# Why does Cuba forbid emigration? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [April 21, 2015, 11:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-cuba-forbid-emigration/718237 "2015-04-21T23:57:15Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2015, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-cuba-forbid-emigration/718237/81 "2015-04-23T18:13:43Z")
What, you don’t want us to all go back to Russia anymore? ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2015, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-cuba-forbid-emigration/718237/82 "2015-04-23T18:17:57Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > Human Action, I’m a little surprised at zero political prisoners in the entirety of central America and the Caribbean save Cuba But hey, I’m no expert. I’m no expert either, but Human Rights Watch is. I read all the entries, and only Cuba gets a section on political prisoners, or has that phrase even used. That may not mean that _only_ Cuba has \>0 political prisoners, but certainly means that they have the most severe problem with it in the region. ---
**Author:** ![Haberdash](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Haberdash](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Haberdash)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2015, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-cuba-forbid-emigration/718237/83 "2015-04-23T18:18:44Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > What, you don’t want us to all go back to Russia anymore? You can go wherever you want to, unlike those who live under the Castro regime. ---
**Author:** ![Diceman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Diceman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diceman)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2015, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-cuba-forbid-emigration/718237/84 "2015-04-23T18:25:27Z")
> [@Human\_Action](#): > > Small island nations in particular appear to fare particularly badly in terms of [net migration](https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/rankorder/2112rank.html). The bottom 20 (small island nations bolded): > > **Tuvalu** > Republic of the Congo > **Guam** > Lesotho > **Virgin Islands** > El Salvador > **Saint Pierre and Miquelon** > **Sao Tome and Principe** > **Puerto Rico** > Somalia > **Saint Vincent and the Grenadines** > Guyana > Moldova > **Samoa** > **Maldives** > **Nauru** > **Tonga** > **Federated States of Micronesia** > \*\*American Samoa \*\* > Syria > > Only 24% of nations are islands. Small island nations often don’t have much of an economic base. Too small & isolated to do much manufacturing; too small to have much agriculture (of an exportable scale, anyway). Tourism only gets you so far; all your neighbors have beaches, too. A few lucky ones have managed to become tax havens and attract a bunch of rich people. A few other lucky(?) ones have become banking centers of questionable repute (ie, the Cayman Islands). The web address “.nu” comes from a small island nation called Niue. Back in the day, I seem to recall seeing that on a large number or porn sites. ---
**Author:** ![Musicat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/musicat/32/20189_2.png) [@Musicat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Musicat)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2015, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-cuba-forbid-emigration/718237/85 "2015-04-23T18:25:44Z")
_From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs._ Sounds good in principle, but if you have a great ability and can get paid better elsewhere, you leave. If you have great needs, you expect to be taken care of, right? But now the talented ones you need aren’t there anymore, and the entire concept breaks down. ---
**Author:** ![Hector\_St\_Clare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5ac83/32.png) [@Hector\_St\_Clare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hector_St_Clare)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2015, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-cuba-forbid-emigration/718237/86 "2015-04-23T18:30:36Z")
> [@Human\_Action](#): > > …and in the prisons and psychiatric hospitals full of political prisoners and dissidents. They were ‘full’ of people in the 1960s and 1970s, but they have only around a hundred today. But yes, Cuba has political prisoners. They aren’t a liberal democracy and have never purported to be. Given what they have achieved, _on balance_ I think it was worth it. And given that those hundred political prisoners knew what actively opposing the government would get them, I’m not particularly sympathetic to their plight. ---
**Author:** ![Haberdash](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Haberdash](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Haberdash)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2015, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-cuba-forbid-emigration/718237/87 "2015-04-23T18:34:23Z")
> [@Hector\_St\_Clare](#): > > They were ‘full’ of people in the 1960s and 1970s, but they have only around a hundred today. But yes, Cuba has political prisoners. They aren’t a liberal democracy and have never purported to be. Given what they have achieved, _on balance_ I think it was worth it. And given that those hundred political prisoners knew what actively opposing the government would get them, I’m not particularly sympathetic to their plight. There is nothing I can say about the communist mindset that condemns it better than its possessors do themselves. ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2015, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-cuba-forbid-emigration/718237/88 "2015-04-23T18:52:09Z")
> [@Hector\_St\_Clare](#): > > And given that those hundred political prisoners knew what actively opposing the government would get them, I’m not particularly sympathetic to their plight. I assume this applies to all political prisoners, in all countries? ---
**Author:** ![Haberdash](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Haberdash](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Haberdash)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2015, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-cuba-forbid-emigration/718237/89 "2015-04-23T18:57:11Z")
Here are some of the things that people are in prison for in Cuba. > **[Free business profile for CAPITOLHILLCUBANS.COM provided by Network Solutions](http://www.capitolhillcubans.com/2009/06/things-you-cannot-do-in-cuba-or-end-up.html)** > > Learn about CAPITOLHILLCUBANS.COM from this free business profile provided by Network Solutions Prior to 2012, being gay, transgender, or a transvestite was also on the list. The majority of LGBT people in Cuba were sent to special camps where they were literally worked to death as an intentional punishment. Many were simply executed as well. It is unknown how many people are still in prison in Cuba simply for being gay. ---
