# Why does Ann Coulter spew this... **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [January 5, 2005, 4:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ann-coulter-spew-this/283152 "2005-01-05T04:33:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2005, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ann-coulter-spew-this/283152/141 "2005-01-07T20:49:16Z")
For the millionth time, his refusal to deny it when directly asked, when all other candidates answered directly. His staff’s replying with carefully worded statements about what periods in time he’d have been able to pass an FBI security check. What would the stated answers have been if the truth was that he hadn’t? If the answer can’t be no, then it’s yes. Got it finally? ---
**Author:** ![Psycho\_Pirate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Psycho\_Pirate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Psycho_Pirate)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2005, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ann-coulter-spew-this/283152/142 "2005-01-07T20:53:36Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > For the millionth time, his refusal to deny it when directly asked, when all other candidates answered directly. His staff’s replying with carefully worded statements about what periods in time he’d have been able to pass an FBI security check. What would the stated answers have been if the truth was that he hadn’t? If the answer can’t be no, then it’s yes. Got it finally? No, I don’t. Innocent until **PROVEN** guilty. That is the standard. I’ve never denied shooting ponies and eating them. That doesn’t mean I have, though. If one doesn’t respond to baseless slander, especially if one feels it is not worthy of a response, one should not be required to do so. Nor should one’s refusal to do so imply guilt. Sorry if this punches a hole in your convenient fiction. ---
**Author:** ![Brutus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/91b2a8/32.png) [@Brutus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brutus)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2005, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ann-coulter-spew-this/283152/143 "2005-01-07T20:56:04Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > For the millionth time, his refusal to deny it when directly asked, when all other candidates answered directly. His staff’s replying with carefully worded statements about what periods in time he’d have been able to pass an FBI security check. What would the stated answers have been if the truth was that he hadn’t? If the answer can’t be no, then it’s yes. Got it finally? Ah, the old, ‘In the absense of evidence, you must convict’ ploy. I like it! ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2005, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ann-coulter-spew-this/283152/144 "2005-01-07T21:00:34Z")
> [@Psycho Pirate](#): > > No, I don’t. Innocent until **PROVEN** guilty. This isn’t court, it’s politics. Tell us, do you apply your standard equally to members of both parties? You too, **Brutus** - keep on trusting Bush never to mislead you. :rolleyes: You both know damn well what he and his staff said, and you know damn well there’s only one reasonable explanation. Now deal with it. I could have mentioned the Project PULL episode, ya know, but that has multiple possible reasonable explanations. ---
**Author:** ![MaxTheVool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc29f/32.png) [@MaxTheVool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaxTheVool)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2005, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ann-coulter-spew-this/283152/145 "2005-01-07T21:09:37Z")
> [@Psycho Pirate](#): > > For the millionth time… > > CITE?!? Just out of curiosity, here… are you claiming that it has never been PROVEN that W did coke? Or that you, yourself, honestly BELIEVE that he didn’t do coke? Look at [this discussion](http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/media/july-dec99/bush_8-20.html) of the issue, for instance. Why on earth would his campaign clarify that he’d been drug-free since 1974 if he’d been drug-free his entire life? Why would he have said that he “made mistakes” when discussing drug use if he hadn’t? Do you honestly, truly, deep in your heart of hearts, believe that he never used illegal drugs? (The idea that it was cocaine comes, I assume, from an extrapolation of what drugs were popular back then.) Anyhow, what bugs me about the near-certainty that W did coke is not that he did, it’s that he’s a hypocrite about it. Honestly, the fact that he used to be a druggy party boy and has now cleaned himself up and gotten straight is one of the few things that I quite honestly RESPECT about the man. But instead of taking advantage of that, and showing some compassion for people convicted of drug offenses, and treating them as people who need help to straighten out, not as criminals-who-support-terrorism, he’s just played along with the hard-right war-on-drugs three-strikes zero-tolerance lock-em-up policy. > [@](#): > > No, I don’t. Innocent until PROVEN guilty. That is the standard. I’ve never denied shooting ponies and eating them. That doesn’t mean I have, though. > > If one doesn’t respond to baseless slander, especially if one feels it is not worthy of a response, one should not be required to do so. Nor should one’s refusal to do so imply guilt. > > Sorry if this punches a hole in your convenient fiction. And OJ didn’t kill his wife. “Innocent until proven guilty” applies to a court of law. Everyone is free to make up their own minds about things like whether W used coke, and many of us believe he did. We don’t claim we can PROVE it in a legal sense. But neither are we just making up random shit to defame W’s good nature. ---
