for dinner at Cheesecake factory, and you’ll get a salad most people would be splitting with 4 people at home. Seriously, that thing was monstrous! And the worst part was I ordered a salad in the first place because I wasn’t hungry enough for a pasta or meat entree. Their portions are insane. My wife pokes fun at me for eating my food in a particular order. Its mainly because I try not to make it a habit of trying to eat everything in one sitting. I’ll prioritize eating the stuff that doesnt taste as good as leftovers (french fries in particular) and save stuff that does, particularly if I can convert it to sandwich form the next day (steak or chicken breast). **Monstro** , you probably already know this, but often getting dollar menu items ends up being a lot cheaper.Both Jack in the Box and McDonald’s have a lot of items that are all a buck each and its often much cheaper to get stuff that way. I’ve heard the dollar menu items are loss leaders and are assumed to be purchased with a more profitable item. Like 2 tacos for 99 cents. ---
**Author:** ![race\_to\_the\_bottom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c4cdca/32.png) [@race\_to\_the\_bottom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/race_to_the_bottom)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2014, 5:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-restaurants-skimp-on-portion-size-over-time/691185/48 "2014-06-22T05:02:08Z")
> [@ralfy](#): > > Related: > > “Is our food shrinking?” > > [Is our food shrinking? | Food | The Guardian](http://www.theguardian.com/money/2013/jan/21/food-products-shrinking-recession) > > “The era of cheap food may be over” > > [The era of cheap food may be over | Larry Elliott, economics editor | The Guardian](http://www.theguardian.com/business/2012/sep/02/era-of-cheap-food-over) Food processors can buy wheat for about 13, Corn for 8, and oats for 6 cents a pound. Consider that when you next buy that $4 a pound box of cereal. If the grain was FREE, the cost of the cereal at retail would still be $3.90. People are being gouged badly, but food is still relatively cheap. ---
**Author:** ![race\_to\_the\_bottom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c4cdca/32.png) [@race\_to\_the\_bottom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/race_to_the_bottom)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2014, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-restaurants-skimp-on-portion-size-over-time/691185/49 "2014-06-22T15:16:29Z")
> [@Incubus](#): > > Order a Cesar salad for dinner at Cheesecake factory, and you’ll get a salad most people would be splitting with 4 people at home. Seriously, that thing was monstrous! And the worst part was I ordered a salad in the first place because I wasn’t hungry enough for a pasta or meat entree. Their portions are insane. > > My wife pokes fun at me for eating my food in a particular order. Its mainly because I try not to make it a habit of trying to eat everything in one sitting. I’ll prioritize eating the stuff that doesnt taste as good as leftovers (french fries in particular) and save stuff that does, particularly if I can convert it to sandwich form the next day (steak or chicken breast). > > **Monstro** , you probably already know this, but often getting dollar menu items ends up being a lot cheaper.Both Jack in the Box and McDonald’s have a lot of items that are all a buck each and its often much cheaper to get stuff that way. I’ve heard the dollar menu items are loss leaders and are assumed to be purchased with a more profitable item. Like 2 tacos for 99 cents. Order one dinner and split it; ask if the kitchen will divide the portions for you on separate plates. We have never been turned down and each will have a perfectly satisfying dinner at half price. For 1/2 pound hamburgers, a creation never offered in the not too distant past, order one an ask for a separate plate and knife and cut it in half. There is always plenty of fries, because potatoes are really cheap. That is why there is a trend to unlimited fries in some restaurants. Leave a very generous tip. ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2014, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-restaurants-skimp-on-portion-size-over-time/691185/50 "2014-06-22T15:37:24Z")
> [@race\_to\_the\_bottom](#): > > Food processors can buy wheat for about 13, Corn for 8, and oats for 6 cents a pound. Consider that when you next buy that $4 a pound box of cereal. If the grain was FREE, the cost of the cereal at retail would still be $3.90. People are being gouged badly, but food is still relatively cheap. Corn may only be in the $4-5/bushel range right now, but last year it was running $6-7 and may well be again if we have the same Rainy Season/Dry Season effect going on that kills the crops in late summer. A bushel of Corn is 56 pounds, shelled. Unprocessed you’re looking at 8-12 cents a pound. After processing, double that. Still only a mild dent in the price of your cereal, but even so. ---
