# Why does Ebay.com allow people to avoid fees by excess shipping?
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ebay-com-allow-people-to-avoid-fees-by-excess-shipping/476871
**Category:** Factual Questions
**Created:** [December 12, 2008, 1:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ebay-com-allow-people-to-avoid-fees-by-excess-shipping/476871 "2008-12-12T13:31:28Z")
**Posts on this page:** 17
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@No\_Wikipedia\_Cites](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/No_Wikipedia_Cites)
#### Post date: [December 12, 2008, 1:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ebay-com-allow-people-to-avoid-fees-by-excess-shipping/476871/1 "2008-12-12T13:31:28Z")
Ebay only charges a commission on the cost of the good at the end of auction; the shipping cost can be fixed by the seller, and the seller pays only a commission on the listing itself and a share of the final bid.
So of course, they inflate their shipping costs and have ‘buy it nows’ for $5 goods that inexplicably cost $20 to ship.
Ebay allows this somehow.
Why? Wouldn’t Ebay want to clamp down and increase their revenues? I would rather have slightly higher commissions than have the current situation of sellers having to exaggerate their shipping costs in order to play the game.
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### Author:  [@chrisk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chrisk)
#### Post date: [December 12, 2008, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ebay-com-allow-people-to-avoid-fees-by-excess-shipping/476871/2 "2008-12-12T13:51:04Z")
I can think of two reasons, that might have a combined effect.
1. Not worth the cost of enforcement to go after bottom-feeders like this, especially in terms of ‘proving’ that the shipping costs are inflated.
2. This is tolerated as a sort of unofficial discount to encourage small sellers that aren’t much trouble but who might go elsewhere if they had to pay full rates. (When you think about it, when you’re pulling a minor scam yourself, you’re unlikely to rock the boat and complain about other things.)
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### Author:  [@ftg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ftg)
#### Post date: [December 12, 2008, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ebay-com-allow-people-to-avoid-fees-by-excess-shipping/476871/3 "2008-12-12T15:34:05Z")
It’s a shooting oneself in the foot situation. I avoid such sellers. Enough people might be avoiding them that they aren’t getting the money they hoped for.
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### Author:  [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)
#### Post date: [December 12, 2008, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ebay-com-allow-people-to-avoid-fees-by-excess-shipping/476871/4 "2008-12-12T16:09:07Z")
They don’t allow it. It’s against their rules.
[circumventing fees](http://pages.ebay.co.uk/help/policies/listing-circumventing.html)
> [@](#):
>
> Members may not use systems or techniques to circumvent or avoid paying eBay fees. Sellers should review the examples below to ensure they’re not engaging in any practices that circumvent eBay fees…
>
> Some examples
> …
> Unreasonable postage or packing costs - Listings with low prices but unreasonably high postage or packing costs.
However there are millions of items listed, too many for them to check, and they only know about it if you report such items.
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### Author:  [@beowulff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/beowulff)
#### Post date: [December 12, 2008, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ebay-com-allow-people-to-avoid-fees-by-excess-shipping/476871/5 "2008-12-12T16:23:24Z")
Here’s another, insidious side to inflated shipping costs:
There are lots of items listed on ebay with 1¢ cost and $9.99 shipping. Guess what happens if you demand a refund because the item doesn’t work…
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### Author:  [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)
#### Post date: [December 12, 2008, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ebay-com-allow-people-to-avoid-fees-by-excess-shipping/476871/6 "2008-12-12T17:02:16Z")
> [@beowulff](#):
>
> Here’s another, insidious side to inflated shipping costs:
> There are lots of items listed on ebay with 1¢ cost and $9.99 shipping. Guess what happens if you demand a refund because the item doesn’t work…
_You get $10.00 back._ If you file a SNAD, and it’s shown you are correct, Paypal refunds your entire amount sent. True, if you have to send the item back, that return postage is something you have to get from the seller, and that’s sometimes hard.
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### Author:  [@Mr.Slant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Slant)
#### Post date: [December 12, 2008, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ebay-com-allow-people-to-avoid-fees-by-excess-shipping/476871/7 "2008-12-12T17:14:02Z")
Actually, they’ve got another trick:
The Detailed Seller Ratings include your shipping fees as a major element.
If that score drops below 4.3, or your overall score drops below 5.0, you become eligible for the Ebay Death Penalty should Ebay’s bot find you before your score recovers.
Additionally, as your overall DSR drops, they decrease your rank and visibility in customer searches.
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### Author:  [@Mr.Slant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Slant)
#### Post date: [December 12, 2008, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ebay-com-allow-people-to-avoid-fees-by-excess-shipping/476871/8 "2008-12-12T17:16:35Z")
> [@sassyfras](#):
>
> SNIP
> Why? Wouldn’t Ebay want to clamp down and increase their revenues? I would rather have slightly higher commissions than have the current situation of sellers having to exaggerate their shipping costs in order to play the game.
