# Why does every damn social meeting have to involve the whole fucking family? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [August 10, 2011, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236 "2011-08-10T19:02:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![Dung\_Beetle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dung_beetle/32/7945_2.png) [@Dung\_Beetle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dung_Beetle)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2011, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/121 "2011-08-11T19:55:51Z")
> [@Zeriel](#): > > I understand the “I like them better than you”, but again, that comes off weird–do you only ever have one friend at a time, then, or is there some room for the second-through-tenth place folks? Maybe I’m a weirdo, but yeah… I only really focus on one or two people at a time, and now that I’ve got a husband and kids those positions are filled. I have one friend in town that I exchange cards, emails, and gifts with, and even that level of friendship feels burdensome sometimes. I haven’t seen her in months, and that’s totally okay, because I have a lot of family obligations to interest me. My husband took two of the kids on a camping trip this week, leaving me home with one. I think this is the first time we’ve been apart in about a year. The child left at home has to work tonight and I will be all by myself…will I fill these golden hours with the company of friends? Oh _hell_ no. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2011, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/122 "2011-08-11T20:13:07Z")
> [@Leaffan](#): > > It’s a matter of time at this point. I can’t leave the kids. Careful what you tell yourself; you are **choosing** not to leave the kids, and that is your decision to make. > [@DoctorJ](#): > > \ > I think one of the most important things you can do as a parent, aside from the whole feeding/clothing/educating/protecting from wolves type stuff, is to be a fully formed adult with adult interests, adult relationships, and adult achievements. How can you expect the kids to form their own identities if their parents don’t have identities themselves?? I just wanted to point this out as the good advice it is. You don’t stop being an individual human being because you have kids, do you? ---
**Author:** ![Dogzilla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e480ec/32.png) [@Dogzilla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dogzilla)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2011, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/123 "2011-08-11T20:18:10Z")
> [@jz78817](#): > > Is it me or are Dio’s posts starting to sound like the rationalizations of a miserable person? Maybe just a little bit. Not until I thought I saw a contradiction, here: > [@](#): > > For the record, I’m “allowed” to do anything the fuck I want. I just don’t WANT to ditch my wife with the kids, because taking care of those kids is hard work and she needs help. > > I also -get this - love my kids, and I’d usually rather do something with them and my wife then abandon them to go do something less fun people I don’t care as much about. Taking care of the kids is hard work, and also he won’t abandon his wife to go do something less fun. I’m not seeing how the hard work = more fun, but that’s why I’m not a family person and Dio is. To _me_, that _sounded_ like a contradiction. The reason I didn’t have kids is because it’s damn hard work; I don’t see how there’s any fun in it (and no parent has ever been able to convince me there is). ---
**Author:** ![woodstockbirdybird](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/woodstockbirdybird/32/7905_2.png) [@woodstockbirdybird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/woodstockbirdybird)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2011, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/124 "2011-08-11T20:19:28Z")
> [@Cat\_Whisperer](#): > > I just wanted to point this out as the good advice it is. You don’t stop being an individual human being because you have kids, do you? Sadly, many people do. ---
**Author:** ![overlyverbose](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/9dc877/32.png) [@overlyverbose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/overlyverbose)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2011, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/125 "2011-08-11T20:19:43Z")
Another vote for the "you-need-to-specify"camp. Your friends can’t read your mind - if you don’t tell them you want to hang out with just them, they’ll probably assume everyone is included, especially if it’s just to hang out. On the flip side, as a working mother, it drives me nuts when my childless friends call me and want me to hang out with them with absolutely no prior notice. Yes, I make an effort to have alone time with my friends. But I need to know you want to hang out more than an hour or two ahead of time. I’m not talking weeks - a day or two will work. I can’t just drop the kids on my husband and take off without telling him in advance. So, yes, if a friend does that to me and wants to hang out with only me, I’ll probably decline. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2011, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/126 "2011-08-11T20:20:34Z")
