# Why does every damn social meeting have to involve the whole fucking family? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [August 10, 2011, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236 "2011-08-10T19:02:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 10
**Author:** ![pepperlandgirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/f17d59/32.png) [@pepperlandgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pepperlandgirl)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2011, 6:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/181 "2011-08-12T06:56:02Z")
I can’t believe how many people are up in arms because DtC posts (in his way) that he’s a dedicated father who’d rather spend time with his girls than anybody else on the planet. And yet, somehow DtC is the asshole. I wish my dad was half the asshole DtC clearly is. ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2011, 7:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/182 "2011-08-12T07:04:15Z")
> [@pepperlandgirl](#): > > I can’t believe how many people are up in arms because DtC posts (in his way) that he’s a dedicated father who’d rather spend time with his girls than anybody else on the planet. And yet, somehow DtC is the asshole. I wish my dad was half the asshole DtC clearly is. **Dio** is an asshole for saying that people who would like to go out without the kids and/or the spouse on occasion are developmentally arrested retards… ---
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2011, 1:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/183 "2011-08-12T13:25:42Z")
> [@pepperlandgirl](#): > > I can’t believe how many people are up in arms because DtC posts ( **in his way** ) That’s really the crux of it right there. Dio’s phrasing is so abrasive, he couldn’t give away free money without people hating him for it. ---
**Author:** ![CrazyCatLady](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/dfb087/32.png) [@CrazyCatLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CrazyCatLady)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2011, 1:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/184 "2011-08-12T13:28:38Z")
> [@C3](#): > > The alternative to lots of guys (or girls) nights out is not total social isolation. True enough. And that would be an awesome argument if anybody in this thread was advocating _lots_ of guys/girls nights. But nobody is. What people are advocating is _occasional_ girls/guys nights. Once in a while. Every now and then. To put in your own terms, **the alternative to total social isolation isn’t no guys nights, ever**. That’s what the OP is bitching about, not the ridiculous strawmen people have built about never wanting to spend time with your family. ---
**Author:** ![Living\_Well\_Is\_Best\_Revenge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/6bbea6/32.png) [@Living\_Well\_Is\_Best\_Revenge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Living_Well_Is_Best_Revenge)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2011, 1:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/185 "2011-08-12T13:29:36Z")
> [@Zeriel](#): > > That’s really the crux of it right there. Dio’s phrasing is so abrasive, he couldn’t give away free money without people hating him for it. Exactly. It’s not so much what he says, it’s how he says it. I wonder if he has a touch of the autism or something. ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2011, 1:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/186 "2011-08-12T13:33:10Z")
> [@pepperlandgirl](#): > > I can’t believe how many people are up in arms because DtC posts (in his way) that he’s a dedicated father who’d rather spend time with his girls than anybody else on the planet. And yet, somehow DtC is the asshole. I wish my dad was half the asshole DtC clearly is. I actually admire him for being a devoted husband and dad. But he can be a judgemental prick a lot of the time. ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2011, 1:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/187 "2011-08-12T13:35:40Z")
> [@Leaffan](#): > > Well, thanks to all of this, I just told her that she’s a passive-aggressive bitch. > > I don’t think it went over well. There are ways you can assert your happiness and freedom without name-calling. But good on you for saying **something**. Maybe this will open a door to constructive dialog. ---
**Author:** ![C3](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/c3/32/3108_2.png) [@C3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/C3)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2011, 1:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/188 "2011-08-12T13:37:22Z")
> [@CrazyCatLady](#): > > True enough. And that would be an awesome argument if anybody in this thread was advocating _lots_ of guys/girls nights. But nobody is. What people are advocating is _occasional_ girls/guys nights. Once in a while. Every now and then. To put in your own terms, **the alternative to total social isolation isn’t no guys nights, ever**. > > That’s what the OP is bitching about, not the ridiculous strawmen people have built about never wanting to spend time with your family. I was responding to the idea that if you choose not to go out with friends alone, sans spouse and kids, you’re isolating yourself from the world: [QUOTE=DianaG] The whole point of raising children is to give them the skills to get the hell out of your house. What exactly are you going to do with yourself when that happens if you’ve let everyone else in your life fall away? [/QUOTE] I said nothing about never wanting to spend time with your family. ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2011, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/189 "2011-08-12T15:08:49Z")
> [@Jamaika\_a\_jamaikaiake](#): > > **Leaffan** : > > I know you don’t know me from Adam, but my wife and I am driving from NYC to Toronto next week for a friend’s wedding. If you are anywhere on either route (either way around Lake Ontario), PM me, and I will stop and buy you a beer. Appreciate the offer. I’m about 4 hours north of Toronto though! Have fun at the wedding. ---