Your supposition here is wrong.
They ARE clamping down on this situation, for precisely the reasons you cite.
You’re just seeing the guys who they haven’t caught yet.
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### Author:  [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)
#### Post date: [December 12, 2008, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ebay-com-allow-people-to-avoid-fees-by-excess-shipping/476871/9 "2008-12-12T17:22:38Z")
> [@Mr.Slant](#):
>
> Actually, they’ve got another trick:
> The Detailed Seller Ratings include your shipping fees as a major element.
> If that score drops below 4.3, or your overall score drops below 5.0, you become eligible for the Ebay Death Penalty should Ebay’s bot find you before your score recovers.
> Additionally, as your overall DSR drops, they decrease your rank and visibility in customer searches.
It’s 4.1 now. And, a score of 4.1 indicates you are in the lowest 5% of Sellers on eBay.
As for searches, only if the buyer uses that optional search function- “best match”. True, it is the default, but it’s easy and common to reset to another search option, such as listing auctions in the order they are to end.
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### Author:  [@beowulff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/beowulff)
#### Post date: [December 12, 2008, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ebay-com-allow-people-to-avoid-fees-by-excess-shipping/476871/10 "2008-12-12T17:26:45Z")
> [@DrDeth](#):
>
> _You get $10.00 back._ If you file a SNAD, and it’s shown you are correct, Paypal refunds your entire amount sent. True, if you have to send the item back, that return postage is something you have to get from the seller, and that’s sometimes hard.
Maybe, but often the deal advertises there own “money back guarantee.” Sometimes the item is exactly as described, but still isn’t what you want. In this case you get back 1¢.
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### Author:  [@No\_Wikipedia\_Cites](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/No_Wikipedia_Cites)
#### Post date: [December 12, 2008, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ebay-com-allow-people-to-avoid-fees-by-excess-shipping/476871/11 "2008-12-12T19:23:14Z")
I actually tried reporting the excessive shipping people, about a year ago, when i was tired of looking at the $1 price and $16.99 shipping for things besides heavy rocks. Ebay ignored them all.
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### Author:  [@Edward\_The\_Head](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Edward_The_Head)
#### Post date: [December 12, 2008, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ebay-com-allow-people-to-avoid-fees-by-excess-shipping/476871/12 "2008-12-12T20:39:11Z")
Some things eBay is, or was, setting a maximum for shipping. I sold a set of CDs a few months back and it set the limit at $3 for a lot of 10 CDs. Not sure if they still do this, but the last few CDs I’ve bought have all been $3 for shipping. Which does kind of suck, because now you losing money on shipping when it costs almost $3 to ship and $1 for an envelope.
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### Author:  [@Mr.Slant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Slant)
#### Post date: [December 12, 2008, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ebay-com-allow-people-to-avoid-fees-by-excess-shipping/476871/13 "2008-12-12T21:17:24Z")
> [@Edward\_The\_Head](#):
>
> Some things eBay is, or was, setting a maximum for shipping. I sold a set of CDs a few months back and it set the limit at $3 for a lot of 10 CDs. Not sure if they still do this, but the last few CDs I’ve bought have all been $3 for shipping. Which does kind of suck, because now you losing money on shipping when it costs almost $3 to ship and $1 for an envelope.
You’re doing it wrong.
First of all, go to [postcalc.usps.com](http://postcalc.usps.com) and look up rates for USPS Media Mail with online postage, netting you delivery confirmation for 18 cents. 1 lb + DC is $2.41.
The online postage is key here, as otherwise it’s closer to 75 cents for DC.
Second, if you’re doing any volume at all, buy a stack of envelopes from U-Line, Altusmarket or similar.
You can get your cost down to well under 40c per unit easily, and MUCH lower in volume, for a total cost of under $2.81
[1] You can do this for 34c/piece delivered, and it’s sturdier than a mere envelope. Never use just an envelope for a CD.
> **[CD Case Mailers S-5075 - ULINE](https://www.uline.com/Product/Detail/S-5075/CD-Cases-and-Mailers/CD-Case-Mailers?Model=S-5075)**
>
> FIBERBOARD Holds one plastic CD jewel case. Self seal. Tear-strip opening. ULINE offers over 45,000 boxes, plastic poly bags, mailing tubes, warehouse supplies and bubble wrap for your storage, packaging, or shipping supplies.