**Author:** ![race\_to\_the\_bottom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c4cdca/32.png) [@race\_to\_the\_bottom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/race_to_the_bottom)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2014, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-restaurants-skimp-on-portion-size-over-time/691185/51 "2014-06-22T16:52:01Z")
> [@Chimera](#): > > Corn may only be in the $4-5/bushel range right now, but last year it was running $6-7 and may well be again if we have the same Rainy Season/Dry Season effect going on that kills the crops in late summer. > > A bushel of Corn is 56 pounds, shelled. Unprocessed you’re looking at 8-12 cents a pound. After processing, double that. > > Still only a mild dent in the price of your cereal, but even so. Maybe that is true of corn, but to make whole wheat flour, you just grind the wheat, so the wheat content in a pound of ww flour is one pound. Oat hulls are very light, a small percentage of the kernel . The point here is that when grain goes up a few cents a pound, the price of cereal will go up many multiples of that. When you complain about the price increase, they will say, “Jeez, the price of oats DOUBLED. You should be lucky we only raised the price of oatmeal by 20%!” And people will think, “Boy, this company is really great for not passing the full percentage of the increase in the price of oats.” Look at oatmeal. What could be simpler. Hull the oats, steam the kernels and run them through rollers. Viola! Oatmeal at a couple of dollars a pound from a nickels worth of oats. Suppose the price of the oats goes to a dime a pound. Do you suppose that oatmeal will then be $2.05 per pound? No way. It will probably go up a quarter or more. ---
**Author:** ![ralfy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ralfy/32/600_2.png) [@ralfy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralfy)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2014, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-restaurants-skimp-on-portion-size-over-time/691185/52 "2014-06-23T01:30:52Z")
> [@race\_to\_the\_bottom](#): > > Food processors can buy wheat for about 13, Corn for 8, and oats for 6 cents a pound. Consider that when you next buy that $4 a pound box of cereal. If the grain was FREE, the cost of the cereal at retail would still be $3.90. People are being gouged badly, but food is still relatively cheap. The second article refers to the global scenario, one where most people earn only a few dollars a day and have to pay for other basic needs. ---
**Author:** ![stui\_magpie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stui_magpie/32/11010_2.png) [@stui\_magpie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/stui_magpie)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2014, 4:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-restaurants-skimp-on-portion-size-over-time/691185/53 "2014-06-23T04:49:24Z")
> [@chiroptera](#): > > I moved to the US from the UK in 1979, and one of the things that struck me even then was the gargantuan servings of food served here, compared to what I was used to. And as has been mentioned already, serving sizes have quadrupled since then. Restaurant serving are fucking huge - used to be, and still are. \*\*Sizes of burgers, fries and drinks \*\*(for instance) have risen exponentially in the last couple of decades. > > Grocery item downsizing is a different issue. I’d argue that the reverse is true in Aus even if the burger chains deny it. If they haven’t gotten smaller they sure haven’t got bigger. Restaurant meals here are generally not huge, but can be expensive. ---
**Author:** ![race\_to\_the\_bottom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c4cdca/32.png) [@race\_to\_the\_bottom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/race_to_the_bottom)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2014, 4:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-restaurants-skimp-on-portion-size-over-time/691185/54 "2014-06-23T04:55:26Z")
> [@ralfy](#): > > The second article refers to the global scenario, one where most people earn only a few dollars a day and have to pay for other basic needs. Its true. Poor people in the developing countries have been seriously hurt by rising food prices. One of the drivers is the use of corn for the production of ethanol for fuel in the US, which has been proven to be counterproductive. ---
