# Why do so many people pretend to be ex-military? What do they get out of it? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [May 16, 2009, 2:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-people-pretend-to-be-ex-military-what-do-they-get-out-of-it/496602 "2009-05-16T02:28:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![FairyChatMom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fairychatmom/32/21906_2.png) [@FairyChatMom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FairyChatMom)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2009, 10:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-people-pretend-to-be-ex-military-what-do-they-get-out-of-it/496602/21 "2009-05-17T10:50:52Z")
I was in the Navy (no, really, I was!) and in the early 80s, I did a tour of duty in the Pentagon. One of the senior officers in same OP code where I worked had been a POW in VietNam for a number of years. He never said anything about it - I heard about it from some coworkers. This man was one of the kindest, most laid-back, don’t-sweat-the-small-stuff sort of person I’d ever known. No bragging, no “there I was” stories, no hint at all of what he’d been through. I suspect that’s far more typical than the big-talking jerks who all seem to turn out to be exaggerators at the very least. I also went through OCS with 3 SEALs (we were all enlisted folks moving up the ranks, so they really were SEALs already) and except for their incredible level of fitness, you might not have guessed what they’d achieved. Unless you saw them in their dress uniforms - kinda hard to hide the distinctive devices they’d earned. Based upon these two experiences, I tend to look upon the braggarts as somewhat sad and pathetic. Maybe they did have some time in uniform, but chances are, not to the degree they portrayed. There’s something about wanna-bes… ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2009, 11:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-people-pretend-to-be-ex-military-what-do-they-get-out-of-it/496602/22 "2009-05-17T11:11:33Z")
> [@wolf\_meister](#): > > Many years ago, when I was checking the Internet for the so-called chicken-hawks (ultra-patriotic, kill-a-commie-for-Christ, better-dead-than-red, 150% Americans that _never_ served in the military), I saw many references to a book by BG Burkett entitled [Stolen Valor](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stolen_Valor). > > Besides talking about the “veterans” who were outright frauds, it mentions people like the actor Brian Dennehy (a US Marine Corps veteran) who embellished his military service by saying that he saw combat duty in Vietnam although he never set foot in that country. > > And [Joseph Yandle](http://www.ashbrook.org/publicat/oped/owens/99/60s.html) figured that bringing up his fictional combat service in Vietnam would probably reduce his “life without parole” prison sentence. And with the help of a [“60 Minutes”](http://www.tosettherecordstraight.com/staticpages/index.php?page=Burkett_transcript) story, he was released from jail. He fooled not only the CBS reporters but a great many people in the Massachusetts prison system who never verified his Vietnam war record which was nonexistent. Stolen Valor is a great book. It debunks a lot of the myths about Viet Nam vets. ---
**Author:** ![Koxinga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/4af34b/32.png) [@Koxinga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Koxinga)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2009, 11:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-people-pretend-to-be-ex-military-what-do-they-get-out-of-it/496602/23 "2009-05-17T11:15:52Z")
I wonder if Sean Bean’s character in _Ronin_ might be illustrative of the wannabe mentality. “What’s the color of the boathouse at Hereford?” ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2009, 11:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-people-pretend-to-be-ex-military-what-do-they-get-out-of-it/496602/24 "2009-05-17T11:44:02Z")
We have a guy at work that likes to inflate the importance of his military career. He was in the army but apparently was involved in many secret programs. He tends to not speak to me about it since I can see through his bullshit. One time in the course of a conversation I mentioned the difference between the Global War on Terrorism Expeditionary Medal and the GWOT Service Medal and why I got one but not the other after a deployment. He told me, “I have one of those.” He got out of the army in the early 80s. Obviously the GWOT medal didn’t exist until after 2001. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2009, 2:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-people-pretend-to-be-ex-military-what-do-they-get-out-of-it/496602/25 "2009-05-17T14:13:11Z")
> [@Argent\_Towers](#): > > I’m just dumbfounded that he was able to _found a veteran’s group_ and nobody checked his credentials. Who would think to do that? Except in certain situations, who thinks to check that sort of thing? ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2009, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-people-pretend-to-be-ex-military-what-do-they-get-out-of-it/496602/26 "2009-05-17T15:46:35Z")
