# Why do we tip in restaurants? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [June 1, 2002, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-tip-in-restaurants/111889 "2002-06-01T14:42:22Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![LolaCocaCola](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7cd45c/32.png) [@LolaCocaCola](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LolaCocaCola)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2002, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-tip-in-restaurants/111889/1 "2002-06-01T14:42:22Z")
How is it the restaurant industry gets away with paying below minimum wage (I think it’s like $3 per hour) to its employees and not provide (for the most part) a group medical plan and paid vacation time? A lot of restaurants, especially in Manhattan, make millions of dollars a year in profit. Why is it left to the customer to pay their employees (in tips) when other businesses have to provide a living wage, paid vacation and group medical coverage? ---
**Author:** ![PhiloVance](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e19adc/32.png) [@PhiloVance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PhiloVance)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2002, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-tip-in-restaurants/111889/2 "2002-06-01T15:35:11Z")
I don’t know where you live, but in the US I think minimum wage is 5.75 or something. It’s illegal to pay less than this **for any job**. In California I think the minimum wage is about 6.25 or so. It was my impression that TIP originally meant ‘to insure promptness’, but I could be wrong. It apparently became a habit and just stuck around. Tipping is now codified in the Internal Revenue Code in that if you’re classified as a waiter/waitress, 8% of your income is considered tips and as such is taxable, _whether or not you get tipped that much_. I have to agree with you that the restaurant industry takes advantage of the situation and pays as low a wage as they can and gets away with it. I also personally think this is counter productive as you spend a lot of time training people. My wife and I go to restuarants here in town quite a bit since we’re now older and have no kids at home. I usually tip 15-20% mostly because we know the people we’re tipping and respect the fact that they’re not getting paid as much as others. Out of town, it depends on the service provided. In a kind of hijack, does anyone tip at self serve places (fast food, cafeteria style) where there’s very little waiting involved? Another hijack, I dig your user name. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Shagnasty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9dc877/32.png) [@Shagnasty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shagnasty)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2002, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-tip-in-restaurants/111889/3 "2002-06-01T15:43:18Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by PhiloVance \* > \*\*I don’t know where you live, but in the US I think minimum wage is 5.75 or something. It’s illegal to pay less than this **for any job**. In California I think the minimum wage is about 6.25 or so. > \*\* Oh you just couldn’t be more wrong on this one although you are correct about the California part. Wait staff and other “tipped” employees most certainly get paid less than the minimum wage by the restaurant or bar in most states. The federally madadted minimum wage for these employee’s is $2.13 an hour. Sometimes I wonder why they even bother and just make it $0 to admit that it is not worth anything and tips are why the waitron works there. Here is a break-down by state: [http://www.dol.gov/esa/programs/whd/state/tipped.htm](http://www.dol.gov/esa/programs/whd/state/tipped.htm) There are kinds of different (lower) minimum wages for all kinds of businesses as you will see. ---
**Author:** ![LolaCocaCola](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7cd45c/32.png) [@LolaCocaCola](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LolaCocaCola)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2002, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-tip-in-restaurants/111889/4 "2002-06-01T15:47:54Z")
Thanks for the compliment, Philo 🙂 Shag is right, restaurant workers (i.e. waiters) usually make less than $3.00 per hour and after the taxes get taken out, their paychecks are usually “voids” and generally they owe thousands of dollars in taxes each year. ---
**Author:** ![Athena](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/35a633/32.png) [@Athena](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Athena)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2002, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-tip-in-restaurants/111889/5 "2002-06-01T17:02:26Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by LolaCocaCola \* > \*\* > A lot of restaurants, especially in Manhattan, make millions of dollars a year in profit. > \*\* I’m no expert in the restaurant field, but this figure seems pretty high. I looked into going to cooking school once, and the salary they quoted for a top chef who owned one successful restaurant was about $80K/year. Of course, we’re not talking celebrity chefs like Emeril or Wolfgang Puck - we’re just talking a reasonably successful restaurant. ---
**Author:** ![peepthis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/9d8465/32.png) [@peepthis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peepthis)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2002, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-tip-in-restaurants/111889/6 "2002-06-01T17:07:26Z")
The law states that if an employee, after tips, doesn’t make the minimum wage, then the employer must pay the difference to the employee. So if a waiter is making $2.13/hour, and makes zilch in tips, _technically_ the restaurant must pay the waiter the extra $3 and change in salary. In this way, you’re guaranteed by law to make the minimum wage. Getting that extra money out of an employer would be the hard part though. ---