> [@rogerbox](#): > > By judging others who have a healthier lifestyle than him for “partying” and being bad fathers for having the occasional night out, yes. :rolleyes: You’re saying that fathers who prefer to stay home with their families rather than go out drinking at strip joints with developmentally arrested retards are “unhealthy?” You pretty much don’t know shit about shit. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2011, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/127 "2011-08-11T20:21:22Z")
> [@woodstockbirdybird](#): > > Sadly, many people do. But it shouldn’t be accepted as the norm, should it? ---
**Author:** ![woodstockbirdybird](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/woodstockbirdybird/32/7905_2.png) [@woodstockbirdybird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/woodstockbirdybird)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2011, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/128 "2011-08-11T20:22:18Z")
Not in my opinion, no. ---
**Author:** ![purplehorseshoe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/purplehorseshoe/32/2996_2.png) [@purplehorseshoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/purplehorseshoe)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2011, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/129 "2011-08-11T20:23:11Z")
> [@Leaffan](#): > > I’ve obviously heard all of this before. > > There’s no screaming. There’s no fighting, and frankly the kids wouldn’t really be able to tell that she’s controlling and I’m acquiescing. > > They might see a rather bland, standoff’ish relationship, but not everyone is your typical lovey-dovey couple. > > It’s not like I’m storming around yelling because I can’t go hang out with the boys when I want to, and I still am getting out for my 9 holes of golf once a week. > > Because of the way my wife is, somewhat self-centred, I do a lot with and for the kids. Without me their life would be worse. Trust me. I’m sure you have heard it all before, but I thought it might bear repeating. 😉 Your last sentence, however, made me do this: _cough **fullcustody** cough_ ---
**Author:** ![woodstockbirdybird](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/woodstockbirdybird/32/7905_2.png) [@woodstockbirdybird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/woodstockbirdybird)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2011, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/130 "2011-08-11T20:23:18Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > You’re saying that fathers who prefer to stay home with their families rather than go out drinking at strip joints with developmentally arrested retards are “unhealthy?” > > You pretty much don’t know shit about shit. I must have missed the post where somebody mentioned going to a strip club and getting drunk. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2011, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/131 "2011-08-11T20:23:43Z")
> [@Dogzilla](#): > > Maybe just a little bit. Not until I thought I saw a contradiction, here: > Taking care of the kids is hard work, and also he won’t abandon his wife to go do something less fun. I’m not seeing how the hard work = more fun, but that’s why I’m not a family person and Dio is. To _me_, that _sounded_ like a contradiction. The reason I didn’t have kids is because it’s damn hard work; I don’t see how there’s any fun in it (and no parent has ever been able to convince me there is). Have you never had fun doing anything that was hard work? Painting a house, doing a tough jigsaw puzzle, working out? It’s not necessarily a contradiction. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2011, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/132 "2011-08-11T20:25:28Z")
> [@woodstockbirdybird](#): > > I must have missed the post where somebody mentioned going to a strip club and getting drunk. Post #12. ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2011, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/133 "2011-08-11T20:27:15Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Post #12. Which was a joke. ---
**Author:** ![purplehorseshoe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/purplehorseshoe/32/2996_2.png) [@purplehorseshoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/purplehorseshoe)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2011, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/134 "2011-08-11T20:27:48Z")
Holy shit, dude, that was three pages ago… Also, fallacy of the excluded middle, and all that. ---
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2011, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/135 "2011-08-11T20:28:34Z")
I prefer to go to strip clubs with my wife and other couples. ---
**Author:** ![Living\_Well\_Is\_Best\_Revenge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/6bbea6/32.png) [@Living\_Well\_Is\_Best\_Revenge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Living_Well_Is_Best_Revenge)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2011, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/136 "2011-08-11T20:30:28Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Post #12. I’ve noticed how most everyone hates you and I didn’t really understand why. I am starting to now. ---
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2011, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/137 "2011-08-11T20:40:12Z")