> [@Koxinga](#): > > I wonder if Sean Bean’s character in _Ronin_ might be illustrative of the wannabe mentality. “What’s the color of the boathouse at Hereford?” There is no boathouse! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![ParentalAdvisory](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/53a042/32.png) [@ParentalAdvisory](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ParentalAdvisory)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2009, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-people-pretend-to-be-ex-military-what-do-they-get-out-of-it/496602/27 "2009-05-17T18:09:12Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Yes, and not just for the Medal of Honor; when googling for a cite I found that in [2005](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stolen_Valor_Act_of_2005) it was made illegal to engage in the “_unauthorized wear, manufacture, sale or claim (either written or verbal) of any military decorations and medals. It is a federal misdemeanor offense, which carries a punishment of imprisonment for not more than 1 year and/or a fine; the scope previously covered only the Medal of Honor_.” Weird, what about army surplus stores? ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2009, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-people-pretend-to-be-ex-military-what-do-they-get-out-of-it/496602/28 "2009-05-17T22:01:14Z")
> [@ParentalAdvisory](#): > > Weird, what about army surplus stores? Doesn’t say uniforms and insignia, just medals and decorations. So I suppose it’s safe to dress in a set of ACUs that say “Petraeus” and have four stars on the chest, so long as you don’t actively try to represent yourself as him (or any other military person). ---
**Author:** ![Khadaji](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Khadaji](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Khadaji)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2009, 11:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-people-pretend-to-be-ex-military-what-do-they-get-out-of-it/496602/29 "2009-05-17T23:33:55Z")
Well, I’m _really_ NSA, but I’m not allowed to tell people, so I tell them I’m military. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Markxxx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/5daacb/32.png) [@Markxxx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Markxxx)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2009, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-people-pretend-to-be-ex-military-what-do-they-get-out-of-it/496602/30 "2009-05-18T01:52:25Z")
Because if you’re a druggie you’re a bum, but if you’re an ex-marine and a druggie you’re a poor soul who lost his way. If you’re a college grad who ran up his credit card buy dumb things, you’re an example of a spoiled kid, if you’re in the military and do that, you’re a poor soul who was only taught to kill not to manage your finances. In otherwords, people make an inexhaustable amount of reasons why whatever an ex-military person does he’s a victim and not responsible for any choices he made. So it’s a good thing to claim to be. Plus it’s easy to fake. If you fake being a doctor you’re easily exposed, if you fake being a priest it’s pretty easy to see you’re not one. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2009, 7:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-people-pretend-to-be-ex-military-what-do-they-get-out-of-it/496602/31 "2009-05-18T07:17:37Z")
> [@bump](#): > > Doesn’t say uniforms and insignia, just medals and decorations. > > So I suppose it’s safe to dress in a set of ACUs that say “Petraeus” and have four stars on the chest, so long as you don’t actively try to represent yourself as him (or any other military person). In this [thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=515468) I cite the federal statutes. It is illegal to wear any part of the uniform. 10 USC Sec 771 > [@](#): > > Except as otherwise provided by law, no person except a member of > the Army, Navy, Air Force, or Marine Corps, as the case may be, may > wear - > (1) the uniform, or a distinctive part of the uniform, of the > Army, Navy, Air Force, or Marine Corps; or > (2) a uniform any part of which is similar to a distinctive > part of the uniform of the Army, Navy, Air Force, or Marine > Corps. There are a few exceptions such as in a play or movie but for the most part it is illegal to wear a uniform even as a cotume. I don’t know of anyone who has been prosecuted for it or if it would hold up in court if pushed. It is a separate and more serious crime to impersonate a member of the military for personal gain. ---
**Author:** ![Cisco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ccd318/32.png) [@Cisco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cisco)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2009, 7:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-people-pretend-to-be-ex-military-what-do-they-get-out-of-it/496602/32 "2009-05-18T07:45:42Z")
I think if every “Navy Seal” or “brother of a Navy Seal” I ever met was legit, the organization would be about as exclusive as the Boy Scouts of America. ---
