# Why do we have to put up with Religious People? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 7, 2020, 6:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-have-to-put-up-with-religious-people/917474 "2020-08-07T06:20:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 25
**Author:** ![needscoffee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/needscoffee/32/1076_2.png) [@needscoffee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/needscoffee)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2020, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-have-to-put-up-with-religious-people/917474/483 "2020-08-13T14:38:47Z")
> [@thorny\_locust](#): > > > [@needscoffee](#): > > > > it is rare for it to happen the other way around, for the atheist family to have one member who becomes ultra-religious. > > My grandmother was vehemently atheist, and one of her six children became religious. My parents never practiced, and while their children weren’t raised specifically atheist, we were raised with no religious education or practice. One of my sisters became sort of religious, and two of her children considerably more so. > > None of them are anything I’d call ultra-religious; but while it may be less common, some people raised in secular families do take up religion Which is almost exactly what I said. It’s rare. ---
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2020, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-have-to-put-up-with-religious-people/917474/484 "2020-08-13T14:41:03Z")
> [@](#): > > _ **Jesus freak** _ is a term arising from the late 1960s and early 1970s [counterculture](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Counterculture_of_the_1960s) and is frequently used as a [pejorative](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pejorative) for those involved in the [Jesus movement](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jesus_movement). As [Tom Wolfe](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tom_Wolfe) illustrates in _[The Electric Kool-Aid Acid Test](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Electric_Kool-Aid_Acid_Test)_ , the term “freak” with a preceding qualifier was a strictly neutral term and described any counterculture member with a specific interest in a given subject; hence “acid freak” and “Jesus freak”. The term “freak” was in common-enough currency that [Hunter S. Thompson](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hunter_S._Thompson)’s failed bid for sheriff of [Pitkin County, Colorado](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pitkin_County,_Colorado), was as a member of the “Freak Power” party. However, many later members of the movement, those misunderstanding the countercultural roots believed the term to be negative, and co-opted and embraced the term, and its usage broadened to describe a [Christian](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christians) subculture throughout the [hippie](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hippie) and [back-to-the-land movements](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Back-to-the-land_movement) that focused on universal love and [pacifism](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pacifism), and relished the radical nature of [Jesus](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jesus_in_Christianity)’s message. CMC ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2020, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-have-to-put-up-with-religious-people/917474/485 "2020-08-13T14:51:36Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > Peer pressure - in general, you’re much likelier to encounter pressure to go atheist from school peers than to go Christian (unless you’re going to a religious school.) And teachers in general are likelier to influence their pupils to go in the atheist direction than the Christian direction. And the media, entertainment, Hollywood, etc. all is likelier to lead one down the non-religious direction as well. It never ceases to amaze me how strong the persecution complex among some Christians is, despite the fact that they are the majority and dominate the culture… I guess it makes sense though, theologically Christianity is inconsistent with being the majority governing religion, so this narrative is very convenient. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2020, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-have-to-put-up-with-religious-people/917474/486 "2020-08-13T14:54:11Z")
In some Christian cultures martyrdom is so ingrained that they have to create it to feel fulfilled. ---
**Author:** ![Jasmine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jasmine/32/2964_2.png) [@Jasmine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jasmine)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2020, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-have-to-put-up-with-religious-people/917474/487 "2020-08-13T14:57:51Z")
I have the same admonishment for both the aggressive atheists and the religious fanatics. BE QUIET. Emily Post mandated that neither politics nor religion should be discussed at the dinner table because it is potentially troublesome and thus impolite. I’d like to expand that to cover pretty much all venues. ---
**Author:** ![needscoffee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/needscoffee/32/1076_2.png) [@needscoffee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/needscoffee)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2020, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-have-to-put-up-with-religious-people/917474/488 "2020-08-13T15:21:42Z")
The “aggressive” atheists are responding to the religious people who can’t seem to keep it to themselves or to stop imposing their beliefs on others. So, no, staying quiet when that happens isn’t a good option. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2020, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-have-to-put-up-with-religious-people/917474/489 "2020-08-13T15:28:05Z")
Among the religious people who can’t seem to keep it to themselves; those who insist that everyone say “Merry Christmas” in November and December rather than “Happy Holidays” even though not everyone is Christian nor does everyone celebrate Christmas. ---
**Author:** ![Jasmine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jasmine/32/2964_2.png) [@Jasmine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jasmine)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2020, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-have-to-put-up-with-religious-people/917474/490 "2020-08-13T15:28:59Z")
> [@needscoffee](#): > > The “aggressive” atheists are responding to the religious people who can’t seem to keep it to themselves or to stop imposing their beliefs on others. Not in all cases by any stretch of the imagination. In fact, if I read him correctly, the OP of this thread is basically stating that he should be able to tell off any religious person he comes in contact with simply because he doesn’t like them. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2020, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-have-to-put-up-with-religious-people/917474/491 "2020-08-13T15:32:54Z")
