# Why do we fight with our fists? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [March 5, 2004, 2:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-fight-with-our-fists/232623 "2004-03-05T02:27:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 6\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![micco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/5f8ce5/32.png) [@micco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/micco)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2004, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-fight-with-our-fists/232623/21 "2004-03-05T21:11:59Z")
> [@conczepts](#): > > How would breaking techniques used on hard but brittle immobile surfaces like boards be applicable to dealing the most damage to a supple human body? Breaking techniques have little to no basis in reality outside the classroom. The human head is not supple. It resembles a board or a bottle a lot more than it resembles a soft bag of flesh. The skull is very hard, the teeth are very sharp, and while the bones and cartilage of the face will break easily, they’ll also do a lot of damage to your fist. I’m not (and have never) advocating training in breaking techniques, but that doesn’t change the fact that the human body is composed of both hard and soft targets and you have to choose your attacks accordingly. > [@](#): > > Are you suggesting since the knife strike is the best board breaking technique that it’s also supreme in human confrontations? The knife hand strike is very effective against certain targets. Karate people who train that strike use it against collarbones. In kung fu, we have a number of strikes like this which I would use against the throat or certain torso targets. The main drawback of this strike is that it can only be applied at certain angles, which limits targets. And, if you’ll actually read what I wrote, you’ll realize that I’m not suggesting any technique is “supreme”. It’s simply a matter of choosing the right tool for the job. ---
**Author:** ![toadspittle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c0e974/32.png) [@toadspittle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/toadspittle)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2004, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-fight-with-our-fists/232623/22 "2004-03-05T21:46:25Z")
> [@Fish](#): > > Why do we fight with our fists? Cause it HURTS to fight with your nose. Duh. ---
**Author:** ![Glitch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/0ea827/32.png) [@Glitch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Glitch)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2004, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-fight-with-our-fists/232623/23 "2004-03-06T00:35:23Z")
> [@](#): > > My point was that using a fist to punch someone in the face seems to be a tactic made popular by television, but you only have to do it for real once or twice before you realize it’s a truly dumb thing to do. > [@](#): > > I’m not sure I agree that using fists is instinctive…I think a lot of fist-fighting is learned behavior because we’re exposed to TV characters who fist fight with no apparent injury And again, both of those quotes above are wrong. People use their fist for the reasons I’ve already specified. It has nothing to do with television or any other media at all. It has to do with instinct, body mechanics and psychology. > [@](#): > > As it relates to the OP, I was just trying to point out that every martial art I’ve trained recognizes that the fist is a fairly fragile weapon and includes other techniques to use in its place when appropriate. The thing is that it doesn’t relate to the OP. The OP asks why people _do_ punch with their fist, not why they shouldn’t. See: “Fighting Techniques of the Ancient World (3000 B.C. to 500 A.D.): Equipment, Combat Skills, and Tactics” by Simon Anglim “Real Fighting” by Peyton Quinn “The Origins of War: From the Stone Age to Alexander the Great” by Arthur Ferrill “Dead Or Alive: The Choice Is Yours : The Definitive Self-Protection Handbook” by Geoff Thompson On the psychology side, any good basic book on psychology should have a section on fight/flight response or confrontational stress response. Interestingly enough, one method of stress relief is to clench your fist, because it helps relieve the aggressive need in the brain. If you really need me to find a specific title and you actually plan to read it, email me and I’ll find one for you. I’m hoping the body mechanics aspect is obvious. ---
**Author:** ![conczepts](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e7dd6/32.png) [@conczepts](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/conczepts)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2004, 12:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-fight-with-our-fists/232623/24 "2004-03-06T00:40:51Z")
> [@micco](#): > > And, if you’ll actually read what I wrote, you’ll realize that I’m not suggesting any technique is “supreme”. It’s simply a matter of choosing the right tool for the job. Sorry if I came off as a bit snotty in my previous post. I think I was put on the defensive because I interpreted your post as saying that palm hands are better than punches on humans because they’re easier to break boards with. It seemed like you were criticizing punching people, which for people who only fight closed-fisted like me (unless grappling) has proven very effective. ---
**Author:** ![raygirvan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ac91a4/32.png) [@raygirvan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raygirvan)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2004, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-fight-with-our-fists/232623/25 "2004-03-06T02:09:34Z")
> [@Glitch](#): > > micco: Using a fist as the primary basic strike for fighting GREATLY predates television. Consider that most every martial art developed in the entire history of mankind has included some kind of fist strike should start to tell about the instinctive and pervasiveness of the fist strike. I largely agree with **micco**. There is an instinct to use the fist, but “punching” - i.e. leading with the knuckles to strike - seems to be a style that every culture develops as practical. As can be seen with small children and primates, in whom it hasn’t been culturally modified, the instinct is to use an overarm strike, fist starting behind the head and flailing down. Some view the [hand-behind-head](http://members.aol.com/nonverbal2/handbehi.htm) gesture when angry as a remnant of this instinct. ---
**Author:** ![js\_africanus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/87869e/32.png) [@js\_africanus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/js_africanus)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2004, 4:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-fight-with-our-fists/232623/26 "2004-03-06T04:04:25Z")
I gotta be honest: I’d like to see some citations on this. If you watch _bad_ boxing, e.g. celebrity boxing, toughman, or basketball pros fighting, it really doesn’t look like a person in a panic really strikes with the 1[sup]st[/sup] & 2[sup]nd[/sup] metacarpals normal to the striked surface. Instead, it generally looks as if the hand is closed into a fist with the palm coming in as though the real striking surface is the palm heel, used in a slapping sort of motion, and the fist is to protect the fingers. That is, the hand is coming in from the side, not from the front. I’ve even seen some boxing matches on television where less experienced fighters are “slapping”, in the words of the commentators, and, IIRC, in some of the early UFC fights karate experts, etc., were reduced to essentially the same type of blow (when not taken to the mat by a grappler 😉 ), the arcing “slap”. So I have to question whether the fist as we think of it really is the instinctive tool, or whether it is the palm heel and the fingers curl up to protect them from being bent backward. My doc said that he sees fifty or sixty Boxer’s Breaks (also known as the Asshole Break) a year, and this is not a populous region. That’s a lot of breaking going on. It is also my understanding that in martial arts breaking boards with the fist is frowned upon. Punching to the head is also a no-no, though martial arts weren’t on track w/ reality until the UFCs demonstrated the fragility of the hand to the previously cloistered martial arts world. Finally, my very limited primate observation, i.e. nature documentaries, shows apes slapping rather than punching. Why the switch? A strong-wristed slap will rattle an opponent’s head and give a knock out, no? So why do we punch? I’m not convinced that we do so naturally; but, that it is something that came later, perhaps when padding & preparation made the hand unnaturally strong and therefore safe to strike with. Thoughts? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-fight-with-our-fists/232623.md?page=1)