**Author:** ![DMark](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e68b1a/32.png) [@DMark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DMark)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2009, 8:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-people-pretend-to-be-ex-military-what-do-they-get-out-of-it/496602/33 "2009-05-18T08:04:22Z")
My younger (asshole) brother, should you ever meet him in a bar, will go on and on about his amazing career in the Navy. Mind you, he went AWOL after less than a month - somehow he was able to escape any serious punishment for doing it - I guess the Navy knew enough not to want him back and that one month was the extent of his Navy career. However, to hear him tell about his “distinguished career” today, you would think he was in charge of the fleet. My older brother, the Republican, has of late become the most gung-ho military supporter and has started to send me all sorts of patriotic glurge…mind you, he was in the National Guard back in the days they really were just the “weekend warriors” and the closest he ever came to active duty was standing with a couple of buddies on a street corner in Chicago when they thought there might be a riot (there wasn’t one). In the last couple of years, he has suddenly latched onto a great love of all war films - he told me he has seen Saving Private Ryan dozens of times; good film - yes, but wow, one viewing was enough for me. ---
**Author:** ![Lacunae\_Matata](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8491ac/32.png) [@Lacunae\_Matata](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lacunae_Matata)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2009, 8:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-people-pretend-to-be-ex-military-what-do-they-get-out-of-it/496602/34 "2009-05-18T08:29:14Z")
> [@Loach](#): > > In this [thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=515468) I cite the federal statutes. It is illegal to wear any part of the uniform. > > 10 USC Sec 771 > > There are a few exceptions such as in a play or movie but for the most part it is illegal to wear a uniform even as a cotume. I don’t know of anyone who has been prosecuted for it or if it would hold up in court if pushed. It is a separate and more serious crime to impersonate a member of the military for personal gain. Wow! I have a couple of sets of BDUs that I use for working around the yard (the ribbons to tie up the ankles are perfect - keep the fire ants from crawling up my legs if/when I step into a mound.) The BDUs were my brother’s, until his unit replaced them with whatever the latest incarnation of camouflage is called. I removed insignia, just left the name ribbon on the blouse (since it’s my last name, too.) Is this something I could actually get into trouble for? I know the likelihood of being arrested/cited/prosecuted is somewhere between super low and zero, but is it actually illegal? As for the original question: Just a couple of weeks ago, two of my friends and I were treated to a story from another acquaintance, how this guy had been both a Green Beret and a SEAL. The weird thing was that ALL of us know this guy well enough to know that the story is BS, and that my two buddies have a combined total of almost 50 years active duty in the Navy, Army, and National Guard. We were all pretty nonplussed by this claim, but shrugged it off as “Well, Dan’s pretty drunk tonight.” The last time I’d seen this guy that drunk, he was telling me about the bullet lodged too close to his spine to be surgically removed… I think that story was about as true as the service record. Maybe there’s just a certain type of alcoholic appeal to these testosterone-heavy fibs? :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Wallenstein](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b5a626/32.png) [@Wallenstein](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wallenstein)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2009, 8:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-people-pretend-to-be-ex-military-what-do-they-get-out-of-it/496602/35 "2009-05-18T08:44:43Z")
In the UK these lads are known as “Walts”, after Walter Mitty. [This guy](http://www.arrse.co.uk/wiki/James_Shortt) has been under a sustained campaign by UK troops for claiming military honours that are not genuine. > [@](#): > > It was in the month of September 1953 that wise men in the East espied a bright star in the sky. They followed it to Purley in Surrey, where, in a small, semi-detached council house, they found a babe, wrapped in swaddling clothes and laid in a manger - idly polishing some nunchukas. They gave thanks to God and worshipped the infant, leaving him gifts of a stick-on Pancho Villa moustache, a sandy beret and an armful of Legion of Frontiersmen medals. > > Now fast forward fifty-five years and that self-same rugrat is now Colonel, The Chevalier James Shortt, Baron of Castleshort. Impressive eh? ---
**Author:** ![Maastricht](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a88e57/32.png) [@Maastricht](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maastricht)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2009, 11:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-people-pretend-to-be-ex-military-what-do-they-get-out-of-it/496602/36 "2009-05-18T11:02:55Z")
I have never heard of this happening on a considerable scale in the Netherlands. But the cultural circumstances are different. Having been in the military is not something to brag about in wider public. Of course, we have our share of people claiming/faking victimhood for their perceived shortcomings. But over here (mental) illness or a bad youth is more commonly used for that. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2009, 12:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-people-pretend-to-be-ex-military-what-do-they-get-out-of-it/496602/37 "2009-05-18T12:40:24Z")
