# Why do we treat infertility as if it's cancer? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [November 2, 2010, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226 "2010-11-02T16:43:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![MsWhatsit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/eb8c5e/32.png) [@MsWhatsit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MsWhatsit)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2010, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/161 "2010-11-02T21:50:25Z")
By the way, I am not talking about some legal definition of “disability.” I have no idea what the legal definition of disability is, and am not interested in it. I am talking about the word “disability” as it is used in everyday speech by people who speak English. > [@Diogenes the Cynic](#): > > Yes I can, and I do. I have no impaired abilities, just an impaired eye. Your ability to see is impaired. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2010, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/162 "2010-11-02T21:53:28Z")
I think those of you saying that **Dio** is wrong about how people with involuntary infertility are treated are forgetting what we’ve seen repeatedly on these boards - people starting threads about how they are crushed by not being able to conceive, people who talk about how they feel their life is over because they don’t have a child or they miscarried, the expectations of commiseration, the comments about how every baby and pregnant woman they see is like a knife in their hearts, etc. He may be exaggerating a bit by saying it’s treated as serious as a terminal illness, but there is an expectation that infertile people will be given massive amounts of deference and respect. ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2010, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/163 "2010-11-02T21:53:59Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Yes I can, and I do. I have no impaired abilities, just an impaired eye. I simply fail to understand why the impairment of an ability like reproduction does not “count” as an “impaired ability” in your personal, idiosyncratic definition of “disability”. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2010, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/164 "2010-11-02T21:56:36Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Yes I can, and I do. I have no impaired abilities, just an impaired eye. You can’t imagine that someone who completely lost her or his sight after being able to see might grieve said loss? You can’t imagine that someone who has always wanted a child might grieve that inability? ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2010, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/165 "2010-11-02T21:58:00Z")
> [@MsWhatsit](#): > > Your ability to see is impaired. Only if I close my right eye. It does not functional impair my ability to do anything I want or need to do. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2010, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/166 "2010-11-02T21:59:06Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > You can’t imagine that someone who completely lost her or his sight after being able to see might grieve said loss? Sure. They’ve lost something. > [@](#): > > You can’t imagine that someone who has always wanted a child might grieve that inability? They haven’t lost anything. ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2010, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/167 "2010-11-02T21:59:09Z")
> [@Cat\_Whisperer](#): > > I think those of you saying that **Dio** is wrong about how people with involuntary infertility are treated are forgetting what we’ve seen repeatedly on these boards - people starting threads about how they are crushed by not being able to conceive, people who talk about how they feel their life is over because they don’t have a child or they miscarried, the expectations of commiseration, the comments about how every baby and pregnant woman they see is like a knife in their hearts, etc. He may be exaggerating a bit by saying it’s treated as serious as a terminal illness, but there is an expectation that infertile people will be given massive amounts of deference and respect. You are mixing up those who can’t concieve with those who have had a miscarriage. Some of the latter probably _do_ “grieve” over what, depending on how late in the term, may well seem to them like a dead child and not simply a lack of opportunity. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2010, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/168 "2010-11-02T21:59:45Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Only if I close my right eye. It does not functional impair my ability to do anything I want or need to do. So that’s like losing ONE ball rather than BOTH balls. ONE ovary rather than both. See? ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2010, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/169 "2010-11-02T22:00:12Z")
> [@Cat\_Whisperer](#): > > I think those of you saying that **Dio** is wrong about how people with involuntary infertility are treated are forgetting what we’ve seen repeatedly on these boards - people starting threads about how they are crushed by not being able to conceive, people who talk about how they feel their life is over because they don’t have a child or they miscarried, the expectations of commiseration, the comments about how every baby and pregnant woman they see is like a knife in their hearts, etc. He may be exaggerating a bit by saying it’s treated as serious as a terminal illness, but there is an expectation that infertile people will be given massive amounts of deference and respect. Thank you. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2010, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/170 "2010-11-02T22:01:31Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > So that’s like losing ONE ball rather than BOTH balls. ONE ovary rather than both. See? Exactly. No loss of meaningful function or ability. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2010, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/171 "2010-11-02T22:03:19Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Exactly. No loss of meaningful function or ability. Whereas a person who is infertile has lost a meaningful function. This is why your comparision of your loss of vision in a single eye is bullshit. ---