> [@woodstockbirdybird](#): > > Sadly, many people do. Hilarious. People who choose to live their lives differently than you don’t cease to be individuals. That’s moronic. It’s just as moronic as half the crazy shit Dio has said thus far. Going out with the guys is “abandoning your kids”? Way to rationalize your shitty social life. ---
**Author:** ![purplehorseshoe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/purplehorseshoe/32/2996_2.png) [@purplehorseshoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/purplehorseshoe)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2011, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/138 "2011-08-11T20:50:43Z")
I feel a need to clarify what I said earlier (and yes, that was addressed to \*\*Leaffan \*\*:rolleyes:). It’s probably going to sound like I’m trying to break up his marriage. Frankly, I don’t think I can break up _something that’s already so fundamentally broken_. That said, I think people don’t realize for years just what they learned from their own parents. So there’s little way of knowing all the things you’re teaching your own kids, subconsciously or otherwise. And this part: [QUOTE=Leaffan] “frankly the kids wouldn’t really be able to tell that she’s controlling and I’m acquiescing.” [/QUOTE] I call complete and total bullshit. Really. If nothing else, give the kids you raised more credit than that. But in general, kids both consciously notice and subconsciously absorb way more than you seem to think they do. > [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > … There isn’t a way for us to do 2 on 1 time with a single kid, though, and I haven’t had significant one-on-one time with my wife in over a decade. That sentence just gets sadder and sadder the further it goes. I know you probably don’t want my advice, but **Dio** , you are neglecting your own marriage and the relationship you have with the most important person in your life. I don’t know _why_ you’re doing that, but that is what you’re doing. Like, you don’t even watch some TV program together after the kids are in bed? Do a crossword together? _Nothing?_ ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2011, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/139 "2011-08-11T20:51:42Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > You pretty much don’t have any frame of experience or knowledge to espouse an informed opinion. Cram your “co-dependency” slur up your ass. It’s called being a mature adult and a responsible parent. These are concepts you will learn if you stay married and have kids. > > For the record, I’m “allowed” to do anything the fuck I want. I just don’t WANT to ditch my wife with the kids, because taking care of those kids is hard work and she needs help. > > I also -get this - _love my kids_, and I’d usually rather do something with them and my wife then abandon them to go do something _less_ fun people I don’t care as much about. I tend to agree (being a husband and father myself), but there’s one thing you may want to keep in mind- your kids will see you not spending one-on-one time with your wife, or having interests outside of the family and them- is that the way you want them to grow up thinking the world works? My plan is to show my children that parents are people too, and that we’re equal in this family- we all have things we like to do, and we all have our friends outside of the family, and that it’s ok for us (ALL of us) to do things with them without the rest of the family around. That’s not to say that I’m going to strip joints, or doing anything like that, but it may be as silly as grabbing a beer and a hamburger with friends of mine who I’ve known for 20 years who I don’t see so often, or it may be going and hanging out with my brother when we’re in Houston to get a break from the wife and kids. Or it may be my wife going to her friends’ houses to make arts and crafts stuff and watch chick flicks for an evening. Wanting to do those things and having the children seeing us do those things is healthy, and doesn’t point toward either of us abandoning the family or having skewed priorities or anything- we’re people too, and there’s more to us than just our roles as father and mother of our children. Obviously that’s our primary role, but it’s not the only one. ---
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2011, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236/140 "2011-08-11T20:57:08Z")
> [@Dung\_Beetle](#): > > Maybe I’m a weirdo, but yeah… I only really focus on one or two people at a time, and now that I’ve got a husband and kids those positions are filled. I have one friend in town that I exchange cards, emails, and gifts with, and even that level of friendship feels burdensome sometimes. I haven’t seen her in months, and that’s totally okay, because I have a lot of family obligations to interest me. Mom? 😃 In all seriousness, you sound exactly like her–and now that I’m in my 30s, the fact that she’s still basically got no life outside of myself and my brother is somewhat grating, especially since Dad ISN’T that way. I can count on a two-hour phone conversation about gossip in a town I left over a decade ago every time he’s at a bowling tournament. 😛 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-every-damn-social-meeting-have-to-involve-the-whole-fucking-family/592236.md?page=8)