# Why do you need a gun? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 11, 2013, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-you-need-a-gun/646873 "2013-01-11T17:22:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 16
**Author:** ![ed\_anger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/bbce88/32.png) [@ed\_anger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ed_anger)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2013, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-you-need-a-gun/646873/301 "2013-01-15T22:27:00Z")
> [@Anonymous User](#): > > The problem is that for the shooting in CT, the guy brought in an automatic gun and that is why so many died. > > So conservatives, what is your need for automatic guns? Why can’t you outlaw those? You’re not really helping, are you. Automatic weapons are already regulated. And the shooter in Newtown used a semi-auto assault rifle, not an automatic. He did have 30-round clips, which are banned in some locations, yes. edit: I see 4 of us posted this info in 5 mins, lol. ---
**Author:** ![R3d\_Anonymous](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/aeb1de/32.png) [@R3d\_Anonymous](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/R3d_Anonymous)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2013, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-you-need-a-gun/646873/302 "2013-01-15T22:31:11Z")
> [@JXJohns](#): > > Your facts are way off. He used a semi auto gun. One bullet per pull of the trigger. > [@Nars\_Glinley](#): > > The rifle used at Newtown was semi-automatic. [Cite.](http://www.cnn.com/2012/12/18/us/connecticut-lanza-guns/index.html) I stand corrected. Anyways, going back to the original question of “Why do you need a gun,” my opinion is that if your purpose is safety, then you really don’t need a full automatic gun. In fact, I wouldn’t own any gun but that’s just me. I think if you’re really concerned about your safety, you really only need a semi-automatic/manual gun. Sorry for the incorrect facts. ---
**Author:** ![R3d\_Anonymous](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/aeb1de/32.png) [@R3d\_Anonymous](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/R3d_Anonymous)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2013, 10:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-you-need-a-gun/646873/303 "2013-01-15T22:35:02Z")
> [@ed\_anger](#): > > You’re not really helping, are you. Automatic weapons are already regulated. And the shooter in Newtown used a semi-auto assault rifle, not an automatic. **He did have 30-round clips** , which are banned in some locations, yes. > > edit: I see 4 of us posted this info in 5 mins, lol. Then those should be outlawed or strictly regulated as well. I have the same kind of question again: why do you (by “you” I mean the people who own automatic guns or multiple round clips) need multiple round clips? Why can’t you have just a single or a double-round clip? Like I said earlier, my point is that I don’t understand the need to be shooting more than 2 bullets at a time. ---
**Author:** ![artemis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/91b2a8/32.png) [@artemis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/artemis)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2013, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-you-need-a-gun/646873/304 "2013-01-15T22:44:45Z")
> [@Anonymous User](#): > > Then those should be outlawed or strictly regulated as well. I have the same kind of question again: why do you (by “you” I mean the people who own automatic guns or multiple round clips) need multiple round clips? Why can’t you have just a single or a double-round clip? > > Like I said earlier, my point is that I don’t understand the need to be shooting more than 2 bullets at a time. You do understand that you may have to shoot an attacker multiple times before he goes down? It’s not like in the movies: people don’t just drop dead with the first bullet hit. Add to that the fact that you’re aiming at a moving target, and some of your shots may well miss. You may also find yourself facing more than one attacker. You definitely need more than one or two bullets in a gun used for self-defense. And there’s not much difference between a 30 round magazine and three 10-round magazines (except that the larger magazines are more likely to cause the gun to jam). It only takes a second or so to change magazines. So a shooter who intends to kill a lot of people can just carry a lot of loaded magazines (which is what the Virginia Tech shooter did; most of the magazines he used held only 10 rounds). ---
**Author:** ![ed\_anger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/bbce88/32.png) [@ed\_anger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ed_anger)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2013, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-you-need-a-gun/646873/305 "2013-01-15T22:53:15Z")
New York State is the first place to enact stricter controls based on the Newtown shootings: > [@](#): > > ALBANY — Gov. Andrew M. Cuomo signed into law on Tuesday a sweeping package of gun control measures, significantly expanding a ban on assault weapons and making New York the first state to change its laws in response to the mass shooting at a Connecticut elementary school. > > Mr. Cuomo signed the bill less than an hour after the State Assembly approved the legislation on a 104-to-43 vote. The State Senate approved the measure, 43 to 18, on Monday night. > > The expanded ban on assault weapons broadens the definition of such weapons, banning semiautomatic pistols and rifles with detachable magazines and one military-style feature, as well as semiautomatic shotguns with one military-style feature. New Yorkers who already own such guns can keep them but will be required to register them with the state. > > The legislative package, which Mr. Cuomo on Monday said he believed would be “the most comprehensive package in the nation,” will also ban any gun magazine that can hold more than 7 rounds of ammunition — the current limit is 10 rounds. It will also require background checks of ammunition buyers and automated alerts to law enforcement agencies of high-volume purchases. [http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/16/nyregion/tougher-gun-law-in-new-york.html](http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/16/nyregion/tougher-gun-law-in-new-york.html)? ---