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### Author:  [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)
#### Post date: [December 12, 2008, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ebay-com-allow-people-to-avoid-fees-by-excess-shipping/476871/14 "2008-12-12T23:25:07Z")
> [@Edward\_The\_Head](#):
>
> Some things eBay is, or was, setting a maximum for shipping. I sold a set of CDs a few months back and it set the limit at $3 for a lot of 10 CDs. Not sure if they still do this, but the last few CDs I’ve bought have all been $3 for shipping. Which does kind of suck, because now you losing money on shipping when it costs almost $3 to ship and $1 for an envelope.
I think it just makes you set the default option at that.
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### Author:  [@Mr.Slant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Slant)
#### Post date: [December 13, 2008, 4:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ebay-com-allow-people-to-avoid-fees-by-excess-shipping/476871/15 "2008-12-13T04:01:22Z")
Nope, those are limits:
[http://www.ecommerce-guide.com/essentials/ebay/article.php/3770636](http://www.ecommerce-guide.com/essentials/ebay/article.php/3770636)
–BEGIN QUOTE
What Are The New Media Shipping Limits?
Starting in October, the limits on shipping and handling charges for the first flat-rate shipping service within or into the U.S. are as follows:
Books:
Books \> Accessories: Address Books $4, Blank Diaries & Journals $5, Book Covers $5, Book Plates $3, Bookmarks $3, Other $3
Books \> Antiquarian & Collectible: $4
Books \> Audiobook: $4
Books \> Catalogs: $4
Books \> Children’s Books: $4
Books \> Cookbooks Cookbooks: $4
Books \> Fiction Books Fiction Books: $4
Books \> Magazine Back Issues Magazine Back Issues: $4
Books \> Nonfiction Books Nonfiction Books: $4
Books \> Other: $4
Books \> Textbooks, Education: $4
Books \> Wholesale & Bulk Lots: Audiobooks $10, Books 101-500 $20, Books 11-50 Items $8, 51-100 Items $15, 6-10 Items $6, More than 500, $30, Up to 5 Items $6, Magazines $8, Other $6
DVDs & Movies:
DVDs & Movies \> DVD, HD DVD & Blu-ray DVD: $3
DVDs & Movies \> Film: $6
DVDs & Movies \> Laserdisc: $6
DVDs & Movies \> Other Formats: $3
DVDs & Movies \> UMD: $5
DVDs & Movies \> VHS: $3
DVDs & Movies \> VHS Non-US (PAL): $5
DVDs & Movies \> Wholesale Lots: DVDs 101-250 Items $30, DVDs 11-50 Items $15, DVDs 251-500 Items $60, DVDs 501-1000 Items $120, DVDs 51-100 Items $25,
DVDs Up to 10 Items $10, Mixed Lots $10, Movies Accessories $17, Other $10, VHS 101-500 Items $30, VHS 11-50 Items $15, VHS 51-100 Items $25, VHS More than
500 Items $120, VHS Up to 10 Items $10
Music:
Music \> Accessories $5
Music \> Cassettes $3
Music \> CDs $3
Music \> DVD Audio $3
Music \> Other Formats $3
Music \> Records $4
Music \> Super Audio CDs $3
Music \> Wholesale Lots: Cassettes $10, CDs 101-500 Items $30, CDs 11-100 Items $20, CDs More than 500 Items $60, CDs Up to 10 Items $10, Other Formats $10, Records 11-50 Items $15, Records More than 50 Items $25, Records Up to 10 Items $10
Video Games:
Video Games \> Accessories $6
Video Games \> Games $4
Video Games \> Internet Games Games \> Guild Wars $6, World of Warcraft $3, Software & PC Versions $6
Video Games \> Other $4
Video Games \> Systems Systems $15
Video Games \> Vintage Games $6
Video Games \> Wholesale Lots: Accessories $10, Console Systems $50, Games $9, Other $9
–END QUOTE
Fair use note:
All but one sentence from the above blurb are from an Ebay email that’s public knowledge.
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### Author:  [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)
#### Post date: [December 13, 2008, 8:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ebay-com-allow-people-to-avoid-fees-by-excess-shipping/476871/16 "2008-12-13T08:27:36Z")
Well, Amazon fixes S&H at 3.99 per book, and enough sellers make a profit out of that so that many books are listed and sold at 1 cent. I just bought one today, in fact.
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### Author:  [@Mr.Slant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Slant)
#### Post date: [December 13, 2008, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-ebay-com-allow-people-to-avoid-fees-by-excess-shipping/476871/17 "2008-12-13T15:20:40Z")
Actually, Amazon takes $1.35 out of that pot, so you wind up with about $2.65 before you pay for shipping & packing materials.
Additionally, if you’re low-volume and don’t pay a monthly fee, they take an additional 99c, so you’d be getting $1.63 to ship a penny book.