# Why do we want the apocalypse? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 10, 2012, 12:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-want-the-apocalypse/631021 "2012-08-10T00:34:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![rogerbox](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/76d3ee/32.png) [@rogerbox](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rogerbox)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2012, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-want-the-apocalypse/631021/41 "2012-08-10T20:43:09Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > I’m not certain how common this is, but I often find myself hoping/wondering/wishing _this particular occurrence of any given phenomenon_ will be of greater magnitude or significance than all others in the past - for example, _this_ wave will be the biggest ever; _this_ storm will have the highest wind speed ever, etc. > > I figure I can’t be the only human who experiences this feeling, as the weather reports are always telling us that this is the somethingest-something _since records began_. You’re not… I find myself being so dissapointed in the news because I want big, large change. I am eagerly awaiting the next paradigm shift, the next “internet” to happen to humanity. I think it has to be cheap space travel or everyone having amazing 3D printers at home so that “Stuff” is no longer valuable. > [@suranyi](#): > > I prefer Isaac Asimov, who wrote mostly about optimistic futures – humans explore space, robots do our work, etc. Yes, but Asimov’s works also tell us about the human condition, our potential for good if we only embrace our desire for knowlege above greed (imo). > [@Voyager](#): > > I wonder if there is a libertarian component at work here. Some of the more rabid ones no doubt feel they could become as rich and powerful as they think they deserve to be if the man in the form of big bad government weren’t keeping them down. They probably seem themselves as the town’s bossman, not the schmuck dead on the side of the road. I think you’re very right. When you hear survivalists talk about why they need their 80 guns and tons of ammunition and food stocks for when it hits the fan, you can definitely see something in their eyes that says, they will be fine, and you won’t, because they don’t need society coddling them, and then the REAL men will rise to the top. ---
**Author:** ![Beware\_of\_Doug](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/278dde/32.png) [@Beware\_of\_Doug](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beware_of_Doug)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2012, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-want-the-apocalypse/631021/42 "2012-08-10T20:48:46Z")
Apocalypse will at least free humans from morality, at whatever cost. ---
**Author:** ![grude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47774/32.png) [@grude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/grude)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2012, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-want-the-apocalypse/631021/43 "2012-08-10T20:51:55Z")
> [@Beware\_of\_Doug](#): > > Apocalypse will at least free humans from morality, at whatever cost. > > (I said apocalypse, not armageddon. If god comes down and starts kicking ass, _everybody_ is fucked.) Would it? I don’t see someone uninterested in say baby raping today going oh well there is no government now might as well get to it. ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2012, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-want-the-apocalypse/631021/44 "2012-08-10T21:13:53Z")
Woahhhh there pardner! Don’t go speaking for everyone now! ---
**Author:** ![armedmonkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@armedmonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/armedmonkey)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2012, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-want-the-apocalypse/631021/45 "2012-08-10T21:17:18Z")
> [@grude](#): > > Would it? I don’t see someone uninterested in say baby raping today going oh well there is no government now might as well get to it. It’s not so much baby raping as it is _Lord of the Flies_. Even looking at “small” disasters like, say, Hurricane Katrina. Sure, some people showed the better side of human nature, but far too many [didn’t](http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=5063796). ---
**Author:** ![Tristan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tristan/32/18058_2.png) [@Tristan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tristan)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2012, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-want-the-apocalypse/631021/46 "2012-08-10T21:27:26Z")
For me, the idea is exciting, be it a zombie apocalypse, or a plague scenario wherein I and a few loved ones are survivors, or whatever, because I love the idea of a chance to start over, to rebuild something myself, from the ground up, my way. With the added benefits of being able to pick up the hardware to do it, since it’s just laying around. If I had lived 150 years ago, I would have signed up for a land rush. The thought of building up a house, a compound, and maybe even a small town, from the ground up, appeals to be a LOT. Even better is the idea of making myself king. NONE of this is possible today. And space is no good for me, as while I am smartish, I’m not an engineer, or a scientist, or a pilot. And now I’m sterile, and fat, so I’m not going to the moon, or Mars. But if it all falls apart, I can finally see if I can do what I have invisioned and played out so many times in the past in RPG’s and video games… ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2012, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-want-the-apocalypse/631021/47 "2012-08-10T21:33:37Z")
> [@Tristan](#): > > With the added benefits of being able to pick up the hardware to do it, since it’s just laying around. Heh. There is a movie with Sylvester Stallon? I think. They dump his ass on what’s basically a planet sized garbage dump. I must say the idea of being able to build MacGyver stuff out of a vast amount of free junk greatly appeals to my engineering side, my DIY side, and my cheap side. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2012, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-want-the-apocalypse/631021/48 "2012-08-10T21:42:36Z")