**Author:** ![MsWhatsit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/eb8c5e/32.png) [@MsWhatsit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MsWhatsit)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2010, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/172 "2010-11-02T22:04:58Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Only if I close my right eye. It does not functional impair my ability to do anything I want or need to do. Your ability to see is impaired. The fact that you are able to compensate for this with your unimpaired eye does not change the fact that you have an impairment in one eye. You are clearly attaching emotional and moral significance to the word “disability” that is not shared by most people. It is a descriptive term. The fact that you have a minor disability does not mean that you are claiming equivalence to someone who has a serious, life-changing disability. It just means that you have an ability (sight) that is impaired. ---
**Author:** ![Blalron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/35a633/32.png) [@Blalron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blalron)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2010, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/173 "2010-11-02T22:06:28Z")
> [@Malthus](#): > > I’m not saying that the _should_ be grieving over their lack of sight, only that if they _did_, I would not be finding it an inherently absurd thing for them to do; they know that they lack a really significant ability that a functionally normal human has (even if they cannot actually experience what it is that they lack), as a result of a fault in their anatomy. > > Like the ability to reproduce. If I heard an adult congenitally blind man in grief about being blind, I’d refer him to a therapist. This might sound like an unsypathetic thing to say, but it really is the sort of thing he should have gotten used to by now. If he’s still grieving over something that happened decades ago (being born blind) Then it’s probably an underlying psychological problem and the blindness is just an excuse that his depressed mind is latching on to for why he feels like crap. ---
**Author:** ![SmellMyWort](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ea5d25/32.png) [@SmellMyWort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SmellMyWort)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2010, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/174 "2010-11-02T22:06:34Z")
> [@MPB\_in\_Salt\_Lake](#): > > I wonder what that looks like… Apparently it’s short. ---
**Author:** ![whole\_bean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/96bed5/32.png) [@whole\_bean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/whole_bean)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2010, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/175 "2010-11-02T22:09:20Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > I didn’t say “death” was the sine non qua, I said LOSS was. Infertility involves no loss. Not getting something you want is not a loss. You can’t grieve for something you never had. Trying equate a frustrated desire with actual loss is bullshit. and you’re wrong. Loss is not a necessary component of grief. It’s frustarating that people have humored you on this point (no doubt because the infertile have experienced a loss, of hope for one, and therefore folks have confronted you under the terms of your own eroneous premise). When will you just shut the fuck up? ---
**Author:** ![Neeps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a183cd/32.png) [@Neeps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Neeps)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2010, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/176 "2010-11-02T22:09:27Z")
> [@Cat\_Whisperer](#): > > I think those of you saying that **Dio** is wrong about how people with involuntary infertility are treated are forgetting what we’ve seen repeatedly on these boards - people starting threads about how they are crushed by not being able to conceive, people who talk about how they feel their life is over because they don’t have a child or they miscarried, the expectations of commiseration, the comments about how every baby and pregnant woman they see is like a knife in their hearts, etc. He may be exaggerating a bit by saying it’s treated as serious as a terminal illness, but there is an expectation that infertile people will be given massive amounts of deference and respect. Personally, I’m looking for support and understanding from other infertile people. Not from people like you who don’t want kids, or people like Dio who don’t care. I would far prefer it if people who don’t understand infertility stay away and focus on what interests or grieves them. See how that works? ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2010, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/177 "2010-11-02T22:12:19Z")
> [@Blalron](#): > > If I heard an adult congenitally blind man in grief about being blind, I’d refer him to a therapist. This might sound like an unsypathetic thing to say, but it really is the sort of thing he should have gotten used to by now. If he’s still grieving over something that happened decades ago (being born blind) Then it’s probably an underlying psychological problem and the blindness is just an excuse that his depressed mind is latching on to for why he feels like crap. Again, I’m making no judgment on a person hypothetically grieving over a lack of ability. However, if your reason for judging such a person is “they shoulda gotten over it by now”, surely you can see how absolutely inapplicable that is to something like infertility? While a person may be _born_ infertile, they generally do not _discover this fact_ until they attempt to conceive. To _them_, there is no “getting used to something that happened decades ago”, since as far as they are concerned, it is happening _now_. ---
**Author:** ![SmellMyWort](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ea5d25/32.png) [@SmellMyWort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SmellMyWort)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2010, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/178 "2010-11-02T22:12:27Z")
> [@Blalron](#): > > If I heard an adult congenitally blind man in grief about being blind, I’d refer him to a therapist. This might sound like an unsypathetic thing to say, but it really is the sort of thing he should have gotten used to by now. If he’s still grieving over something that happened decades ago (being born blind) Then it’s probably an underlying psychological problem and the blindness is just an excuse that his depressed mind is latching on to for why he feels like crap. And what of the boy that this man once was? ---
**Author:** ![Smeghead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f1d935/32.png) [@Smeghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smeghead)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2010, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/179 "2010-11-02T22:13:42Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > Oh, bullshit. Words can have more than one meaning. Not in Dio’s world, they don’t. ---
**Author:** ![whole\_bean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/96bed5/32.png) [@whole\_bean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/whole_bean)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2010, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226/180 "2010-11-02T22:14:14Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > “The barren?” Heh. and you’re calling me insensitive. > > I didn’t insult anybody in this thread or on this board. I made a comment, in the abstract, about a certain kind of _behavior_, not about the _per se_ condition of infertility. You’re as deaf to sarcasm as you are reason. I think we shouldn’t feed the self absorption and entitlement of those who prattle on about being ridden for not being sympatheitc. I am not insulting anyone in particular in this thread or on this board. I am making a comment in the abstract about the emotionaly immature attention whores who feel the need to pout over every perceived slight. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226.md?page=8) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-treat-infertility-as-if-its-cancer/559226.md?page=10)