# Why do we think of Napoleon as silly? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [November 10, 2008, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-think-of-napoleon-as-silly/472136 "2008-11-10T23:17:16Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 6\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Lust4Life](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ecc23a/32.png) [@Lust4Life](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lust4Life)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2008, 12:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-think-of-napoleon-as-silly/472136/81 "2008-11-15T12:35:13Z")
> [@chowder](#): > > Treacherous swine;) Sorry mate,I did of course mean “For a Frenchman” ---
**Author:** ![chowder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/977dab/32.png) [@chowder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chowder)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2008, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-think-of-napoleon-as-silly/472136/82 "2008-11-15T19:38:24Z")
> [@Lust4Life](#): > > Sorry mate,I did of course mean “For a Frenchman” Well OK I’ll let it go this time. Just be careful in future:p Incidentally, he wasn’t French ---
**Author:** ![Askance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/askance/32/8281_2.png) [@Askance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Askance)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2008, 3:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-think-of-napoleon-as-silly/472136/83 "2008-11-17T03:04:26Z")
> [@chowder](#): > > I’m English my good fellow and I’m not grouchy in the least. No, since [Marshal Grouchy](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emmanuel,_marquis_de_Grouchy) was indeed French. ---
**Author:** ![Askance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/askance/32/8281_2.png) [@Askance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Askance)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2008, 3:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-think-of-napoleon-as-silly/472136/84 "2008-11-17T03:05:41Z")
> [@Cicero](#): > > Russia has a lot of Asian territory and was an Asian as well as a European power (although to what extent is questionable after the 1904 war with Japan). There was no need for the Germans to go near the Asian territories, Precisely. So the German defeat of Russia in WWI can in no way be characterised as them winning a land war in Asia, now can it? ---
**Author:** ![Manduck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/manduck/32/256_2.png) [@Manduck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Manduck)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2008, 8:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-think-of-napoleon-as-silly/472136/85 "2008-11-17T08:03:54Z")
> [@Askance](#): > > No, since [Marshal Grouchy](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emmanuel,_marquis_de_Grouchy) was indeed French. Interesting that you brought that up, because, to my knowledge, Grouchy is the only one of the seven dwarves to achieve renown outside the realm of fairy tales. ---
**Author:** ![Raguleader](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/258eb7/32.png) [@Raguleader](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Raguleader)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2008, 10:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-think-of-napoleon-as-silly/472136/86 "2008-11-17T10:39:16Z")
On the subject of Germany fighting a land war in Asia, they did fight a number of battles in China against the Empire of Japan, which IIRC went poorly for them (the only example I have off the top of my head is the Siege of Tsingtao, which took place in Qingdao, China (home to a rather nice German beer, 青島啤酒), and ended as a victory for the Japanese and British. But yeah, to further answer the question, if Napoleon is considered a comic figure, it’s largely because of cultural influences from the United Kingdom, a country that the US has long held cultural and linguistic ties with (even if they do refuse to speak the language properly or drive on the correct side of the road over there…) If I had to hazard a further guess, Napoleon is a symbol of French military might, I mean, he did defeat most of Europe during his time, not something everybody gets to do while in office. I would even go so far as to say that, historically speaking, he’s one of those “rockstar” figures, guys like Winston Churchill or Genghis Khan who invariably end up coming off as larger than life in some ways. If you haven’t noticed, relations between France and the US haven’t been the best in the last 10 or 15 years, and indeed, relations between our countries do a fun back-and-forth love-hate swing (we and France had a common enemy in Britain during the War of 1812, but in the Quasi-War of 1798, we and the English had a common enemy in the French, with American ships putting into port at British bases and purchasing supplies, and American and Brit merchants convoying together for protection). Lately, mostly we just badmouth eachother and then proceed to work together whenever practical (France has been one of our allies in Afghanistan since 2001 or early 2002). So, the option of depicting one of their greatest heros as some foofy height-challenged crazy is attractive, even if during his own time we got along with him well enough and did business with him (I remember a cartoon on TV depicting Napoleon swimming Scrooge McDuck style in a pile of money saying “FEEFTEEN MEELLION AMERICAN DOHLLARS!”) It’s hard to find a French hero that we do take very seriously in the US, pop-culture wise, actually. How do they feel about DeGualle in France? Actually, out of curiosity, how do they feel about LaFayette in France nowadays, if anyone actively holds an opinion? He’s held in fairly high regard in the US even for an American officer, let alone a French one, albeit he doesn’t come up often in conversation. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-think-of-napoleon-as-silly/472136.md?page=4)