# Why does the Federal Government Sue? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [December 28, 2021, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-federal-government-sue/956811 "2021-12-28T21:28:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Hypno-Toad](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b2d939/32.png) [@Hypno-Toad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hypno-Toad)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2021, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-federal-government-sue/956811/1 "2021-12-28T21:28:43Z")
With all that is going on with January 6 and such, I have seen news stories about the Department of Justice engaging in lawsuits against people and institutions. I thought that the government got stuff done by indicting people for breaking specific laws and prosecuting them through criminal courts. Not by suing them in civil courts. Why are departments of the federal govt using lawsuits as a process? ---
**Author:** ![eschrodinger](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschrodinger/32/122_2.png) [@eschrodinger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschrodinger)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2021, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-federal-government-sue/956811/2 "2021-12-28T22:06:54Z")
Because lots of things are not criminal offenses, but are still actionable through civil and administrative processes. Or may also be crimes, but the civil suit is easier or better sometimes. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2021, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-federal-government-sue/956811/3 "2021-12-28T22:11:07Z")
Putting someone in jail does not recover damages done. So, the government sues for damages incurred. Same as you or I would. The person may go to jail but also has to pay to reimburse the costs of repairs for damage they caused. That needs a civil court action to determine. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2021, 3:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-federal-government-sue/956811/4 "2021-12-29T03:37:19Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > The person may go to jail but also has to pay to reimburse the costs of repairs for damage they caused. That needs a civil court action to determine. Are you sure about this? I’ve seen plenty of laws which stipulate that a person who is convicted of violating that law is subject to a monetary penalty and the judge states that penalty during sentencing. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2021, 4:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-federal-government-sue/956811/5 "2021-12-29T04:11:38Z")
The federal government has been bending over backwards to not make martyrs of the Jan 6 crowd. To that end it has been pursuing actions against individuals on a one-by-one basis rather than trying to indict the crowd en masse for rioting, insurrection, etc. Civil suits against persons who can be shown to have committed a damage individually are presumably part of that. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2021, 5:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-federal-government-sue/956811/6 "2021-12-29T05:15:28Z")
A criminal financial penalty is a penalty…not recompense for damage done. You need a civil court to determine financial damages. E.G. Do you get $500 or $5000 for your broken door? ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2021, 5:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-federal-government-sue/956811/7 "2021-12-29T05:16:41Z")
Right, a fine is not a compensation for damages. (BTW it’s not only the feds, states do the same thing. New York vs. NRA anyone?) Let’s remember: criminal penalty can only be for the specific statuted offence, and has to be what the law said it was at the time the offence happened. So there can be the case that Joe Individual is arrested and charged criminally, but what he eventually cops a plea for, is something that under the law carries a sentence of six months and a $50,000 fine. If there’s civil damages inflicted, in which the public interest is a party, they get to sue him for it. Other times, it is a matter of going after organized entities for damages and compensations that you could not recover (at least not cost-effectively) from imposing restitution on individuals. For example the DC Attorney’s Office is suing _the organizations_ Proud Boys and Oath Keepers for damages and restitution because it would not be cost-effective to go after each individual insurrectionist; what’s recoverable from the individuals is unlikely to be a proportionate amount; the organizations DO have responsibility of their own. (And in the case of organizations, not necessarily said out loud, that maybe you don’t get your whole compensation but once they have to pay the lawyers and the judgment or settlement they’ll be no more.) ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2021, 5:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-federal-government-sue/956811/8 "2021-12-29T05:19:17Z")
> [@JRDelirious](#): > > So there can be the case that Joe Individual is arrested and charged criminally, but what he eventually cops a plea for, is something that under the law carries a sentence of six months and a $50,000 fine, and no more. If the civil damages inflicted, in which the public interest is a party, are more than that, you get to sue him for it. If a burglar breaks into my home and trashes the place does the criminal fine get sent to me and I only sue him if damages were more than the fine? I thought the state gets the money for the criminal fine. I need to sue the burglar for all damages. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2021, 5:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-federal-government-sue/956811/9 "2021-12-29T05:22:15Z")
