# Why does Nintendo hate its fans so much? **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [January 3, 2011, 4:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-nintendo-hate-its-fans-so-much/566193 "2011-01-03T04:04:18Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![Red\_Barchetta](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/da6949/32.png) [@Red\_Barchetta](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Red_Barchetta)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2011, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-nintendo-hate-its-fans-so-much/566193/121 "2011-01-06T21:13:12Z")
> [@Palooka](#): > > **@Red Barchetta** I would be very interested in your thoughts as to why the Wii version of NBA Jam is better than the identical-but-HD-and-online version released for the Xbox 360. It’s not identical. The Wii version has some really well implemented motion controls that really serve as the punctuation mark at the end of each move. There is little more satisfying than making a huge dunking motion after taking to the air, while on fire, in a close game. It feels and works great. Plus, in my experience, it makes it much easier to bring new players into the fold. And while it does lack online, I’m one who has a lot of friends who play locally, which is the better way to play, making online an unimportant factor for me. Plus, I’ve heard it’s a bit of a bust as apparently very few people are actually playing it online, making it difficult to find a game. ---
**Author:** ![Palooka](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/palooka/32/2902_2.png) [@Palooka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Palooka)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2011, 9:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-nintendo-hate-its-fans-so-much/566193/122 "2011-01-06T21:23:46Z")
That’s cool about the motion control stuff. I didn’t know it had anything. A game like NBA Jam is indeed way better locally than online. ---
**Author:** ![Terraplane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/74df32/32.png) [@Terraplane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terraplane)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2011, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-nintendo-hate-its-fans-so-much/566193/123 "2011-01-06T21:31:14Z")
> [@kushiel](#): > > I foresee after Wii HD, people would complain it didn’t have a hard drive. So we’d get Wii HD[sup]2[/sup]. And then people would complain that now that the format war is over, it should get a Blu-Ray drive. Then we’d get Wii BD. And then we’d have SegTendo and it’ll all be over. 😛 > > (please note the above post is meant to be tongue-in-cheek) I know you’re joking but this is pretty much what I really want and I’m guessing what we’ll get whenever Nintendo does release their next system. An HD system with motion controls and a hard drive that plays first party Nintendo games. I’d love it. Losing the goddamn friend codes would be nice too. ---
**Author:** ![Cisco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ccd318/32.png) [@Cisco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cisco)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2011, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-nintendo-hate-its-fans-so-much/566193/124 "2011-01-06T21:50:58Z")
> [@Terraplane](#): > > I know you’re joking but this is pretty much what I really want and I’m guessing what we’ll get whenever Nintendo does release their next system. An HD system with motion controls and a hard drive that plays first party Nintendo games. I’d love it. Losing the goddamn friend codes would be nice too. Of course we’ll probably get that when Nintendo’s next system comes out. It will be perfectly reasonable in 2012 or 2013 or whatever. A lot of people seem to be forgetting that Wii was released in 2006. ---
**Author:** ![Palooka](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/palooka/32/2902_2.png) [@Palooka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Palooka)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2011, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-nintendo-hate-its-fans-so-much/566193/125 "2011-01-06T22:18:46Z")
Why is the Wii’s release year important? ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2011, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-nintendo-hate-its-fans-so-much/566193/126 "2011-01-07T01:06:19Z")
> [@Palooka](#): > > Why is the Wii’s release year important? Because HDTV market penetration was ridiculously low. As was online console gaming. Nintendo made every move they made with the Wii to reach the mass-market, HD and online play were sidelines. They didn’t want to push the envelope, they wanted to perfect the envelope they made last time. And they did. From a business point of view and a games point of view. So what exactly is wrong with the Wii? ---
**Author:** ![Palooka](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/palooka/32/2902_2.png) [@Palooka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Palooka)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2011, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-nintendo-hate-its-fans-so-much/566193/127 "2011-01-07T01:32:39Z")
Why does any of that matter for Nintendo’s on-going stance against HD? It isn’t really 2006 anymore. ---