**Author:** ![MaxTheVool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc29f/32.png) [@MaxTheVool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaxTheVool)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2005, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ann-coulter-spew-this/283152/146 "2005-01-07T21:18:07Z")
> [@WeirdDave](#): > > I’m curious. Do you see any irony, any at all, in the way you’ve characterized these two men, especially in light of the statement that preceded the characterization? I’m just asking because my irony meter just exploded. You castigate the Republicans for not playing fair while at the same time vilifying Bush in terms not supported by facts. (i.e. you can scream A.W.O.L. all you want, but that’s nothing more than a 35 years after the fact spin put on unclear circumstances, Bush was never charged with being A.W.O.L. back then, while at the same time, I’m not sure where you got “draft dodger”, was Bush in Europe not inhaling with Clinton or something? First of all, I’m certainly not going to claim that no liberal person, in public life or on the SDMB, has ever been a hypocrite, or has ever attacked the right wing unfairly. But, there’s a HUGE difference here, which is that Anne Coulter writes and publishes entire BOOKS which make these hyperbolic, insulting claims, and the comment about “AWOL” was in a post on a message board. Anne Coulter wrote a book called “Treason” accusing all liberals of being traitors. Until some equally prominent liberal writes a book called, say, “Rapists” about conservatives, I don’t see your comparison as being remotely valid. And even ignoring the context of book vs. message board post, she says things that are hateful and shrill about HALF THE POPULATION OF THE US. Saying something mean and inaccurate about Bush, who is only one person, isn’t even remotely comparable. When liberals get upset (as happens) and start saying mean, condescending and insulting things about all Bush voters, all red-staters, all Christians, etc., then we’re at least getting into the ball park of Anne Coulter, but until they are so convinced that their ventings are true that they actually write a BOOK about them, we’re not there yet. ---
**Author:** ![MaxTheVool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc29f/32.png) [@MaxTheVool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaxTheVool)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2005, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ann-coulter-spew-this/283152/147 "2005-01-07T21:24:42Z")
> [@Orbifold](#): > > Oh, I don’t take Franken seriously. I don’t see why not. Sure, he’s an entertainer. Sure, he’s funny. Sure, he sometimes plays some tasteless pranks (like the one at Bob Jones), but he also has the capacity to feel guilty about them. Read the chapter about Bob Jones, and he makes it quite clear that he’s not necessarily proud of how he acted there.\* Most importantly, however, he’s a good writer who makes a convincing case. For instance, his book contained a very interesting piece about the Bush tax refund in which two women are discussing how the got $500 back from the government, but all the extra money they have to spend because various services and programs were cut. Now, you may or may not agree with his reasoning, opinions, or analysis, but he’s certainl putting effort into constructing a legitimate argument about a substantive issue. What’s not to respect? (Also, as I said several posts back, you can bet your ass that after writing a book called **Lies and the Lying Liars who tell them** , he has the best damn fact checking in the business.) ---
**Author:** ![Psycho\_Pirate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Psycho\_Pirate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Psycho_Pirate)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2005, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ann-coulter-spew-this/283152/148 "2005-01-07T21:34:13Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > This isn’t court, it’s politics. Oh, that makes it OK then. :rolleyes: > [@ElviesL1ves](#): > > Tell us, do you apply your standard equally to members of both parties? What if I refuse to answer your question? Should I deprive you of the joy you take in leaping to unsusbstantiated conclusions? But to answer your question: Yes. Don’t you? > [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > You both know damn well what he and his staff said, and you know damn well there’s only one reasonable explanation. Now deal with it. I could have mentioned the Project PULL episode, ya know, but that has multiple possible reasonable explanations. I know no such thing. You apparently refuse to acknowledge my point that Bush and his staff may have been refusing to dignify a question based on a rumor with a response. But keep