**Author:** ![Janx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/b9bd4f/32.png) [@Janx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Janx)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2002, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-tip-in-restaurants/111889/7 "2002-06-01T17:50:29Z")
If all this is true, why in the hell would anyone EVER work in a restaurant? Talk about slavery, JEEZ! (no insult intended, I just didn’t know waitrons were _SO_ taken advantage of) seems to me for the same skill level one could find a job in retail or something. I may be wrong, so, tell me are the tips that good. BTW - my sister has been picking up tables at places like Denny’s for years, let me tell ya, with prices like those of a coffee shop - tips ain’t much, and yes, I always ask her “Why the hell do you work in places that?!?” As for the OP: Here in Brazil, only in “Fancy” restaurants do you tip, then its just conveniently added to the bill for you (15%- and I dont think the waitron gets any unless you press som raw cash directly into his/her hand). In smaller Luncheonettes tipping is not expected, except at Christmas time when regulars are shamelessly asked to contribute to the “Caxina” (little box), and EVERY ONE gets in on the act, I’m talking about even the municipal street sweepers and postal workers, it’s also (often not very vaguely) implied that this is to ensure the same level of service in the coming year. If you don’t tip something you are generally regarded as pond scum and had better not ask for anything resembling service in the coming year, that will teach you!😛 ---
**Author:** ![LolaCocaCola](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7cd45c/32.png) [@LolaCocaCola](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LolaCocaCola)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2002, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-tip-in-restaurants/111889/8 "2002-06-01T17:55:35Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Janx \* > \*\*If all this is true, why in the hell would anyone EVER work > in a restaurant? Talk about slavery, JEEZ! (no insult intended, > I just didn’t know waitrons were _SO_ taken advantage of) > seems to me for the same skill level one could find a job > in retail or something. > I may be wrong, so, tell me are the tips that good. > \*\* Well, in decent restaurants the waiters can make between $150-$200 a night in tips. Considerably more than what one makes working retail, but once again, the customer pays for it, NOT the employer. ---
**Author:** ![Hari\_Seldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hari_seldon/32/5173_2.png) [@Hari\_Seldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hari_Seldon)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2002, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-tip-in-restaurants/111889/9 "2002-06-01T18:06:27Z")
I read somewhere recently that tipping started in the US around 1900 and was at first considered demeaning. I agree. In Europe, they either include “service” in the price or add a stated fixed amount. I much prefer that. Apparently tipping, when it started was 5-8%. By mid-century, it had grown to 10%, which was at least easy to figure. Then people told me that 15% was standard. Now it seems to be 18-20%. It is getting a bit ridiculous. And it is demeaning, besides. Yet what would happen if a restaurant decided to simply build the service into the price? Well, their prices would look 20% higher than their competitors and many people would insist on tipping anyway. Sheep. In Europe, some people leave the small change. In Japan, you pay at the cash and there is no tip. Much more hygienic since you don’t have the same person handling the food and the filthy (literally) lucre. In 1950 most US restaurants were like that (although there was tipping, you paid at the cash), but then it became upscale to mimic the European system of having the waiters collect the money and now almost everybody does it. I wonder what would happen if someone opened a restaurant and put up big signs saying that, in the interests of hygiene, the waiters were not permitted to handle both food and money and therefore, (1) ALL service charges were included, (2) Tipping is strictly forbidden, and (3) Bills were to be settled at the cash. Of course, the tax people would have to be convinced not to add 8% in such cases. They ought to welcome it since I believe that tips amount to much more than 8% of income. In fact, from the posts, it sounds like tips are more than 50% of income. ---
**Author:** ![Janx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/b9bd4f/32.png) [@Janx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Janx)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2002, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-tip-in-restaurants/111889/10 "2002-06-01T18:21:42Z")
From LolaCocaCola: > [@](#): > > in decent restaurants the waiters can make between $150-$200 a > night in tips. Well, I stand corrected, I might think $150-$200 bucks a _night_ qualifies as good. I’m in the wrong business. Do I have to go to some kind of school for snobby waiters to make that kind of money? Oh, and your point about the consumer taking up the slack for the owners is well taken. ---