**Author:** ![dzeiger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/46a35a/32.png) [@dzeiger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dzeiger)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2011, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-nintendo-hate-its-fans-so-much/566193/128 "2011-01-07T03:00:36Z")
Because the “on-going stance against HD” exists pretty much just in your imagination. Nintendo is not against HD, they just have not chosen to support it on the Wii at this time. If the no-doubt millions of dollars they spend on market research told them that it was advantageous to come out with a HD Wii, I imagine they would. ---
**Author:** ![Cisco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ccd318/32.png) [@Cisco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cisco)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2011, 3:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-nintendo-hate-its-fans-so-much/566193/129 "2011-01-07T03:29:36Z")
Since you haven’t listened to any of us when we’ve tried to explain it to you, maybe this gentleman can get through to you: > [@](#): > > “I don’t think there’s anything wrong with pretty graphics, and if I’m a consumer that has an HDTV, I’d want to be able to play my games with nice graphics too. And I think as we’ve seen the penetration rates for HDTV increase, we’re going to see video games and Nintendo’s games move along in step with the progression of technology,” said Miyamoto. > > He added, “But what I don’t think is necessarily true is that the graphics itself is something that’s going to make the gameplay experience better. So we’re still going to focus on the gameplay, but we’ll take advantage of the technology as it comes out.” -Shigeru Miyamoto, Oct, 2009. [Link.](http://www.industrygamers.com/news/miyamoto-on-hd-graphics-nintendos-games-will-move-along-with-progression-of-technology/) ---
**Author:** ![Palooka](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/palooka/32/2902_2.png) [@Palooka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Palooka)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2011, 4:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-nintendo-hate-its-fans-so-much/566193/130 "2011-01-07T04:18:55Z")
Yeah, that’s the stance I think is dumb. I don’t know what Miyamoto’s problem is. Wii games look awesome and way better when rendered in HD, the technology exists to do it easily, Nintendo has shown they’re not afraid to push more advanced hardware on the userbase, and everyone else is doing a hardware refresh. I don’t what this “we” thing is, since you haven’t said anything reasonable. The only one with a rational argument is **dzeiger** , when he or she said that there isn’t enough demand for such a revision. I disagree with that, of course, since people bring it up all the time, especially in Dolphin screenshot threads. I’m trying to be civil, but it’s frustrating. I explain myself and then three people tell me I’m wrong because they misunderstand the technology or what’s being asked. Just going backwards from this post, someone is quoting Miyamoto saying nothing to justify the refusal to do a Wii HD. Someone tells me it’s all in my head, but that can’t be true or the Wii HD would exist. Someone says that the Wii was released in 2006, which has nothing to do with anything being asked of Nintendo today. I don’t want to go through it all again. It’s all stupid and it’s all been addressed. Actually, you know what? I do agree with Miyamoto. I am a consumer that has an HDTV and I do want to play my games with nice graphics. I don’t know why Nintendo won’t sell me a box that I can stick my existing discs into and it’ll spit out [something like this](http://deadendthrills.com/galleries/donkey-kong-country-returns/). ---
**Author:** ![Cisco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ccd318/32.png) [@Cisco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cisco)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2011, 4:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-nintendo-hate-its-fans-so-much/566193/131 "2011-01-07T04:21:42Z")
> [@Palooka](#): > > I’m trying to be civil Stop lyin’. ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2011, 9:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-nintendo-hate-its-fans-so-much/566193/132 "2011-01-07T09:24:18Z")
> [@Palooka](#): > > Why does any of that matter for Nintendo’s on-going stance against HD? It isn’t really 2006 anymore. Do you understand how console life cycles work at all? ---
**Author:** ![kushiel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/bbce88/32.png) [@kushiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kushiel)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2011, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-nintendo-hate-its-fans-so-much/566193/133 "2011-01-07T18:09:39Z")
> [@Justin\_Bailey](#): > > Do you understand how console life cycles work at all? Nintendo has always been conservative with their console hardware too. I don’t know everything that was released in Japan, but we didn’t get an NES upgrade, the SNES got upgrades in the form of the chip on the game cartridge, then they got burned with the 64DD. Nintendo has also focused on the Japanese market. What’s the HD market penetration there? If Japan isn’t HD-crazy, Nintendo won’t release an upgrade. They’ve done interesting things with some of the hardware in Japan, like the Panasonic Q, but most of that never gets over here. Of course, replying to **Justin\_Bailey** , I’m preaching to the choir 😃 Do you hang around Assembler? ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2011, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-nintendo-hate-its-fans-so-much/566193/134 "2011-01-07T20:13:21Z")