> [@BippityBoppityBoo](#): > > Nah. It just looks easier to you. I have to answer to a higher authority-me. I have figure out my own moral imperatives and the strategies (i.e. rules) to reach them, rather than have them handed to me. Of course, someone might respond “You don’t have to do that. You choose to.” And I’m sure atheists run the gamut from working out all their own moral imperatives for themselves, to swallowing them whole from somewhere else, to just being amoral. As do people who profess to follow a religion. The part that Velocity is right about is that atheism itself doesn’t impose any requirements on anyone. But it doesn’t follow that an atheist’s life is easier. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2020, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-have-to-put-up-with-religious-people/917474/492 "2020-08-13T15:40:15Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > It never ceases to amaze me how strong the persecution complex among some Christians is, despite the fact that they are the majority and dominate the culture… I guess it makes sense though, theologically Christianity is inconsistent with being the majority governing religion, so this narrative is very convenient. Everyone naturally plays up their disadvantages in perception and plays down their advantages (and vice versa for their opponents; play up their opponent’s advantages while playing down their opponents’ disadvantages.) Christians are no exception. ---
**Author:** ![ASL\_v2.0](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asl_v2.0/32/3525_2.png) [@ASL\_v2.0](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ASL_v2.0)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2020, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-have-to-put-up-with-religious-people/917474/493 "2020-08-13T15:57:41Z")
> [@Jasmine](#): > > Not in all cases by any stretch of the imagination. In fact, if I read him correctly, the OP of this thread is basically stating that he should be able to tell off any religious person he comes in contact with simply because he doesn’t like them I am not satisfied that the OP is an atheist, as evidenced by their being banned as a sock. Beyond that, silence tends to benefit the oppressor over the oppressed. So, no, given the privilege and influence Christianity enjoys in America, no. No I will not be quiet. But thank you for reminding us that, yes, there is a corollary for “Jesus freak” for those who need one. That is “aggressive,” “militant” or “angry” atheist for anyone who won’t just “be quiet” as supposedly moderate Americans demand. ---
**Author:** ![DesertDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desertdog/32/11503_2.png) [@DesertDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DesertDog)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2020, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-have-to-put-up-with-religious-people/917474/494 "2020-08-13T16:47:35Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > As I said, atheists will leave you alone if you don’t make ridiculous claims about the age of the Earth and the rest of the universe. Actually, I’m okay with their assertions. “The earth is only 6,000 years old, flat, and covered with a crystalline dome.” “That’s nice.” OTOH, “We need to teach kids that the earth is only 6,000 years old, flat, and covered with a crystalline dome,” will lead to be asking for evidence. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2020, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-have-to-put-up-with-religious-people/917474/495 "2020-08-13T17:16:09Z")
The post I was replying to said, “They’re not trying to actively convert Christians, but in general, someone is likelier to face mockery for claiming in class that the Earth is only 8,000 years old, versus several billion years old (not that all Christians are YECs, but that is one tangential example.)” So we are talking about a Young Earth Creationist Christian who is making ridiculous claims in a school classroom about the age of the Earth. ---
**Author:** ![thorny\_locust](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thorny_locust/32/431_2.png) [@thorny\_locust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thorny_locust)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2020, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-have-to-put-up-with-religious-people/917474/496 "2020-08-13T17:27:59Z")
> [@needscoffee](#): > > Which is almost exactly what I said. It’s rare. I didn’t think four cases in one family was all that rare. But whether it’s equally common in other families I don’t know. ---
**Author:** ![Eonwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eonwe/32/240_2.png) [@Eonwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eonwe)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2020, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-have-to-put-up-with-religious-people/917474/497 "2020-08-13T18:52:37Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > teachers in general are likelier to influence their pupils to go in the atheist direction than the Christian direction. Are you under the impression that most teachers are atheists? ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2020, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-have-to-put-up-with-religious-people/917474/498 "2020-08-13T18:58:29Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > They’re not trying to actively convert Christians, but in general, someone is likelier to face mockery for claiming in class that the Earth is only 8,000 years old, versus several billion years old (not that all Christians are YECs, but that is one tangential example.) Or the term “Jesus freak,” for instance - you don’t hear terms like “atheist freak.” My kids went to high school in a relatively secular community (gay couples at the prom were not exceptional years and years before SSM became legal) but they never espoused atheism to anyone. Their religious friends did. One would hope that anyone with two brain cells to rub together would mock YEC. None of that around in the school, our biology books handled evolution very well and I think YECers got home schooled. And I was around at the time and agree with the cite - Jesus freaks self identified, since if you were young being a freak was a good thing, not a bad thing. David Crosby - letting my freak flag fly. Someone at Woodstock, looking at the crowd, said “lotta freaks,” and that wasn’t an insult. And I just bet that lots of atheists in the Bible Belt run around advertising it. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2020, 7:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-have-to-put-up-with-religious-people/917474/499 "2020-08-13T19:00:08Z")
Yes, certainly. Atheists proselytize also. In fact that study about how much religion cost is a prime example. It wasnt published in any peer reviewed respected economics journal, instead in a Atheist newsletter. It was full of lies, half-truths, made up statistics and a basic misunderstanding of how tax laws work. It was pure, 100% Atheist proselytizing. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2020, 7:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-have-to-put-up-with-religious-people/917474/500 "2020-08-13T19:00:11Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > And teachers in general are likelier to influence their pupils to go in the atheist direction than the Christian direction. Oh, please. “Teachers in general” come from the population in general so the great majority will be believers of one or another sort. But yes, seriously believing YEC _as an alternative valid explanation for the actual material world’s origin_ and development opposed to holding it as an allegory will get you mocked … and rightly so. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2020, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-have-to-put-up-with-religious-people/917474/501 "2020-08-13T19:01:57Z")
Totally false. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2020, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-have-to-put-up-with-religious-people/917474/502 "2020-08-13T19:03:15Z")
Christmas, at least in the USA, is 90% a secular holiday. Just like Halloween and Thanksgiving. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-have-to-put-up-with-religious-people/917474.md?page=24) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-have-to-put-up-with-religious-people/917474.md?page=26)