**Author:** ![Mdcastle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/958977/32.png) [@Mdcastle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mdcastle)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2013, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-you-need-a-gun/646873/306 "2013-01-15T22:59:40Z")
You might even kill more people with 3X10 round magazines since they’re less likely to jam. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2013, 11:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-you-need-a-gun/646873/307 "2013-01-15T23:05:41Z")
Considering that it takes almost no time at all the change a clip out, this is a feel good cosmetic ‘fix’ that will have zero effect on shootings like this recent mass killing OR on crime. When I go shooting with my dad I don’t think we ever fill the mags to capacity, since, as you note Mdcastleman that actually can cause more jams and misfires. ---
**Author:** ![artemis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/91b2a8/32.png) [@artemis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/artemis)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2013, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-you-need-a-gun/646873/308 "2013-01-15T23:07:41Z")
> [@ed\_anger](#): > > New York State is the first place to enact stricter controls based on the Newtown shootings: [http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/16/nyregion/tougher-gun-law-in-new-york.html](http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/16/nyregion/tougher-gun-law-in-new-york.html)? The provision to allow mental health professionals to report patients whom they fear might be dangerous may do some good, but I’m dubious (to say the least) about most of the other provisions accomplishing anything. ---
**Author:** ![ed\_anger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/bbce88/32.png) [@ed\_anger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ed_anger)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2013, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-you-need-a-gun/646873/309 "2013-01-15T23:08:05Z")
> [@XT](#): > > Considering that it takes almost no time at all the change a clip out, this is a feel good cosmetic ‘fix’ that will have zero effect on shootings like this recent mass killing OR on crime. > > When I go shooting with my dad I don’t think we ever fill the mags to capacity, since, as you note Mdcastleman that actually can cause more jams and misfires. So you have no problem if this rolls out nationwide then? ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2013, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-you-need-a-gun/646873/310 "2013-01-15T23:17:22Z")
My problem is that this is the AWB all over again…silly, meaningless regulations that are designed for making liberals and folks who are ignorant and scared of guns feel good, while doing dick to address any real issues. Do I have a problem with it? No, not really…I just think it’s stupid and pointless. But then, so are most of the proposed gun regulations being kicked about atm. ---
**Author:** ![DrCube](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a3d4f5/32.png) [@DrCube](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrCube)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2013, 11:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-you-need-a-gun/646873/311 "2013-01-15T23:36:23Z")
> [@ed\_anger](#): > > Because we trust some people with weapons as a necessary evil. Trained professionals are there to protect us, there is a structure in place to make sure they know what they are doing and are competent. Nobody has the responsibility to protect me and my family but me. You are absolutely wrong if you think cops or anyone else is required or even expected to protect me. That’s not anybody’s job but mine and the people I pay if I’m rich enough to afford professional security. And you realize people who train with guns learn how to aim, fire accurately and kill bad guys, right? You think the problem with Sandy Hook and Aurora is that the perpetrators weren’t competent enough with their weapons?? ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2013, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-you-need-a-gun/646873/312 "2013-01-15T23:45:13Z")
> [@YogSosoth](#): > > this one right can never be questioned, even rhetorically, and they are so afraid of any tiny limit that they infuse with bile and venom and response so as to immediately destroy any semblance of honest debate You know there are already a lot of limits, some of them not so tiny, on the right to keep and bear arms, right? While I’d prefer if some of them went away, most gun owners tolerate them and live within them. It’s not that we’ve got this completely unfettered polished and shiny thing called the right to keep and bear arms, and you’re marring the finish. It’s that we’ve got this banged up, dented, dinged, held-together-with-superglue thing called the right to keep and bear arms and we don’t want it to get thrown away. ---
**Author:** ![ed\_anger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/bbce88/32.png) [@ed\_anger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ed_anger)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2013, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-you-need-a-gun/646873/313 "2013-01-15T23:46:54Z")
> [@DrCube](#): > > Nobody has the responsibility to protect me and my family but me. You are absolutely wrong if you think cops or anyone else is required or even expected to protect me. That’s not anybody’s job but mine and the people I pay if I’m rich enough to afford professional security. Right. The military and police have nothing to do with the current level of civilization and stability you enjoy. More gibberish please. ---