**Author:** ![Becky2844](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/91b2a8/32.png) [@Becky2844](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Becky2844)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2014, 6:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-restaurants-skimp-on-portion-size-over-time/691185/55 "2014-06-23T06:08:52Z")
Speaking of smaller portions, my husband and I went to the new-ish (year old) Chinese buffet and I thought of this thread. The chicken pieces had been cut in half. Not a bad idea for the larger pieces but so had the divided wings. Cross-ways, so each full one made four. I told him if they started cutting the napkins in half we’d know they were going to close soon. ---
**Author:** ![ralfy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ralfy/32/600_2.png) [@ralfy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralfy)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2014, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-restaurants-skimp-on-portion-size-over-time/691185/56 "2014-06-23T16:29:53Z")
> [@race\_to\_the\_bottom](#): > > Its true. Poor people in the developing countries have been seriously hurt by rising food prices. One of the drivers is the use of corn for the production of ethanol for fuel in the US, which has been proven to be counterproductive. It should be noted, though, that even as oil and food prices are high, consumption of both continues to rise in developing countries, likely because of a growing global middle class coupled with high forex reserves. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2014, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-restaurants-skimp-on-portion-size-over-time/691185/57 "2014-06-24T19:43:08Z")
> [@FairyChatMom](#): > > Can you get a quart of mayo any longer? In my grocery store, they’re all now 30oz, whether brand name or generic. My good woman, I do believe you have discerned my point! ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2014, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-restaurants-skimp-on-portion-size-over-time/691185/58 "2014-06-24T19:46:56Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > Not quite sure I get your comment. Do you believe that it is not true that some products are size sensitive and some are price sensitive to most consumers? > > Let’s even take the canned pumpkin example: since a large number, if not most consumers, are buying canned pumpkin to make pumpkin pie the producers will not change its package amount to a portion that does not work for a standard recipe, but they will note that consumers will buy a 14.5 oz can priced less that works in the recipe more commonly than a 16 oz can priced higher or even as often if priced the same. Given that they’d be silly to package it in 16 oz cans. > > But yeah, I buy a package of bacon and at most look at the price per unit weight and the amount of fat (or per the request of the bacon eater in the house was for center cut and now turkey bacon) … the size of the package is not too important to me. Mayo - one jar or plastic bottle seems to last forever so smaller is fine. Jam too. Tuna may be based on what consumers _want_ - 6.5 is a lot for a single serving which is perhaps how it is consumed more often now than making a bunch “for the kids.” Detergent is per number of washes not volume and I prefer the more concentrated forms. Pasta? I see all sorts of sizes on the shelf now, from smaller to huge - nice to get a package the size I will actually use that night rather than be forced into the 1 pound size only. > > Real food costs have been decreasing for decades, since WW2, btw. YES! I’m agreeing with the gripe in the OP! I’m going to pay a higher price per unit; I recognize that this is something that is going to change. I wish for the number of units per standard package to remain unchanged. I am not getting my wish, so :mad:. ---
**Author:** ![Q.N.Jones](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/3da27b/32.png) [@Q.N.Jones](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Q.N.Jones)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2014, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-restaurants-skimp-on-portion-size-over-time/691185/59 "2014-06-24T21:44:44Z")
I have noticed this phenomenon in restaurants, mainly with dishes containing fresh vegetables. For example, my favorite local steakhouse used to do a wonderful side dish of steamed veggies. It was an assortment of broccoli, zucchini, yellow squash, and carrots, a huge pile of them. I ordered it again the other day, and the serving had been reduced to half its previous size. I really like veggies, but in order to get full and stay full, I need to eat a whole giant pile of them. I assume this happens because fresh produce is expensive, but it is disappointing. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-restaurants-skimp-on-portion-size-over-time/691185.md?page=2)