# Why do so many American servicemen in WWII look so old? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [October 31, 2015, 4:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-american-servicemen-in-wwii-look-so-old/736231 "2015-10-31T04:00:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2015, 5:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-american-servicemen-in-wwii-look-so-old/736231/41 "2015-11-02T05:01:21Z")
> [@Jeff\_Lichtman](#): > > The only one in that picture who is overweight is Ruth. Foxx was always very muscular and fit. Gehrig and Simmons look lean. > > Uniforms in those days were loose-fitting, which tended to even things out. Slim players looked fatter, and fat players looked slimmer. > > If you want to see an out-of-shape contemporary ballplayer, check out Bartolo Colon. I was actually looking at their cheeks, chins and necks. Bartolo Colon notwithstanding, today’s baseball players tend to be a little thinner than those guys. Man… Colon is some kind of specimen, huh? He looks like he ought to be the team cook or something. ---
**Author:** ![Kamakiri](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/f04885/32.png) [@Kamakiri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kamakiri)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2015, 5:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-american-servicemen-in-wwii-look-so-old/736231/42 "2015-11-02T05:34:28Z")
> [@bump](#): > > [This is my grandfather’s squadron photo in 1943.](http://www.385thbga.com/wp-content/gallery/air-crews/549-sqdn-1943.jpg) He’s ninth from left (the short guy in the baseball-cap looking thing just inboard of the engine). > > He was 28 or 29 at the time- probably one of the oldest men in the photo. He doesn’t look too old, other than the annoyed expression on his face, and some of the other guys look positively young by comparison. Wow. I AM old (57) and basically, I’ve been looking at photos of WWII since I was knee-high to a grasshopper (now just THAT expression dates me) but to me, out of the men in your crew photo (helluva photo!!) only about two in ten men looking any younger than 25, and among those, not one that I would deem to be less than 20. I can _kind_ of accept the “worked had at manual labor” explanation, but I’ll bet it’s a bit psychological—face it, most of those men, if in any combat zone (even—or should I say especially—airmen) would most probably have been in some doubt about themselves actually coming through the war, which to them might have meant another ten years. So I guess that puts an expression on your face that just RADIATES fear—[on the page with my dad’s crewmates](http://www.montrealfood.com/mosecrew.html), the only photo in which they look even remotely young is when they’re smiling. As for my dad in later years, I’ll just have to say that he was one of the most equanimous, pleasant, smart individuals I’ve ever known, with not even a tiny shadow of what must have been the result of 20+ missions over Europe. And I’m not just saying that just because he was my dad! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2015, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-american-servicemen-in-wwii-look-so-old/736231/43 "2015-11-02T16:06:01Z")
> [@Kamakiri](#): > > I can _kind_ of accept the “worked had at manual labor” explanation, but I’ll bet it’s a bit psychological—face it, most of those men, if in any combat zone (even—or should I say especially—airmen) would most probably have been in some doubt about themselves actually coming through the war, which to them might have meant another ten years. > > So I guess that puts an expression on your face that just RADIATES fear—[on the page with my dad’s crewmates](http://www.montrealfood.com/mosecrew.html), the only photo in which they look even remotely young is when they’re smiling. > > As for my dad in later years, I’ll just have to say that he was one of the most equanimous, pleasant, smart individuals I’ve ever known, with not even a tiny shadow of what must have been the result of 20+ missions over Europe. > > And I’m not just saying that just because he was my dad! 😃 In my grandfather’s case, his squadron photo (549th of 385th bomb group flying B-17s out of Great Ashfield), was taken at the hairiest part of the air war over Germany; sometime between early September 1943 and Dec 31, 1943, so I imagine you’re definitely right as far as the facial expressions go. But overall, wartime photos notwithstanding, I’m pretty sure that it’s mostly facial expressions. Look at[this photo of today’s Rangers](http://specialoperations.com/447/usasoc/), and they look old, yet most of those guys are like E-4 - E6 (with the exception of the Colonel in front), which would probably imply mid-20s, yet there’s not _much_ difference between those guys and the likely mid-late 40s colonel standing leftmost in the shot. ---
**Author:** ![Si\_Amigo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/si_amigo/32/2877_2.png) [@Si\_Amigo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Si_Amigo)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2015, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-american-servicemen-in-wwii-look-so-old/736231/44 "2015-11-02T17:27:31Z")
> [@lazybratsche](#): > > There’s also the simple reality that WW2 vets grew up during the depression. Many of them had hard lives, poor nutrition, and spend a lot of time working outside. To give one famous example, the woman in the “[Migrant Mother](http://loc.gov/pictures/resource/fsa.8b29516/)” photograph was 32 years old at the time. If I saw her on the street today I’d guess she was in her 40s, but I’m used to seeing people who spend most of their time indoors and use sunscreen when they spend a lot of time in the sun. Just having seven kids by age 32 takes a toll on girl. ---
**Author:** ![Dorjan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dorjan/32/12440_2.png) [@Dorjan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dorjan)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2015, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-american-servicemen-in-wwii-look-so-old/736231/45 "2015-11-02T19:12:32Z")
War is Hell, and they were just coming out of the Great Depression. I would chalk that up as a more significant factor than clothing and hairstyles. Young folks during the Roaring Twenties look their age in pictures. ---