**Author:** ![zen101](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c68b51/32.png) [@zen101](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zen101)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2002, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-tip-in-restaurants/111889/11 "2002-06-01T18:37:55Z")
Frankly there is entirely too much tippingh going on. I feel obliged to tip waitstaff no matter what the quality of service is/was, tipping beyong my actual means if the service was exceptional. Gratuity should be regarded, in practice, as a form of “thanks”. If you recieve sub-par, rude, or otherwise shirty service then tipping should be passed upon. Certainly there are people who would lose a large portion of income if tipping only ocurred when they actually did a good job, but then maybe they shouldn’t be in this industry. I have many times gotten excellent service at fast-food resturants, but those people are forbidden from accepting tips (usually by corporate policy, and in the case of McDonalds California law prohibits it because employees didn’t get to keep them). as for the etymology of the word “Tip”: The popular explanation of the origin of tip, meaning a gratuity, is that it is an acronym meaning “to ensure promptness.” This is incorrect. Tip is underworld cant meaning to pass on, to hand to, especially to pass on a small sum of money. It dates to at least 1610. The verb meaning to give a gratuity dates to about a century later, and the noun dates to at least 1755. And as we’ve seen many times in these pages, there are no pre-20th century acronymic word origins. ([wordorigins.com](http://wordorigins.com)) ---
**Author:** ![manhattan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/manhattan/32/7_2.png) [@manhattan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/manhattan)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2002, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-tip-in-restaurants/111889/12 "2002-06-01T18:46:46Z")
I sentence each of you to 20 minutes in the archives. **Cecil Adams** on the [origin of tipping](http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a1_333.html) . ---
**Author:** ![chula](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a4c791/32.png) [@chula](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chula)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2002, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-tip-in-restaurants/111889/13 "2002-06-01T18:51:19Z")
$150-$200 a night is in a fancy restaurant in a big city. I worked in a pretty upscale place in San Francisco and $100 was about average. Keep in mind that in a large restaurant, the server has to “tip out” her busboys, food runners, bartender, host, and everyone else, and ends up keeping less than half of the tips received. As someone who has worked as a waitress and has lots of friends in the restaurant industry, I think the practice should be done away with. The size of tips received has almost no correlation to the quality of service. It was always the difficult customers who received great service who would undertip, while the nice customers would give me great tips even if I screwed up. The size of the tip is a reflection of you, the customer, not me, the server. ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2002, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-tip-in-restaurants/111889/14 "2002-06-01T19:01:23Z")
The real reason we tip in restaurants is so next time we come, we don’t have server’s fingers in our food. **Shag** one of the practical reasons for insisting that the restaurant does pay ‘some’ real wage in addition to the tips, is that it provides for some documentation of wages (IRS, SS both need this) **and** it also provides for a mechanism for the IRS, states etc. to get their income tax paid through withholding. When I’ve seen server’s pay stubs it looks like this: # hours x $ 2.35= xx.xx plus tips reported YYY.00 = Gross wages BBB.xx less FICA less Fed w/h Less State w/h Less Local w/h = net pay \*\*Paycheck amount would be the X hours x 2.35 minus all of the deductions listed. And, the servers I knew all made substantially more in tips than what were reported. $100 a day wasn’t uncommon, even in places like BigBoy, Bill Knapps (family style restaurants, average meal about $8) ---
**Author:** ![cleops](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/2acd7d/32.png) [@cleops](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cleops)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2002, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-tip-in-restaurants/111889/15 "2002-06-01T20:12:50Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by wring \* > \*\*The real reason we tip in restaurants is so next time we come, we don’t have server’s fingers in our food. > > \*\* Huh? Only if you go to the same restaurant numerous times and strike up an acquaintance with a wait"ron" (waitron ??