# Why do we treat infertility as if it's cancer? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [November 2, 2010, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226 "2010-11-02T16:43:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 10
**Author:** ![whole\_bean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/96bed5/32.png) [@whole\_bean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/whole_bean)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2010, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/181 "2010-11-02T22:17:03Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Exactly. No loss of meaningful function or ability. I would venture that your depth perception is effected by the fact that you don’t have meaningful stereovision. ---
**Author:** ![Girl\_From\_Mars](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/3da27b/32.png) [@Girl\_From\_Mars](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Girl_From_Mars)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2010, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/182 "2010-11-02T22:17:28Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > In all seriousness, I always wanted to be a rock star. I spent years working hard at it., It was the only thing I wanted to do. It was my dream. It never happened. I didn’t cry like a pussy about it. I didn’t “grieve” it. I manned up and went on with my life. I didn’t lose anything. I just didn’t get what I wanted. I never thought the universe owed me what I wanted or that I was being “deprived” by not getting it. I just accepted it like an adult. OK, but imagine that you went your whole way through life being told you could be that rock star. And then suddenly, when you were ready for your big break, you were told you couldn’t be - but no real explanation why. And everyone else around you proceeded to become that rock star that you had always wanted to be, many of them without even trying - many of them by accident. Please don’t tell me that you wouldn’t feel frustrated, upset and angry about that? And as for not losing anything with infertility? When my partner and I moved in together, for Christmas we commissioned a furniture maker to make us a dining table. We made it the right height for us, chose the wood and the style, and we talked about how we would teach our babies to eat at this table, and watch them learn to colour, and do their homework at this table, and how we would have loud large Italian family gatherings around this table at holidays with lots of food and laughter. The following year we found out that due to his sperm count we had less than 5% chance of conceiving naturally. Our dream and plans for our future were severely rocked by that diagnosis - we grieved the family we had looked forward to for ourselves. Because for most people having kids is so effortless, and most IF people don’t find out until well into the frustrating groundhog day experience of trying month after month, people do build up expectations of the family they expect to create. Dashed expectations hurt, and we do grieve. And generally we do it very privately. You might not feel the same, but surely you are human enough to feel sympathy when someone else is hurting, even if you wouldn’t feel the same way yourself? In another thread you got angry on Olivesmarch4th’s behalf at a spouse who denied her a baby when she had (I quote you) ‘baby fever’ - why wouldn’t you feel sympathy for someone to whom the world at large denied that baby under the same circumstances? And while we agreed that we could be happy without kids - lots of travel and great experiences like that to make up for it - having a family together was really what we wanted for ourselves - sharing experiences, nurturing, teaching and passing down traditions. Luckily for us, 1 round of IVF (cost, less than $3000, less than my obstetric care costs) has allowed us to create that Italian family (although smaller than we might have planned), but we’re about to see if we can expand it again. ---
**Author:** ![LavenderBlue](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e95f7d/32.png) [@LavenderBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LavenderBlue)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2010, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/183 "2010-11-02T22:19:35Z")
> [@Cat\_Whisperer](#): > > I think those of you saying that **Dio** is wrong about how people with involuntary infertility are treated are forgetting what we’ve seen repeatedly on these boards - people starting threads about how they are crushed by not being able to conceive, people who talk about how they feel their life is over because they don’t have a child or they miscarried, the expectations of commiseration, the comments about how every baby and pregnant woman they see is like a knife in their hearts, etc. He may be exaggerating a bit by saying it’s treated as serious as a terminal illness, but there is an expectation that infertile people will be given massive amounts of deference and respect. As someone who has faced this issue I have to disagree. IRL, I’ve stopped talking about my feelings of hurt because many people are unfortunately just like **Dio** – with several naturally conceived children and unable to empathize with others who are not so fortunate. I’ve personally gotten more sympathy over a sprained ankle than I have over my struggles in this area. Infertility is a medical condition. No, it isn’t cancer. But yes, it usually means you have a dysfunctional body part. Why shouldn’t people be allowed to get very upset if they find out they’re in premature menopause or they have ovaries that increase their chances of heart disease and make it difficult to lose weight? I’ve had multiple treatments for endometriosis. That shit hurt. Really hurt. As in where the fucking hell is the aspirin and why do my periods look like a battlefield hurt. How is that deserving of **Dio** ’s obvious contempt and ridicule? ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2010, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/184 "2010-11-02T22:24:14Z")
> [@Smeghead](#): > > Not in Dio’s world, they don’t. That’s ridiculous. I’ve seen him use the word _set_. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Girl\_From\_Mars](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/3da27b/32.png) [@Girl\_From\_Mars](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Girl_From_Mars)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2010, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/185 "2010-11-02T22:25:25Z")
> [@Cat\_Whisperer](#): > > I think those of you saying that **Dio** is wrong about how people with involuntary infertility are treated are forgetting what we’ve seen repeatedly on these boards - people starting threads about how they are crushed by not being able to conceive, people who talk about how they feel their life is over because they don’t have a child or they miscarried, the expectations of commiseration, the comments about how every baby and pregnant woman they see is like a knife in their hearts, etc. He may be exaggerating a bit by saying it’s treated as serious as a terminal illness, but there is an expectation that infertile people will be given massive amounts of deference and respect. I’ve read most of those threads, and pretty much all of them are from the infertile to the infertile, asking for advice about the process of assisted conception, adoption, or how to come to terms with what’s happening. Yes, they share how they are feeling, but the internet is often treated as a confessional and most of these women are wanting help to resolve their feelings, not outpourings of sympathy or an expectation to be treated as if you are suffering some awful disease. ---
**Author:** ![Neeps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a183cd/32.png) [@Neeps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Neeps)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2010, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/186 "2010-11-02T22:26:27Z")
I really have to ask…why are we bothering to do this _again_ with Dio? Every discusion, no matter the topic, goes the same way. ---