**Author:** ![UncaStuart](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/uncastuart/32/404_2.png) [@UncaStuart](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncaStuart)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2015, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-american-servicemen-in-wwii-look-so-old/736231/46 "2015-11-02T19:24:46Z")
> [@jz78817](#): > > It’s probably a combination of things. even now, if I look back at the yearbook I got in first grade, the 8th-graders back then all seem like they were in their 20s. But if I look at _my_ 8th grade yearbook, we all looked like a bunch of kids. Gotta say “me too” on this. For another submission in the WWII photos examples, [here’s](http://i1257.photobucket.com/albums/ii506/biddyguck/98MissionsLoRez.jpg) my dad at 23 and then at 24. In the 15 months between the two shots, he had shipped out to New Guinea, flew 98 combat missions, got malaria and dysentery. It may be just me, but I think the in the 24 shot he looks quite a bit older than one more year. ---
**Author:** ![russian\_heel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f05b48/32.png) [@russian\_heel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/russian_heel)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2015, 8:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-american-servicemen-in-wwii-look-so-old/736231/47 "2015-11-03T08:21:26Z")
When most of these soldiers were born, the expected life expectancy of the average American was 55; today its close to 79. Do some math, and a 21 year old man at the time would look like he was in his early 30s to us; a 30 year old man would look 45. Add a little black and white and like the posters said short hair cuts, and that adds to the effect. This helps explain why so many old-timey ballplayers looked like middle aged men even if they were by todays standards young men----by the standards of their day, many of them were middle aged men. ---
**Author:** ![Donnerwetter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b2d939/32.png) [@Donnerwetter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Donnerwetter)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2015, 11:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-american-servicemen-in-wwii-look-so-old/736231/48 "2015-11-03T11:10:08Z")
> [@UncaStuart](#): > > Gotta say “me too” on this. > > For another submission in the WWII photos examples, [here’s](http://i1257.photobucket.com/albums/ii506/biddyguck/98MissionsLoRez.jpg) my dad at 23 and then at 24. In the 15 months between the two shots, he had shipped out to New Guinea, flew 98 combat missions, got malaria and dysentery. It may be just me, but I think the in the 24 shot he looks quite a bit older than one more year. That is a dramatic change. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2015, 11:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-american-servicemen-in-wwii-look-so-old/736231/49 "2015-11-03T11:56:02Z")
> [@russian\_heel](#): > > When most of these soldiers were born, the expected life expectancy of the average American was 55; today its close to 79. > > Do some math, and a 21 year old man at the time would look like he was in his early 30s to us; a 30 year old man would look 45. This is so wrong. First, the lower life expectancy was largely due to higher infant mortality; if lots of babies die before one year of age, it brings down the average. Second, adults who died prematurely didn’t die of old age, they died of infections or other illnesses that are routinely treated today. They didn’t just age faster and die as old men at age 55. ---
**Author:** ![Colophon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f05b48/32.png) [@Colophon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colophon)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2015, 1:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-american-servicemen-in-wwii-look-so-old/736231/50 "2015-11-03T13:50:16Z")
> [@Kamakiri](#): > > You keep reading/hearing about how young everyone was who fought in WWII (my dad did, in the 8th Air Force) but when you look at footage from war zones—I’m watching Ken Burns’s “War” now, but it goes for ALL documentaries I’ve seen—the men don’t look like they’re 18 or even in their mid-twenties. _many_ of them, easily more than 75%, to my eyes, in fact look as if they’re in their early 40s or even older. > > And it’s not just the men who are unshaven and dirty, either. Soldiers, sailors and airmen alike all look they haven’t seen their teens for a decade or more. > > Even my in [father’s own crew pictures](http://www.montrealfood.com/mosecrew.html) the men, AND my father, look at least 30, even though I know my father was only 22. > > What gives? None of them looks babyfaced; not like, for example, troops in Vietnam, who mostly _do_ look like they’re in their early 20s. Leo Jones looks very babyfaced, to me (fifth photo down). Also I was interested to see Combe House, in the second photo down. That is a very nice hotel these days (although sadly has just changed hands so may not be as nice soon). ---
**Author:** ![Zsofia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/7bcc69/32.png) [@Zsofia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zsofia)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2015, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-american-servicemen-in-wwii-look-so-old/736231/51 "2015-11-03T14:28:48Z")
That’s kind of what cracked me up about the Captain America movie - you didn’t need a ginormous roided up Chris Evans to be the Aryan Superman of WWII GIs. Sebastian Stan was probably plenty big and healthy looking in comparison to the guys walking in. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2015, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-american-servicemen-in-wwii-look-so-old/736231/52 "2015-11-03T16:10:12Z")