**Author:** ![Hector\_St\_Clare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5ac83/32.png) [@Hector\_St\_Clare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hector_St_Clare)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2015, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-cuba-forbid-emigration/718237/90 "2015-04-23T18:58:48Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > What, you don’t want us to all go back to Russia anymore? A majority of Russians now want communism back, according to the latest polls, so maybe the ‘go to russia’ phrase will come back into vogue. ---
**Author:** ![Hector\_St\_Clare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5ac83/32.png) [@Hector\_St\_Clare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hector_St_Clare)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2015, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-cuba-forbid-emigration/718237/91 "2015-04-23T19:02:01Z")
> [@Haberdash](#): > > Here are some of the things that people are in prison for in Cuba. > > [Business profile for capitolhillcubans.com provided by Network Solutions](http://www.capitolhillcubans.com/2009/06/things-you-cannot-do-in-cuba-or-end-up.html) > > Prior to 2012, being gay, transgender, or a transvestite was also on the list. The majority of LGBT people in Cuba were sent to special camps where they were literally worked to death as an intentional punishment. Many were simply executed as well. It is unknown how many people are still in prison in Cuba simply for being gay. Wrongo. Cuba decriminalized homosexual activity in 1979, and gradually dropped other legal sanctions against gays during the 1980s. (before Lawrence v. Texas, I might add. Castro also visited the sugarcane labour camps after a few years of operation, decided against them, and shut them down. If you have a cite that UMAP workers were ‘worked to death’, or that anyone was executed by the state for being gay, or even imprisoned post 1979, then cough it up. ---
**Author:** ![Haberdash](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Haberdash](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Haberdash)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2015, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-cuba-forbid-emigration/718237/92 "2015-04-23T19:08:55Z")
I’ll take the word of international human rights organizations and mainstream news sources over your propaganda for slavery. ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2015, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-cuba-forbid-emigration/718237/93 "2015-04-23T19:10:16Z")
> [@Hector\_St\_Clare](#): > > They were ‘full’ of people in the 1960s and 1970s, but they have only around a hundred today. But yes, Cuba has political prisoners. They aren’t a liberal democracy and have never purported to be. Given what they have achieved, _on balance_ I think it was worth it. And given that those hundred political prisoners knew what actively opposing the government would get them, I’m not particularly sympathetic to their plight. That is chilling to read. As a middle-class American, it’s easy to forget that people with this mentality still exist. But, at least you acknowledge the terrible price paid for Cuba’s…whatever it is you think they achieved. ---
**Author:** ![Haberdash](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Haberdash](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Haberdash)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2015, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-cuba-forbid-emigration/718237/94 "2015-04-23T19:12:56Z")
“Slightly higher life expectancy than Panama.” Like all those big cotton crops in the antebellum south and gaudy buildings that popped up in Berlin in the 1930s, it was all worth it, of course. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2015, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-cuba-forbid-emigration/718237/95 "2015-04-23T19:13:03Z")
> [@Haberdash](#): > > Maybe we could let all of America’s “progressives” go live in their paradise and welcome anyone who wants to take their place. No, let’s send all the RWs, who will be sure to look at everything with undeceived eyes, and then you can report back to us with the Straight Dope on conditions there . . . oh, eventually. ---
**Author:** ![Diceman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Diceman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diceman)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2015, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-cuba-forbid-emigration/718237/96 "2015-04-23T19:15:59Z")
> [@Hector\_St\_Clare](#): > > A majority of Russians now want communism back, according to the latest polls, so maybe the ‘go to russia’ phrase will come back into vogue. The sad part is, this is actually kinda understandable, because modern-day Russia is pretty much run by the Mob. Combine this with the results of the Arab Spring (see: Libya & Syria), and I’m starting to accept the idea that some cultures are simply not ready for democracy. ---
**Author:** ![Haberdash](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Haberdash](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Haberdash)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2015, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-cuba-forbid-emigration/718237/97 "2015-04-23T19:16:10Z")
If opposing bloodthirsty tyrants like Fidel Castro is the exclusive domain of “right-wingers” then sign me up, I guess. You’re only discrediting yourself and any movements to which you belong by pledging your support to this monster. ---
**Author:** ![Hector\_St\_Clare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5ac83/32.png) [@Hector\_St\_Clare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hector_St_Clare)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2015, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-cuba-forbid-emigration/718237/98 "2015-04-23T19:16:14Z")
> [@Human\_Action](#): > > That is chilling to read. As a middle-class American, it’s easy to forget that people with this mentality still exist. But, at least you acknowledge the terrible price paid for Cuba’s…whatever it is you think they achieved. No, the price was paid by _some_ Cubans, the ones who ended up as political prisoners. I think most of them deserved exactly what they got, and that the achievements of Cuba were generally worth sacrificing political freedom, so I have very little sympathy for them. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2015, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-cuba-forbid-emigration/718237/99 "2015-04-23T19:18:25Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > No, let’s send all the RWs, who will be sure to look at everything with undeceived eyes, and then you can report back to us with the Straight Dope on conditions there . . . oh, eventually. Apparently, **Hector\_St\_Clare** has never been there, not even on one of those carefully supervised Potemkin village tours. Every one I know who went, who got off “the tracks” have said Cuba is suffering and not a great place at all. Mind you, they also often had a couple good things to say. ---
**Author:** ![Hector\_St\_Clare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5ac83/32.png) [@Hector\_St\_Clare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hector_St_Clare)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2015, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-cuba-forbid-emigration/718237/100 "2015-04-23T19:19:20Z")
> [@Haberdash](#): > > I’ll take the word of international human rights organizations and mainstream news sources over your propaganda for slavery. Everything I mentioned above was _facts_, that even the more reputable Cuban American exile organizations (abd that’s an extremely low bar) agree on. Your entitled to call me evil or whatever else floats your boat, but you aren’t entitled to make up spurious facts. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-cuba-forbid-emigration/718237.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-cuba-forbid-emigration/718237.md?page=6)