**Author:** ![ed\_anger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/bbce88/32.png) [@ed\_anger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ed_anger)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2013, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-you-need-a-gun/646873/314 "2013-01-16T00:09:45Z")
more laws in discussion: > [@](#): > > In New Jersey, one of 18 new gun bills submitted to the legislature would require gun buyers to submit to a psychological evaluation. A bill requiring gun owners to register annually, and another requiring all guns to be kept in lock boxes when not in use may be introduced in California. While in Connecticut, state Sen. Beth Bye, wants to limit access to assault weapons and high-capacity magazines, and require that firearms be registered by model and serial number. > **[U.S. News: Latest Breaking Stories, Video, and Photos on American Politics,...](https://www.nbcnews.com/us-news?lite)** > > Get the latest news headlines and top stories from NBCNews.com. Find videos and news articles on the latest stories in the US. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2013, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-you-need-a-gun/646873/315 "2013-01-16T00:25:43Z")
> [@XT](#): > > My problem is that this is the AWB all over again…silly, meaningless regulations that are designed for making liberals and folks who are ignorant and scared of guns feel good, while doing dick to address any real issues. Do I have a problem with it? No, not really…I just think it’s stupid and pointless. But then, so are most of the proposed gun regulations being kicked about atm. Do you believe the government is powerless to do anything to reduce the occurrence of mass homicides like Newtown and Aurora? ---
**Author:** ![jasg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f0a364/32.png) [@jasg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jasg)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2013, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-you-need-a-gun/646873/316 "2013-01-16T00:29:42Z")
> [@Nars\_Glinley](#): > > As a country, we don’t normally require responsibility or training to exercise one’s rights. And unless the government bears the full cost of the registration program, this would amount to a poll tax. > [@jasg](#): > > I disagree. As a country we certainly teach that there are rights and responsibilities for citizens - some are mandatory and some are voluntary. You can even tie responsibilities (enforced by law) directly to amendments in the bill of rights. > [@Nars\_Glinley](#): > > I’ve just re-read the bill of rights. I can’t see any of them that require training or registration to exercise. Can you please elaborate and provide an example? My disagreement has to do with your statement regarding rights without responsibility. Your position regarding registration, licensing or a Poll tax (or redefinition of that term) is another issue. Some responsibilities are voluntary and some are mandatory, and enforced by legislation. As an example, the right to freedom of religion carries a mandatory responsibility to respect the religious traditions of others. If you caught burning a cross in front of a temple, synagogue or mosque you will get arrested. In some jurisdictions you might find yourself facing charges of a hate crime. Your right to vote carries a voluntary responsibility to be informed on the issues and to vote. 2nd Amendment responsibilities might be a good topic for another thread. ---
**Author:** ![DrCube](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a3d4f5/32.png) [@DrCube](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrCube)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2013, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-you-need-a-gun/646873/317 "2013-01-16T00:31:13Z")
> [@ed\_anger](#): > > Right. The military and police have nothing to do with the current level of civilization and stability you enjoy. More gibberish please. Here’s some more gibberish: I said nothing like that. Not even close. You’re answering somebody else’s question. Perhaps our society is less dangerous on average with a military and police force. In the case of the military especially, perhaps. But when my home is being invaded or I am being threatened by gangsters on the street, neither the police nor the military have any responsibility to protect me. That is simply not their job, even if they were around, which they wouldn’t be or I wouldn’t be getting threatened. It is up to me and me only to protect myself. ---
**Author:** ![ed\_anger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/bbce88/32.png) [@ed\_anger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ed_anger)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2013, 12:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-you-need-a-gun/646873/318 "2013-01-16T00:36:25Z")
> [@DrCube](#): > > Perhaps our society is less dangerous on average with a military and police force Maybe you wouldn’t mind moving to a failed state like Somalia if you think the military and police have little to do with your protection. > [@DrCube](#): > > But when my home is being invaded or I am being threatened by gangsters on the street, neither the police nor the military have any responsibility to protect me. This is, in fact, why the police exists. ---
**Author:** ![DrCube](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a3d4f5/32.png) [@DrCube](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrCube)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2013, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-you-need-a-gun/646873/319 "2013-01-16T00:49:34Z")
> [@ed\_anger](#): > > Maybe you wouldn’t mind moving to a failed state like Somalia if you think the military and police have little to do with your protection. Dude, what in the hell does this have to do with protecting myself from people who are trying to kill me? Is there any country on earth where there are no violent crimes?? > [@](#): > > This is, in fact, why the police exists. [Wrong](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Castle_Rock_v._Gonzales). They exist to arrest criminals, not protect people. ---
**Author:** ![ed\_anger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/bbce88/32.png) [@ed\_anger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ed_anger)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2013, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-you-need-a-gun/646873/320 "2013-01-16T01:02:54Z")
> [@DrCube](#): > > They exist to arrest criminals, not protect people. I guess when your guns are taken away you’ll be shit out of luck then. Next. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-you-need-a-gun/646873.md?page=15) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-you-need-a-gun/646873.md?page=17)