**Author:** ![whole\_bean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/96bed5/32.png) [@whole\_bean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/whole_bean)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2010, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/187 "2010-11-02T22:27:55Z")
> [@whole\_bean](#): > > I would venture that your depth perception is effected by the fact that you don’t have meaningful stereovision. it just occured to me that the above statement could be applied to damn near every statement **Dio** makes. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2010, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/188 "2010-11-02T22:32:28Z")
> [@Neeps](#): > > I really have to ask…why are we bothering to do this _again_ with Dio? Every discusion, no matter the topic, goes the same way. Masochism, obviously. I started to open a pit thread but couldn’t be arsed. Also I don’t know how to open threads that aren’t polls. ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2010, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/189 "2010-11-02T23:19:17Z")
Loss of a dream, the desire of the heart, all equates to the ultimate loss a person can suffer, the inability to be what they were born to be. ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2010, 11:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/190 "2010-11-02T23:33:34Z")
> [@Cat\_Whisperer](#): > > I think those of you saying that **Dio** is wrong about how people with involuntary infertility are treated are forgetting what we’ve seen repeatedly on these boards - people starting threads about how they are crushed by not being able to conceive, people who talk about how they feel their life is over because they don’t have a child or they miscarried, the expectations of commiseration, the comments about how every baby and pregnant woman they see is like a knife in their hearts, etc. He may be exaggerating a bit by saying it’s treated as serious as a terminal illness, but there is an expectation that infertile people will be given massive amounts of deference and respect. I disagree. I think the EXPECTATION is that you not be a jerk over something someone is upset over, even if you happen to think its sort of a stupid thing to be upset about. We’ve had people suffer job loss and be crushed - the expectation is that you are polite and say “gee, that’s really tough” - not say “sounds like it was a sucky job.” We’ve had people get divorced - and while there is a certain amount of “oh, you are better off without her” you aren’t supposed to be a jerk about it. People loose their dear grandparent at 83 - saying “well, what do you expect - 83! Everyone has got to die sometime” isn’t exactly sympathetic. This is a message board - its really easy just not to say anything at all if someone posts looking for sympathy you don’t feel or don’t want to bother to fake it text. There isn’t an obligation to post every time someone has fertility issues, losing a job, breaks up with a significant other, or loses a parent. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2010, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/191 "2010-11-03T00:04:09Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > Whereas a person who is infertile has lost a meaningful function. What function would that be? > [@](#): > > This is why your comparision of your loss of vision in a single eye is bullshit It wasn’t my comparison. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2010, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/192 "2010-11-03T00:05:52Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > What function would that be? > > It wasn’t my comparison. I was correcting your comparison, sir. I was pointing out that the loss of fertility is akin to the loss of vision in both eyes. (In terms of emotional impact, that is, not day-to-day quality of life.) ---
**Author:** ![Blalron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/35a633/32.png) [@Blalron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blalron)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2010, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/193 "2010-11-03T00:06:02Z")
> [@kanicbird](#): > > Loss of a dream, the desire of the heart, all equates to the ultimate loss a person can suffer, the inability to be what they were born to be. I don’t think we’re born to be anything in particular. Clinging to one particular vision of what can make us happy and discounting all other possibilities is not a very good strategy for dealing with life. Would you say to a Catholic Priest, who is voluntarily celibate and devoting his life to God, that he wasn’t being “what he was born to be”? ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2010, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/194 "2010-11-03T00:06:38Z")
> [@whole\_bean](#): > > and you’re wrong. Loss is not a necessary component of grief. Yes it is. That’s the definition. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2010, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/195 "2010-11-03T00:09:06Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Yes it is. That’s the definition. It has been pointed out to you multiple times in this thread that the words _grieve_ and _grief_ have multiple definitions. Do you intend to continue to pretend not to have been corrected? That’s not a rhetorical question, by the way. My distaste for those has not abated. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2010, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/196 "2010-11-03T00:09:29Z")
> [@whole\_bean](#): > > I would venture that your depth perception is effected by the fact that you don’t have meaningful stereovision. It is affected, though strangely, not non existent. I kind kinda sorta see the 3D with the glasses. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2010, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/197 "2010-11-03T00:10:32Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > Masochism, obviously. > > I started to open a pit thread but couldn’t be arsed. Also I don’t know how to open threads that aren’t polls. I haven’t said a damn thing pitworthy. ---
**Author:** ![perfectparanoia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a5b964/32.png) [@perfectparanoia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/perfectparanoia)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2010, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/198 "2010-11-03T00:11:28Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > It has been pointed out to you multiple times in this thread that the words _grieve_ and _grief_ have multiple definitions. Do you intend to continue to pretend not to have been corrected? > > That’s not a rhetorical question, by the way. My distaste for those has not abated. Thank you. I was about to start looking for literary references. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2010, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/199 "2010-11-03T00:12:08Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > It has been pointed out to you multiple times in this thread that the words _grieve_ and _grief_ have multiple definitions. Do you intend to continue to pretend not to have been corrected? > > That’s not a rhetorical question, by the way. My distaste for those has not abated. It has been pointed out to you that this is bullshit, and that loss is a necessary component of grief. That’s what the word means. Don’t use words if you don’t know what they mean, and don’t cheapen real grief by comparing it to simple frustration. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2010, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/200 "2010-11-03T00:12:50Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > I haven’t said a damn thing pitworthy. **Dio** , did it perhaps occur to you that, since the second sentence in the post you quoted was obviously a jest, the entire post was not meant seriously? Another non-rhetorical question, though I’d not be surprised to either receive no answer at all or a disingenuous one.) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226.md?page=9) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226.md?page=11)