**Author:** ![Death\_of\_Rats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a6a055/32.png) [@Death\_of\_Rats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Death_of_Rats)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2011, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/190 "2011-08-12T15:10:21Z")
> [@DianaG](#): > > Loud, alternately boring and annoying people that you have to constantly censor yourself in the presence of. Good times. > > 😉 You just described 90% of the adults I have ever met. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![purplehorseshoe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/purplehorseshoe/32/2996_2.png) [@purplehorseshoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/purplehorseshoe)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2011, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/191 "2011-08-12T15:28:29Z")
**Leaffan** , have you + wife gone for couples counseling? If not … how would she react to the suggestion? Have you ever gone, alone, to see a therapist? Might not hurt, just to get a few pointers on effective ways to stand up for yourself. For example, calling to tell - not ask - about stopping with the guys after work = effective. (Maybe.) Calling her a passive-aggressive bitch = not effective. (Though quite true.) Don’t, uh, ask for her permission to see a therapist, by the way. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2011, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/192 "2011-08-12T15:34:47Z")
> [@purplehorseshoe](#): > > **Leaffan** , have you + wife gone for couples counseling? If not … how would she react to the suggestion? > > Have you ever gone, alone, to see a therapist? Might not hurt, just to get a few pointers on effective ways to stand up for yourself. For example, calling to tell - not ask - about stopping with the guys after work = effective. (Maybe.) Calling her a passive-aggressive bitch = not effective. (Though quite true.) > > Don’t, uh, ask for her permission to see a therapist, by the way. 🙂 We went for six sessions last year, and I felt like I was getting beat up by both the female counselor and my wife simultaneously. But, in all fairness, we were attempting to address another issue at the time. I don’t want to go for any more counseling. ---
**Author:** ![Dogzilla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e480ec/32.png) [@Dogzilla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dogzilla)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2011, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/193 "2011-08-12T15:48:26Z")
**Leffan** , why not try a male therapist and go by yourself? Then it won’t be 2 on 1 with the two ganging up on you. Just mano e mano, two dudes, talking. I, too, am concerned about the message this dynamic is sending to your children. I’m dating a guy whose mama is rather controlling. She could be a lot worse and he works very hard (with his therapist) to set and maintain very firm boundaries. I see how he struggles to walk the line between respecting his mom and capitulating to her demands. His therapist helps. I back her up (tell him the same things without realizing she said the same thing to him yesterday) in support. I also stand up to her in terms of supporting him. Example: “Well, Dogzilla, what do _you_ think he should do?” “Oh, I think he’s a smart, capable adult. I support whatever decision he makes for himself.” His mom, “…” He looks at me with gratitude; she shoots daggers. I don’t care what she thinks; I’m on _his_ team. His BFF has a mom who is way worse. I feel sorry for that guy because no woman in her right mind would ever want to be with him because she’d have to either constantly fight her MIL, or she’d have to be a doormat and go along with whatever MIL says. Poor guy. He’s a really wonderful human being, but until he learns to cut the umbilical cord, he’s totally unfuckable by any reasonably independent woman. If you have any sons, please do them a favor and get a handle on this _before_ they strike out into the world and marry a woman who is exactly like their mother. ---
**Author:** ![woodstockbirdybird](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/woodstockbirdybird/32/7905_2.png) [@woodstockbirdybird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/woodstockbirdybird)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2011, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/194 "2011-08-12T15:48:49Z")
> [@jabiru](#): > > My situation is not entirely dissimilar to that of Leaffan, with the sexes reversed. I made the huge mistake of venting to a friend about how controlling my husband is, forgetting that she is also a bit of a control freak. Now all she does is criticise him for his controlling ways and me for not doing anything about it. I wish I’d shut up and said nothing. > > It’s a helluva lot easier for those outside the marrige to see solutions. Sometimes there just isn’t a solution and you just have to put up with it. The solution, in that case, is to end the marriage. I speak as someone who’s done it, with kids, and in the end it was the best situation for everybody involved. ---
**Author:** ![aruvqan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aruvqan/32/2891_2.png) [@aruvqan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aruvqan)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2011, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/195 "2011-08-12T16:39:53Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > It’s not a question of why you would want to engage in the activity, it’s why should your wife have to be stuck with the kids while you do it. > > Weekends are family time. If you’re going to ditch them (and expect your spouse to pick up your slack), you better have a legitimate reason. Hanging out with your buddy to watch movies is not a legitimate reason. > > Personally, I no longer see the appeal in that kind of thing anyway. I’d much rather hang out with my family. Anyone who prefers their buddies to their families probably should not have made a family to begin with. I do not see why having an outside friendship is all that unreasonable. People have hobbies and interests that spouses can not be interested in, so you have friends that do that hobby, and you interact with them. > [@Vihaga](#): > > Heh. That’s true. My husband’s beer brewing, for example, is EXTREMELY kid-unfriendly, and that’s fine. Likewise, my fish tanks aren’t really something you want a kid messing with during maintenance time. We don’t even have a kid yet, but this stuff will certainly require switching off. Actually, you do not need to switch it off, you simply need to find a way to keep small fingers out until they get old enough to know not to get hurt, then