> [@kushiel](#): > > Nintendo has always been conservative with their console hardware too. I don’t know everything that was released in Japan, but we didn’t get an NES upgrade, the SNES got upgrades in the form of the chip on the game cartridge, then they got burned with the 64DD. All true, but a Wii HD wouldn’t just be an add-on, it would be a complete generational jump. And four years is just too soon for that. And you may be preaching to the choir, but in case, the choir has the facts on its side. ---
**Author:** ![Palooka](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/palooka/32/2902_2.png) [@Palooka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Palooka)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2011, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-nintendo-hate-its-fans-so-much/566193/135 "2011-01-07T20:30:58Z")
What do you even mean? A console generation means pushing the envelope forward to allow games that weren’t possible in the previous generation. A Wii HD just brings Nintendo up to where the industry has been since 11/2005. Also, the console life cycle involves many hardware revisions, generally in an attempt to lower costs. You can see this readily with the changes to Xbox 360’s power consumption. I just want Nintendo do one to add HD, instead of just save costs. ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2011, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-nintendo-hate-its-fans-so-much/566193/136 "2011-01-07T21:06:38Z")
> [@Palooka](#): > > What do you even mean? > > A console generation means pushing the envelope forward to allow games that weren’t possible in the previous generation. A Wii HD just brings Nintendo up to where the industry has been since 11/2005. Wrong. Sony lost their shirt pushing the envelope the way they did. The PS2 was the unquestioned champion of the previous generation and the only thing that’s keeping the PS3 from total annihilation is that the Japanese hate the 360. And I (RROD) don’t think (RROD) I even (RROD) need to (RROD) talk about Microsoft’s (RROD) problems when they pushed (RROD) the envolope with the (RROD) 360. Games on the Wii AREN’T possible to do on the PS2/Xbox/GC. So Nintendo pushed the generation forward just fine. > [@Palooka](#): > > Also, the console life cycle involves many hardware revisions, generally in an attempt to lower costs. You can see this readily with the changes to Xbox 360’s power consumption. I just want Nintendo do one to add HD, instead of just save costs. A console generation, by definition, can’t include a hardware refresh that radically changes the system specs like that. The Xbox 360’s new form factor makes power consumption better, yet, but it’s also the exact same system that plays all the exact same games as the Xbox 360 that was released in 2005. ---
**Author:** ![Palooka](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/palooka/32/2902_2.png) [@Palooka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Palooka)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2011, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-nintendo-hate-its-fans-so-much/566193/137 "2011-01-07T21:18:47Z")
All right. You’re obviously a crazy Nintendo fanboy. gg, bro. ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2011, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-nintendo-hate-its-fans-so-much/566193/138 "2011-01-07T21:25:01Z")
> [@Palooka](#): > > All right. You’re obviously a crazy Nintendo fanboy. gg, bro. We do this every time a Wii thread breaks out. Point to one thing I’m wrong about and I’ll shut the fuck up. Just one thing. That’s all I’m asking. ---
**Author:** ![Palooka](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/palooka/32/2902_2.png) [@Palooka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Palooka)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2011, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-nintendo-hate-its-fans-so-much/566193/139 "2011-01-07T21:28:48Z")
> [@Justin\_Bailey](#): > > The company has never created a system that was sold at a loss. > [@Palooka](#): > > Gamecube was sold at a loss at launch. ([Cite](http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/editorial/537), 3rd paragraph) > [@Justin\_Bailey](#): > > No piece of hardware Nintendo has ever produced has been sold at a loss beyond the first six months of the GC. You’re such a waste of time. ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2011, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-nintendo-hate-its-fans-so-much/566193/140 "2011-01-07T22:59:40Z")
> [@Palooka](#): > > You’re such a waste of time. I admitted my mistake, but it doesn’t change my argument that while Microsoft was busy losing 4 billion dollars on the Xbox, Nintendo was pulling in cash hand over fist with the Cube. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-nintendo-hate-its-fans-so-much/566193.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-nintendo-hate-its-fans-so-much/566193.md?page=8)