> [@Gagundathar](#): > > There is a significant and growing subset of Christianity that has the ‘End Times’ as its focus. > Do not forget how many copies of the ‘Left Behind’ series have been sold. > > To some people, the idea that these modern (evil) days are a sign of the return of Jesus is a good and satisfying belief. There are some who believe very devoutly that when the Rapture occurs, that they will not die but be ‘translated’ into their spirit forms. The idea of being on the winning side AND not having to die is a pretty powerful combination. This. When I was a Christian as a kid, this pretty much sums up my attitude; I longed for the end of the world constantly because it meant going to paradise. And there’s a large chunk of the American population that sees the Apocalypse as both imminent and desirable, and who push an agenda based on that attitude; from Jerry Falwell trying to get Reagan to start a nuclear war because he and his followers will get sucked up into Heaven before the nukes hit, to Christians supporting Israel because it keeps the Jews in the proper location for their prophesied Apocalyptic slaughter. ---
**Author:** ![Frazzled](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/frazzled/32/3368_2.png) [@Frazzled](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frazzled)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2012, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-want-the-apocalypse/631021/49 "2012-08-10T23:26:17Z")
I don’t think having apocalyptic fantasies is dependent on religious or political beliefs, though those beliefs will absolutely affect the narrative and circumstances of the fantasy. Regardless of what form the narrative takes, I think most apocalyptic dreams have 3 main plot points in common. 1. It’s the end of a world in which we feel impotent. The imagined disaster immediately removes all of our competition which forces us to become a new person - the person we’ve always been destined to be but have never had the necessary “push” to get there. Cue the montage as we turn our flabby bodies into fit athletic creatures who hit the books in the abandoned library at night (by candlelight) to aquire the skills we need to thrive in the new world. 2. we become superheroes. In these fantasies we can hunt and find plentiful food. We can cook five star meals by the camp fire. If people in our party our wounded we’re the ones applying the stitches and fixing broken bones. When we discuss new systems of leadership all the members in the group look to us for guidance. When the group is threatened we’re the ones who stand up to the enemy and protect those in our charge. Sometimes we dispense justice, sometimes we convert those attacking us to our way of thinking so they join the group too. But in the end, when people in our group look to us it’s with awe and reverence. We’re Kings! 3. World Building. Ultimately our microcosm grows and becomes the new world order. Our thoughts and beliefs are now the mainstream position and the default moral standard for the entire world. With us as the defacto leader the new world is peaceful and just and everybody lives happily ever after! That’s ultimately the draw. Apocalyptic thoughts are an entertaining way to imagine a world where we overcome our obstacles to rise to the level of hero and enjoy the spoils of our victory. It allows us to imagine a world where our views prove themselves to be right. The reality, I know, would be very very different but that wouldn’t be much of a fantasy would it? ---
**Author:** ![armedmonkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@armedmonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/armedmonkey)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2012, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-want-the-apocalypse/631021/50 "2012-08-10T23:29:36Z")
We know your attitude regarding religion, **Der Trihs** , but admit it. Even as an atheist, you still want to shoot some zombies, don’t you? Regardless of religion, I think there is something in human nature that attracts us to “The End of The World!” I’m not sure religion plays that much a part. We are still fascinated by mass extinction events in geology. Boom! dead dinosaurs… new ecology. Religion really doesn’t have to play a part in this. Sarah Connor didn’t pray to God to save her from Arnold Schwazenegger, after all. ---
**Author:** ![Frazzled](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/frazzled/32/3368_2.png) [@Frazzled](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frazzled)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2012, 11:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-want-the-apocalypse/631021/51 "2012-08-10T23:36:12Z")
> [@A Monkey With a Gun](#): > > Even as an atheist, you still want to shoot some zombies, don’t you? > > … > > Religion really doesn’t have to play a part in this. Sarah Connor didn’t pray to God to save her from Arnold Schwazenegger, after all. I forgot about overcoming hopeless odds! This is the best part of the apocolypse! The zombies and the terminators that keep on coming forcing us to cope with our humanity as we use our new found wits to conquer them all! It’s like a video game - boom boom boom! Power up! And at the end, the princess is always in her castle! ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2012, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-want-the-apocalypse/631021/52 "2012-08-24T16:14:09Z")
> [@Trinopus](#): > > I suppose at least a few Christians “want” it, because it would prove, once and for all, that their religion was correct, true, and proper. > > (Although that’s a little like a global climate change scientist “wanting” massive sea-level rises! Getting to say, “See, I told you so!” is a damn paltry reward, sometimes.) There’s no need for the quotes. They want it because they will be proven right, and thus will be in heaven, which is much better than living on earth. ---
**Author:** ![Acid\_Lamp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@Acid\_Lamp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acid_Lamp)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2012, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-want-the-apocalypse/631021/53 "2012-08-25T18:10:16Z")
Freedom; In the truest sense of the word. Assuming that I survive the initial issue, I have all the relevant skills to support myself. There is something very appealing about the idea of going out to a wild part of the country and just starting from the ground up without pesky fish and game, state police, and nit-picky ass rules about everything. While I love all the benefits of modern technology, I _can_ do without them; and the true self determined freedom of the apocalypse scenario call s to that. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2012, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-want-the-apocalypse/631021/54 "2012-08-25T18:15:35Z")
“What do we want? The APOCALYPSE!” “When do we want it? In keeping with the prophetic requirements of Christian Eschatology!” Needs a little work. ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2012, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-want-the-apocalypse/631021/55 "2012-08-25T22:41:30Z")
