Why does playing random black keys on the piano sound like "asian music"

[pulykamell]

OK, to clear up any confusion let’s go over this once more:

|  |  ||  | | |  ||  ||  |  |
|  |  ||  | | |  ||  ||  |  |
|  |C#||D#| | |F#||G#||A#|  |
|  |__||__| | |__||__||__|  |
|   |   |   |   |   |   |   |
| C | D | E | F | G | A | B |
|___|___|___|___|___|___|___|

So, our black keys are C#, D#, F#,G#,A# (or, if you prefer Db, Eb, Gb, Ab, Bb)

Our possible scales, depending on the tonic are thus:

C#, D#, F#, G#, A# - ambiguous (no major or minor third) basically, a C# major scale missing the 3rd and 7th, but it also could be part of a C# dorian missing the 3rd and 7th
D#, F#, G#, A#, C# - minor pentatonic/blues
F#, G#, A#, C#, D# - major pentatonic/country/Asian/lots of folk music
G#, A#, C#, D#, F# - Mixolydian missing the 6th if played over a G# major chord, or aeolian missing the 6th if played over a G# minor chord
A#, C#, D#, F#, G# - Aeolian/minor, minus the major 2nd and 5th

edit: I don’t think I’ve ever come across pentatonics in any context other that the bolded minor and major pentatonics, but I don’t see any reason why one couldn’t use the other possible five-note scales, in theory, other than they’re missing some tones important to Western harmonies and melodies.

[Jragon]

@pulykamell

edit: I don’t think I’ve ever come across pentatonics in any context other that the bolded minor and major pentatonics, but I don’t see any reason why one couldn’t use the other possible five-note scales, in theory, other than they’re missing some tones important to Western harmonies and melodies.

The first one I’ve encountered when we played a piece based around a Korean folk song in band once. The flute part consisted mostly of going up and down the scale 3 times and then switching between the first and second scale degrees a couple times. (this was more difficult than it sounds, it got… fast, and very high)

[Cyberhwk]

@Jinx

My piano teacher once said no matter what you play on the black keys will sound good.

When I was in college, everyone in the music program had to take piano proficiency. It was like the 3rd day of class when people were still learning which keys were which that our instructor (an amazing pianist) said we were going to improvise, play whatever you want on the black keys. He harmonized and everything sounded fantastic.

[Frylock]

@pulykamell

other than they’re missing some tones important to Western harmonies and melodies.

That’s probably the reason why, try as I might, I can’t hear those unbolded scales without hearing them as tending to resolve to some other note as the tonic.

[Frylock]

@Jragon

The first one I’ve encountered when we played a piece based around a Korean folk song in band once. The flute part consisted mostly of going up and down the scale 3 times and then switching between the first and second scale degrees a couple times. (this was more difficult than it sounds, it got… fast, and very high)

Would be interested to verify whether the song was in fact in the key of the tonic of that scale, or whether it was in the key of the third degree of the scale.

It’s hard for me to hear the flute part you describe without hearing the third degree as the tonic. Which by no means means it’s impossible. It just means its something I’d like to hear sometime.

[Frylock]

@pulykamell

If F# is your tonic (meaning your scale starts there and melodies have a tendency to resolve to that note) then, yes, you are in a F# major pentatonic. (And that is what people are thinking of when they think of black keys = Asian music) However, if E-flat is your tonic, you have an E-flat minor pentatonic (blues) scale there. (Although many blues musicians will also add the A natural there for extra tension.)

For purely egotistical purposes, I want to note that I “invented” the blues scale, including the inserted flatted fourth (the “A natural” you refer to here) back in high school.

“Invented” in scare quotes because surely I simply picked up on it from pop music or something.

[pulykamell]

@Frylock

F including the inserted flatted fourth (the “A natural” you refer to here)

[nitpick]
Augmented fourth or flatted fifth.
[/nitpick]

[Frylock]

@pulykamell

[nitpick]
Augmented fourth or flatted fifth.
[/nitpick]

Not on a pentatonic scale, I would think. It’s a flatted fourth or augmented third.

In other words, if the scale is D# F# G# A# C# then an A natural would be a flatted version of the fourth note in the scale.

[pulykamell]

@Frylock

Not on a pentatonic scale, I would think. It’s a flatted fourth or augmented third.

In other words, if the scale is D# F# G# A# C# then an A natural would be a flatted version of the fourth note in the scale.

I see. It just, in conventional discussions of theory, a “fourth” is an interval five half steps up from the tonic. So we say the blues scale is the tonic, the minor third, the fourth, the augmented fourth/flatted fifth, fifith, and dominant seventh. So the fourth degree of the minor pentatonic is actually a fifth.

[Frylock]

@pulykamell

I see. It just, in conventional discussions of theory, a “fourth” is an interval five half steps up from the tonic. So we say the blues scale is the tonic, the minor third, the fourth, the augmented fourth/flatted fifth, fifith, and dominant seventh. So the fourth degree of the minor pentatonic is actually a fifth.

Got it!