holding onto to that unproven assertion, Elvis! You apparently need it, and it obviously makes you very happy. > [@MaxTheVool](#): > > Just out of curiosity, here… are you claiming that it has never been PROVEN that W did coke? Or that you, yourself, honestly BELIEVE that he didn’t do coke? I am claiming (and I’m right) that it has never been PROVEN that our president used cocaine. I don’t know whether he did or not, but I need more than accusations before I infer guilt. > [@MaxTheVool](#): > > Look at this discussion of the issue, for instance. Why on earth would his campaign clarify that he’d been drug-free since 1974 if he’d been drug-free his entire life? Why would he have said that he “made mistakes” when discussing drug use if he hadn’t? Do you honestly, truly, deep in your heart of hearts, believe that he never used illegal drugs? (The idea that it was cocaine comes, I assume, from an extrapolation of what drugs were popular back then.) I looked at the discussion. Can you not see the president or his staff’s point? > [@George W. Bush](#): > > You know, really, I – when I first got going in this campaign, I started hearing about these ridiculous rumors. I made my mind up at that point in time not to chase every single rumor that had been floated about me. The game of trying to force me to prove a negative and to chase down unsubstantiated, ugly rumors has got to end. And so therefore, I’m going to end it. Why respond to a rumor? It is incumbent upon those investigating someone to do a little work and get some proof before accusing someone of something, or at least it should be. > [@MaxTheVool](#): > > And OJ didn’t kill his wife. “Innocent until proven guilty” applies to a court of law. Everyone is free to make up their own minds about things like whether W used coke, and many of us believe he did. We don’t claim we can PROVE it in a legal sense. But neither are we just making up random shit to defame W’s good nature. You certainly have that freedom. I also have the freedom to make up my own mind, and I have. As long as you realize what you have made up your mind about could be completely wrong, and don’t be surprised when everybody doesn’t agree with you (same for me, obviously). ---
**Author:** ![Weirddave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/919ad9/32.png) [@Weirddave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Weirddave)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2005, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ann-coulter-spew-this/283152/149 "2005-01-07T21:42:15Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > Tell us, do you apply your standard equally to members of both parties? **YES!!!** That’s my entire point! Don’t you??? ---
**Author:** ![Syntropy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/65b543/32.png) [@Syntropy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Syntropy)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2005, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ann-coulter-spew-this/283152/150 "2005-01-07T21:46:54Z")
> [@Brutus](#): > > Your ‘Michael Moore as Libertarian’ theory? Kindly read the rest of my post for the answer to your question. Premature ejaculation makes the baby Jesus cry, **Brutus** ---
**Author:** ![UrbanChic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/9dc877/32.png) [@UrbanChic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UrbanChic)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2005, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ann-coulter-spew-this/283152/151 "2005-01-07T21:59:58Z")
> [@Maureen](#): > > Premature ejaculation makes the baby Jesus cry, **Brutus** Only if it his him in the eye, though. ---
**Author:** ![Orbifold](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/779978/32.png) [@Orbifold](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Orbifold)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2005, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ann-coulter-spew-this/283152/152 "2005-01-07T22:17:44Z")
Regarding Al Franken… > [@MaxTheVool](#): > > I don’t see why not… You make good points, and replying mostly exposes my ignorance about Al Franken (beyond the fact that I know he’s a comedian with a fondness for targetting conservative pundits). I’m sure if I bothered to pay more attention to Franken that I might be more likely to take his political views seriously. I just don’t take him seriously in the sense that I take Ann Coulter seriously, i.e. as a demagogue directing hateful invective at vast swathes of the population. ---
**Author:** ![Brutus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/91b2a8/32.png) [@Brutus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brutus)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2005, 10:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ann-coulter-spew-this/283152/153 "2005-01-07T22:30:11Z")
> [@Maureen](#): > > Kindly read the rest of my post for the answer to your question. You just won’t admit that you were wrong, huh? ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2005, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ann-coulter-spew-this/283152/154 "2005-01-07T22:36:25Z")