I’m indeed quite fascinated by apocalyptic and post-apocalyptic stories. I’ve no interest in settings where some hero fights his way to survival (Mad Max style, or zombie apo style, for instance). More in society crumbling (BBC’s Threads) or beginning to be rebuild (A canticle for Leibowitz) or relatively ordinary people facing the dire circumstances (the Road, already mentioned). I don’t daydream about such an event, and have no fantasy of becoming some leader following an apocalyptic event. So, I don’t think it’s about picturing myself in such a scenario. I don’t really know why I like those stories. A sense of doom is certainly a factor I enjoy in many novels, stories, movies, role-playing games, etc… (it might be individual or collective doom and obviously an universal apocalypse is the ultimate doom). I also tend to enjoy much more dark and sad stories than rosy ones. That’s about everything I can think of. Not sure it helps. ---
**Author:** ![djegets](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/2bfe46/32.png) [@djegets](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/djegets)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2013, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-want-the-apocalypse/631021/56 "2013-01-06T15:37:05Z")
I don’t think its about leadership with most people. Its about actual freedom, not the crap they feed us by our governments. We are not free at all… we cannot find a place of earth we like and just start building on it because ‘the state owns it’. We must buy it, and pay shitloads of money our entire life to have ‘freedom’… aka: a piece of land, a house, a car, food, etc… If we would decide: fuck it! im leaving. And we just pack our bags and start walking away without telling anyone, what happens? We get the government behind us and almost forcing us to our ‘home’ and asking why we just left. We can’t even decide to just walk on the planet without some sort of permission. A post-apocalyptic scenario apeals to me a lot in the sense that: there is no government to control us, there isnt an abundance of humans around us that creates an overwhelming feeling of suffocation, there are no laws that prevent us from anything. We are free to do whatever we want, wheter its walking in some direction we like or staying in an abandoned house and hunting or searching empty/raided malls and stores. I wouldnt care less if i was the leader or something, i have no intrest in controlling people… Humanity has been controlled for far too long by corrupt and wrong politicians and bureaucrats. Sorry for long post note:18yr old that has been following the same routine and hates it. im an atheist, not a psychopath in whatever form 🙂 Just need true freedom ---
**Author:** ![computergeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e56c9b/32.png) [@computergeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/computergeek)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2013, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-want-the-apocalypse/631021/57 "2013-01-06T17:59:18Z")
> [@djegets](#): > > I don’t think its about leadership with most people. Its about actual freedom, not the crap they feed us by our governments. We are not free at all.. we cannot find a place of earth we like and just start building on it because ‘the state owns it’. We must buy it, and pay shitloads of money our entire life to have ‘freedom’.. aka: a piece of land, a house, a car, food, etc.. If we would decide: fuck it! im leaving. And we just pack our bags and start walking away without telling anyone, what happens? We get the government behind us and almost forcing us to our ‘home’ and asking why we just left. We can’t even decide to just walk on the planet without some sort of permission. A post-apocalyptic scenario apeals to me a lot in the sense that: there is no government to control us, there isnt an abundance of humans around us that creates an overwhelming feeling of suffocation, there are no laws that prevent us from anything. We are free to do whatever we want, wheter its walking in some direction we like or staying in an abandoned house and hunting or searching empty/raided malls and stores. I wouldnt care less if i was the leader or something, i have no intrest in controlling people… Humanity has been controlled for far too long by corrupt and wrong politicians and bureaucrats. Sorry for long post > note:18yr old that has been following the same routine and hates it. im an atheist, not a psychopath in whatever form 🙂 Just need true freedom For those of you who dream of this scenario, you seem to forget that unless the world is devoid of other people or you live way up in the mountains, there will be warlords and gangs of people who will cause you no end of trouble. Perhaps you can find a spot where there’s no one else for hundreds of miles around, but it’s more likely there will be murderous gangs to encounter. ---
**Author:** ![BrotherCadfael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@BrotherCadfael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrotherCadfael)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2013, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-want-the-apocalypse/631021/58 "2013-01-06T18:17:00Z")
> [@Gagundathar](#): > > There is a significant and growing subset of Christianity that has the ‘End Times’ as its focus. > [@A Monkey With a Gun](#): > > I think there is something in human nature that attracts us to “The End of The World!” I’m not sure religion plays that much a part. > [@iiandyiiii](#): > > As far as “The End is Near” types, I think people have an attraction to the idea that the particular time they live in (i.e. _now_) is the most critical time in all of human history. The environmental movement also seems to have a fascination with the subject. There is something inherently thrilling in the idea that we live in unique times. ---
**Author:** ![rogerbox](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/76d3ee/32.png) [@rogerbox](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rogerbox)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2013, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-want-the-apocalypse/631021/59 "2013-01-06T23:21:22Z")
> [@computergeek](#): > > Perhaps you can find a spot where there’s no one else for hundreds of miles around, but it’s more likely there will be murderous gangs to encounter. This. It’s an attractive fantasy of rugged individualism until a gang of brigands with more guns than you sells you into sex slavery or kills you for entertainment, in which case you would long for a stable government and less “Freedom”. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-we-want-the-apocalypse/631021.md?page=2)