–that’s a new one on me!). Nearly every time I go to a restaurant I don’t know the waitrons from Adam or Eve, nor do they know me from Hector and his pup, and I tip because that’s the damn custom; the waitrons (hey, I like that word) live on that money, so I feel it’s only right to fork it over. Cripes, that’s part of the deal when you go out to eat. Not too difficult to understand. ---
**Author:** ![PhiloVance](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e19adc/32.png) [@PhiloVance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PhiloVance)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2002, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-tip-in-restaurants/111889/16 "2002-06-01T21:01:10Z")
My son-in-law worked at the Red Lion dining room, I believe the name of the restaurant was Mistys, sort of a fine dining place. He had one customer, a heart specialist, who would come in and give him $50 up front, I guess, **to insure promptness**. My son-in-law was a good waiter, so it wouldn’t have matterd, but it was nice. And yes a normal day was about $100, weekends were about $150-200 in tips. Nice money, but you have to work hard for it. Also, busboy, bar people, etc. all get a portion of your tips. There’s a scale (percentage) for figuring this out. Yeah **waitron** 😕 is a new on one me also. Hey, Cecil confirmed the meaning I gave for TIP but it sounds like an urban legend. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Janx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/b9bd4f/32.png) [@Janx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Janx)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2002, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-tip-in-restaurants/111889/17 "2002-06-01T22:37:17Z")
[hijack] about the word “waitron” - got it from a radio show in Los Angeles in 1997, the segment was on political correctness run amok - I thought it was cool, and pleasing to the ear for “PC” so I use it[/hijack] by Chula: > [@](#): > > **It was always the difficult customers who received great service > who would undertip, while the nice customers would give me great tips even > if I screwed up. The size of the tip is a reflection of you, the customer, not > me, the server.** I have to agree: Many moons ago I was a bell hop at fancy-schmancy hotel in Santa Barbara CA., whenever I sensed the client was a jerk I always tried to do a bit better - NOT - because I was hoping for a better tip, but because I understood that the likelihood of them complaining to my boss was much higher, and that sort always tipped for doo-doo, then there was the average folks out on vacation, I gave good service but didn’t over do it - and ALWAYS came away with a nice tip, I feel they wanted me to know them as nice people, that goes for me too, I tip in such a way that I don’t want the staff (or my friends) to think I’m a jerk. A story/example: There was this guy staying in the presidential suite - waiting for the limo to take him to his wedding, a button popped of his shirt and he freaked!, he called the bell desk asking for me, I hied myself to the gift shop, grabbed a sewing kit and put the the thing back on just the way mom taught me, 10 minutes MAX, and a nice diversion to boot! he tipped me $100, His buddies were _very_ impressed with this. I told the guy that this was totally un-necessary because when he came in last night he had already “taken care of me” but he insisted (guess he didn’t want me or his friends to think he was a skin flint)- and yes, I gave the girl in the gift shop $25 bucks. ---
**Author:** ![tarokaja](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7c8e57/32.png) [@tarokaja](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tarokaja)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2002, 3:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-tip-in-restaurants/111889/18 "2002-06-02T03:14:37Z")
Just BTW, here in Japan ther’s basically no tipping at all. Very fancy places sometimes add a service charge to the bill, but most restaurants don’t even do this. I’ve heard that this is similar elsewhere in East Asia as well, though I don’t really know. ---
**Author:** ![tarokaja](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7c8e57/32.png) [@tarokaja](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tarokaja)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2002, 3:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-tip-in-restaurants/111889/19 "2002-06-02T03:15:57Z")
Meaning “there’s”, of course. Please excuse me, I’m having a bad typo day today :eek: ---
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2002, 4:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-tip-in-restaurants/111889/20 "2002-06-02T04:26:51Z")
‘Waitron’ sounds like an interesting word in the same vein as Southron, another construction rarely heard today. Except in old songs, that is: > [@](#): > > Dixie’s Land > > Southrons, hear your country call you! > Up! Lest worse than death befall you! > To arms! To arms! To arms! In Dixie! > Lo! The beacon fire’s lighted! > Let our hearts be now united! > To arms! To arms! To arms! In Dixie! > > Chorus: > > Advance the flag of Dixie! > Hurrah! Hurrah! > For Dixie’s land we’ll take our stand > to live or die for Dixie! > To arms! To arms! > And conquer peace for Dixie! > > How the south’s great heart rejoices > at your cannons’ ringing voices! > To arms! To arms! To arms! In Dixie! > For faith betrayed and pledges broken, > wrongs inflicted, insults spoken. > To arms! To arms! To arms! In Dixie! > > If the loved ones weep in sadness, > victory shall bring them gladness; > to arms! To arms! To arms! In Dixie! > Exultant pride soon banish sorrow; > smiles chase tears away to-morrow. > To arms! To arms! To arms! In Dixie! To a famous tune. 🙂 [Heah fo three versions of ‘Dixie’.](http://www.customcpu.com/personal/pir/songs/dixie.htm) (Southern, Northern, and Recruitment. :)) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-tip-in-restaurants/111889.md?page=2)