> [@Lacunae\_Matata](#): > > Wow! I have a couple of sets of BDUs that I use for working around the yard (the ribbons to tie up the ankles are perfect - keep the fire ants from crawling up my legs if/when I step into a mound.) The BDUs were my brother’s, until his unit replaced them with whatever the latest incarnation of camouflage is called. I removed insignia, just left the name ribbon on the blouse (since it’s my last name, too.) Is this something I could actually get into trouble for? I know the likelihood of being arrested/cited/prosecuted is somewhere between super low and zero, but is it actually illegal? I can only go by the [cite](http://uscode.house.gov/download/pls/10C45.txt). Seems to me that it was put on the books to go after those that harm the reputation of vets rather than anyone who shops at an Army-Navy store or orders online from Ranger Joe’s. I have no idea if anyone has been prosecuted for the crime. ---
**Author:** ![badbadrubberpiggy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/57b2e6/32.png) [@badbadrubberpiggy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/badbadrubberpiggy)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2009, 1:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-people-pretend-to-be-ex-military-what-do-they-get-out-of-it/496602/38 "2009-05-18T13:33:37Z")
> [@KlondikeGeoff](#): > > Way weird, I’d say. > > I had 5 years, 3 months and 23 days in the army in WWII and the Korean War, and i can’t recall the last time I ever mentioned it to anybody (until now). Seems to me now that it only came up on questionnaires when seeking employment. > > I don’t belong to the American Legion or any other such organizations. I am proud of my service but don’t see any need to mention it. > > **I must be odd, I guess.** (bolding mine) Actually, for people who really did serve in the military, I think you’re the norm. Most people I know who are either current or ex-military don’t talk about it much. My grandfather fought in WWII, and hardly talked about it, ever - he was at the liberation of Buchenwald, and I didn’t know that until a few months before he died, and that was because someone else told me, he never mentioned it. IME, most people who’ve been in combat aren’t too keen to talk about it, never mind brag about it. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2009, 1:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-people-pretend-to-be-ex-military-what-do-they-get-out-of-it/496602/39 "2009-05-18T13:37:53Z")
My uncle is a strange case. He served in the Air Force (I know this because as the executor of I saw his discharge papers – he served 4 years in the 50’s and was honorably discharged), but on occasion he pretended to be an ex-marine. He had a marine bumper sticker on his car. He told one of my relatives that cops respected marines more, and he had got out of several tickets playing the marine card. I have no idea whether he ever went any further than that with his charade. ---
**Author:** ![shiftless](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9c0ed/32.png) [@shiftless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/shiftless)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2009, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-people-pretend-to-be-ex-military-what-do-they-get-out-of-it/496602/40 "2009-05-18T15:44:20Z")
If every guy I ever met that claimed to have been a SEAL or in some “special forces” were actually in them, well, those special forces would have to be a lot less exclusive. I just don’t believe people when they tell me this stuff anymore and that is one good reason why the military needs to punish theses folks. It is, in a way, akin to a trademark violation. I was just young enough to miss the draft for the war in Vietnam yet I see people, younger than me, all the time with some sort of “Vietnam Vet” reference on them. Bums on the side of the road with “Vietnam Vet” as part of their plea or bikers with “Vietnam Vet” on their jackets. There are a lot of people (perhaps all of us?) who embellish or exaggerate their personal histories (ask me later about how I ended the cold war.) Some just let it get out of control. How many of us would question someone who said they were a Vet? Seems kinds of rude. How many of us would offer such a person additional respect, at least, for their expertise. Perhaps we would allow that they speak with greater authority on military matters than us non-Vets. Must be heady stuff for the wannbe military geek to find he can get away with his claims. After 30 or 40 years I bet some of these guys even believe the things they say. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-people-pretend-to-be-ex-military-what-do-they-get-out-of-it/496602.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-so-many-people-pretend-to-be-ex-military-what-do-they-get-out-of-it/496602.md?page=3)