> [@russian\_heel](#): > > When most of these soldiers were born, the expected life expectancy of the average American was 55; today its close to 79. > > Do some math, and a 21 year old man at the time would look like he was in his early 30s to us; a 30 year old man would look 45. Add a little black and white and like the posters said short hair cuts, and that adds to the effect. > > This helps explain why so many old-timey ballplayers looked like middle aged men even if they were by todays standards young men----by the standards of their day, many of them were middle aged men. And yet, somehow, the vast majority of them lived into the 1980s, 1990s and 2000s. By your logic, a 2 year old back then would look like a 3 year old, which is absurd. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2015, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-american-servicemen-in-wwii-look-so-old/736231/53 "2015-11-03T19:45:02Z")
> [@Bag\_of\_Mostly\_Water](#): > > Don’t underestimate the effects of smoking. During that time period, nearly everyone smoked to some extent. Regular tobacco use will make you look significantly older. Yep. Smoked like chimneys and no sunscreen. My Dad started during the war, just like many young men, free cigs. ---
**Author:** ![russian\_heel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f05b48/32.png) [@russian\_heel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/russian_heel)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2015, 6:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-american-servicemen-in-wwii-look-so-old/736231/54 "2015-11-04T06:08:09Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > This is so wrong. First, the lower life expectancy was largely due to higher infant mortality; if lots of babies die before one year of age, it brings down the average. Second, adults who died prematurely didn’t die of old age, they died of infections or other illnesses that are routinely treated today. They didn’t just age faster and die as old men at age 55. Yes, they did. ---
**Author:** ![russian\_heel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f05b48/32.png) [@russian\_heel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/russian_heel)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2015, 6:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-american-servicemen-in-wwii-look-so-old/736231/55 "2015-11-04T06:09:39Z")
> [@bump](#): > > And yet, somehow, the vast majority of them lived into the 1980s, 1990s and 2000s. Did they? > [@](#): > > By your logic, a 2 year old back then would look like a 3 year old, which is absurd. The advanced aging kicked in once they reached adulthood. ---
**Author:** ![Kamakiri](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/f04885/32.png) [@Kamakiri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kamakiri)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2015, 10:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-american-servicemen-in-wwii-look-so-old/736231/56 "2015-11-04T10:25:19Z")
> [@Colophon](#): > > Leo Jones looks very babyfaced, to me (fifth photo down). > > Also I was interested to see Combe House, in the second photo down. That is a very nice hotel these days (although sadly has just changed hands so may not be as nice soon). Yes, Leo Jones DOES seem baby-faced. But it seems he died of some horrific cancer at a relatively early age. Funny, my dad never spoke about him. I only found out about him after I attended a convention of the 467th Bomb Group (on behalf of my father. It was totally surreal being surrounded by all these old men who had all been contemporaries of my father!) Combe House . . . you must be in England. Again, my father never mentioned any “flak-happy rest homes.” I guess he never GOT flak-happy. He never referred to his time in the war as anything other than amusing anecdotes—never a “I was terrified”-type of story. Although he must have been. Who couldn’t have been, with an up-to 1/3rd attrition rate? Watching “The War” by Ken Burns made me want to post something entitled “Why I Can’t Feel Sorry For Germans in WWII” but I think I’ll leave that to another time. ---
**Author:** ![astro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9dc877/32.png) [@astro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astro)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2015, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-american-servicemen-in-wwii-look-so-old/736231/57 "2015-11-04T17:49:44Z")
> [@Bag\_of\_Mostly\_Water](#): > > Don’t underestimate the effects of smoking. During that time period, nearly everyone smoked to some extent. Regular tobacco use will make you look significantly older. This. Many men smoked like chimneys and it beats the living crap out of your face. Regular smokers often have faces that look 10 years older than non smokers the same age. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2015, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-american-servicemen-in-wwii-look-so-old/736231/58 "2015-11-04T20:03:08Z")
> [@russian\_heel](#): > > Did they? Well, yeah. > **[Life Expectancy by Age, 1850–2011](https://www.infoplease.com/us/health-statistics/life-expectancy-age-1850-2011)** > > The expectation of life at a specified age is the average number of years that members of a hypothetical group of people of the same age would continue to live if they were subject throughout the remainder of their lives to the same mortality rate. Assuming someone was in their 20s when the war ended, they could expect to live somewhere around 70 years old, which would put them in the late 1980s or early 1990s. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2015, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-american-servicemen-in-wwii-look-so-old/736231/59 "2015-11-04T20:29:05Z")
Maybe because they were exhausted a lot more? ---
**Author:** ![russian\_heel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f05b48/32.png) [@russian\_heel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/russian_heel)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2015, 2:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-american-servicemen-in-wwii-look-so-old/736231/60 "2015-11-05T02:40:02Z")
So it’s not at all feasible that compared to today, lower health care standards, more disease, less nutritional info, less government assistance, harsher working conditions. Etc etc could cause many people from this era to age faster than if they were the same age today? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-american-servicemen-in-wwii-look-so-old/736231.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-american-servicemen-in-wwii-look-so-old/736231.md?page=4)