> [@Psycho Pirate](#): > > I know no such thing. You apparently refuse to acknowledge my point that Bush and his staff may have been refusing to dignify a question based on a rumor with a response. But keep holding onto to that unproven assertion, Elvis! You apparently need it, and it obviously makes you very happy. I really don’t care what George put up his nose twenty years ago, but I feel compelled to point out that the Bush campaign _did_ respond, and it is the evasive and heavily conditional nature of that response that raises so many eyebrows. ---
**Author:** ![Syntropy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/65b543/32.png) [@Syntropy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Syntropy)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2005, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ann-coulter-spew-this/283152/155 "2005-01-07T22:44:44Z")
> [@Brutus](#): > > You just won’t admit that you were wrong, huh? Yeah, **Brutus** , that’s totally it. Maybe I should become a Republican, huh? :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Ryan\_Liam](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ryan_liam/32/3965_2.png) [@Ryan\_Liam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ryan_Liam)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2005, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ann-coulter-spew-this/283152/156 "2005-01-07T22:52:24Z")
> [@rjung](#): > > I’m surprised (but only _barely_) that **Ryan\_Liam** hasn’t condemned [this _earlier_ comparison of the forefathers of the United States](http://www.bartleby.com/66/11/46111.html) to folks who [targeted schools, destroyed health clinics, killed elected officials and civilians, bombed doctor’s offices, blew up school buses, and killed police officers](http://mediastudy.com/articles/av6-24-04.html). And he had _far_ more influence than Michael Moore could ever dream of… You’re right, he was wrong. You’d never think I’d agree to that did you? > [@](#): > > Not at all, Miller. He’s totally reinforcing my theory, which Brutus was kind enough to prove last night. Neo-cons’ sole defense of any egregious act on the part of any conservative politician or journalist is “XXX Democrat did this, which is comparable, so it cancels out.” And then, when you stand there in shocked amazement that anyone would actually use such a childish argument and expect to be taken seriously, they think they’ve won the argument. I wasn’t out to win the argument as you so put, but merely stating the fact that there can be bad arguments from the otherside of the political field. > [@](#): > > Is it comparable to anything Coulter has said? Yes. Not everything she has said has been an endorsement of genocide and gun-barrel group-think. Is it comparable to the worst things Coulter has said? Not even remotely. Which, for the terminally slow of thinking (that means you, Ryan) is the point of this discussion. It was one of the worst things Moore said because it showed his lack of understanding to the Iraqi resistance and its motives, instead he found it too tempting so he could tarnish his arch enemy Bush&co, a cheap shot, and a cheap swipe at the Americans and Iraqis who are fighting for freedom there. ---
**Author:** ![Ryan\_Liam](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ryan_liam/32/3965_2.png) [@Ryan\_Liam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ryan_Liam)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2005, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ann-coulter-spew-this/283152/157 "2005-01-07T22:54:25Z")
> [@Maureen](#): > > Yeah, **Brutus** , that’s totally it. Maybe I should become a Republican, huh? :rolleyes: give it a rest, we clearly know you’re as biased as the rest of us. Dumbass. ---
**Author:** ![Syntropy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/65b543/32.png) [@Syntropy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Syntropy)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2005, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ann-coulter-spew-this/283152/158 "2005-01-07T22:58:13Z")
Then why are you not spewing your shit at both of us, dickhead? ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2005, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ann-coulter-spew-this/283152/159 "2005-01-07T22:59:46Z")
> [@Ryan\_Liam](#): > > It was one of the worst things Moore said because it showed his lack of understanding to the Iraqi resistance and its motives, instead he found it too tempting so he could tarnish his arch enemy Bush&co, a cheap shot, and a cheap swipe at the Americans and Iraqis who are fighting for freedom there. Yeah, great. It’s the worst thing he’s ever said. The point, dumbfuck, is that it isn’t even in the same league as the worst thing Ann Coulter has ever said. Do you get it now, or do you need someone to make you a chart? ---
**Author:** ![Brutus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/91b2a8/32.png) [@Brutus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brutus)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2005, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ann-coulter-spew-this/283152/160 "2005-01-07T23:00:05Z")
> [@Maureen](#): > > Then why are you not spewing your shit at both of us, dickhead? Because he is a Libertarian too? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ann-coulter-spew-this/283152.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ann-coulter-spew-this/283152.md?page=9)