you teach them how to participate safely. You can brew soda not just beer… and you can make a tiny freshwater fish tank for a youngster. Hell, my Dad kept guns, and taught my brother and I how to safely shoot for sport and hunting starting when each of us turned 8. And may I point out that cooking in a kitchen is just as dangerous as brewing beer, and happens 2 or 3 times a day. [and home brewed ginger ale is neat, you can make it as ginger zingy as you like. To get a neat tongue tingle add szechuan pepper] > [@rogerbox](#): > > Spending time with your friends actually is an entitlement in reasonable balanced relationships, though. I’m glad you appear happy in yours, but I would not enjoy something like that. And makes for a less rich life. > [@Omar\_Little](#): > > I prefer to go to strip clubs with my wife and other couples. I used to go to stripper night at Fort Storey’s Enlisted Club - they had an excellent 10 cent wing/25 cent beer night and strippers were just extra background action to watch. We had a blast, though our Navy buddys could never get their wives or girlfriends to come along. The mess cranks working at the E club made some quite excellent wings. The other pub grub was pretty good also. And to the person who posted that historically it was family time all the time, may I point out all the clubs that had origins historically, there are any number of [fraternal](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fraternity)and sororal organizations from Freemasons to Order of the Eastern Star that have member only meetings to all on family shindigs. Men and women both participated and as the wiki points out the concept of a fraternal organization goes back into the middle ages with trade guilds. Women even had their own trade guilds [seamstresses without the hem hem hem joke from Terry Pratchet] Historically I might also point out that it was not uncommon for men to go out and ‘ditch the kids’ anywhere from once a while to nightly. The WCTU was founded by women who wanted to close all the bars so the men had to come home, and not spend their entire income on drinking and gambling. I would be willing to bet that if you polled the entire community of mental health professionals they would agree that being totally insular and never seeing anybody other than in entire family groups would be unhealthy. No matter how insular you are as a couple, OP obviously has different hobby interests other than those of his wifes, and obviously was pressured to trim them away one at a time instead of making negotiated changes. He needs to be allowed to drink and see his friends occasionally - he points out his wife was raised temperance and he was not. There is nothing evil in alcohol as long as it is not an addiction, and it sounds like he wants to drink in moderation. His wife is demonizing a common activity that is not in itself evil. That is NOT healthy. ---
**Author:** ![C3](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/c3/32/3108_2.png) [@C3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/C3)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2011, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/196 "2011-08-12T16:53:54Z")
> [@aruvqan](#): > > No matter how insular you are as a couple, OP obviously has different hobby interests other than those of his wifes, and obviously was pressured to trim them away one at a time instead of making negotiated changes. He needs to be allowed to drink and see his friends occasionally - he points out his wife was raised temperance and he was not. There is nothing evil in alcohol as long as it is not an addiction, and it sounds like he wants to drink in moderation. His wife is demonizing a common activity that is not in itself evil. That is NOT healthy. No, the OP complained that his married w/ kids buddy didn’t want to hang out with him on a one-on-one basis. Leaffan’s situation sounds like it sucks and is interesting off-shoot of the topic, but it’s not really the topic of the thread. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2011, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/197 "2011-08-12T19:24:01Z")
Update: I have a guys only dinner date with a pal set for next week. I feel like I’m in high school again, anticipating a first date with a pretty girl and worrying that this is too good to be true and surely she’ll come up with a reason to cancel before it happens. High school never ends! ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2011, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/198 "2011-08-12T19:34:00Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > Update: I have a guys only dinner date with a pal set for next week. I feel like I’m in high school again, anticipating a first date with a pretty girl and worrying that this is too good to be true and surely she’ll come up with a reason to cancel before it happens. High school never ends! Great news! (And the metaphor made me laugh!) ETA: Or is it a simile? Yes. I think it’s a simile. ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2011, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/199 "2011-08-12T19:36:35Z")
That’s awesome, dude. ---
**Author:** ![OneMissedPost](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/8e7dd6/32.png) [@OneMissedPost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OneMissedPost)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2011, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/200 "2011-08-12T19:38:47Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Anyone who prefers their buddies to their families probably should not have made a family to begin with. This was you being very judgmental. I think some posters were trying to say that they need time away from their families once in a while, which is certainly understandable. Everyone needs to keep their own identity and there is absolutely nothing wrong with wanting to hangout with people individually. You are not superior to anyone because of your beliefs about family. The posters who want to spend time away from their families are not inferior to you. It is ridiculous to say that people who do not share your beliefs should not have a family. In the future, please accept that people will probably not share your beliefs. This does not mean they are stupid, immature, or wrong. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236.md?page=9) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236.md?page=11)