You may have noticed I corrected/edited that. And that I was referring to _their_ suing for public-interest damages. _If_ the criminal penalty includes _restitution_ to the victim, you do get that. But it has to be part of the statuted sentence. ---
**Author:** ![eschrodinger](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschrodinger/32/122_2.png) [@eschrodinger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschrodinger)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2021, 6:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-federal-government-sue/956811/10 "2021-12-29T06:13:26Z")
I don’t know how it works in other states, but in my state, there are criminal fines, imposed as part of the punishment for the offense. Part of those fines can be designated to go to the victim as a compensatory fine. Otherwise it all goes to the state. There’s also restitution, which can be imposed for proven damages to the victim, that the victim would be able to recover in a civil suit, but it can be imposed as part of the sentence. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2021, 6:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-federal-government-sue/956811/11 "2021-12-29T06:47:03Z")
Also, the standard for civil court is less than criminal court. Re: Goldman was able to get a judgement against OJ and thus acquitted in criminal court, he was “found guilty of murder” in a civil court. ---
**Author:** ![Schnitte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/schnitte/32/9033_2.png) [@Schnitte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Schnitte)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2021, 8:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-federal-government-sue/956811/12 "2021-12-29T08:42:04Z")
I don’t know which jurisdiction the OP comes from. Perhaps it’s a European one, and indeed from a European legal perspective the reliance by American authorities on lawsuits looks a bit unusual. I work for a regulatory authority in the EU myself, and to penalise companies for wrongdoings we use administrative measures (“decisions”, as they are called in EU terminology) imposed by the authority unilaterally on the basis of some statutory power. Those measures can then be contested in court by the addressee, but the authority doesn’t need to go to court and sue the company to begin with. ---
**Author:** ![eschrodinger](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschrodinger/32/122_2.png) [@eschrodinger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschrodinger)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2021, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-federal-government-sue/956811/13 "2021-12-29T19:11:52Z")
The US has both. Regulatory agencies can take administrative actions, which can be reviewed in court. The government can also sue a person or entity. ---
**Author:** ![dtilque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d6d6ee/32.png) [@dtilque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dtilque)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2021, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-federal-government-sue/956811/14 "2021-12-29T22:38:28Z")
The US government can and does sue itself. More specifically, one agency sues another. The best known examples are when the EPA sues the Energy or Defense departments to force them to clean up a polluted site, but I think it happens for other reasons, too. ---
**Author:** ![eschrodinger](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschrodinger/32/122_2.png) [@eschrodinger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschrodinger)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2021, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-federal-government-sue/956811/15 "2021-12-29T22:47:33Z")
Cite? I don’t think it can, and this explains why: [https://www.justice.gov/olc/opinion/ability-environmental-protection-agency-sue-another-government-agency](https://www.justice.gov/olc/opinion/ability-environmental-protection-agency-sue-another-government-agency) It was last updated in 2014, though. So maybe you know of a case that was allowed to go forward since then? I don’t know of any. ---
**Author:** ![Max\_S](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/46a35a/32.png) [@Max\_S](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_S)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2021, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-federal-government-sue/956811/16 "2021-12-29T23:00:51Z")
(The webpage was updated in 2014, but the letter therein was published in 1985. I don’t know if it is still the opinion of the current DOJ, but I assume so.) ~Max ---
**Author:** ![Max\_S](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/46a35a/32.png) [@Max\_S](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_S)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2021, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-federal-government-sue/956811/17 "2021-12-29T23:17:15Z")
> [@Hypno-Toad](#): > > I have seen news stories about the Department of Justice engaging in lawsuits against people and institutions. I’m having trouble finding these stories. Do you remember which outlet or which day you saw them? I found the following cases involving the January 6 insurrection, - a [civil case](https://context-cdn.washingtonpost.com/notes/prod/default/documents/11dd2f2c-124f-4308-8725-b1e936f4c8f6/note/fe54c791-3e72-4908-b3a4-3ab1882d3d63.) brought by Karl Racine, the _ **Attorney General for the District of Columbia** _ (_not_ part of the DoJ) against the Proud Boys, the Oathkeepers, and various individuals - a civil case where the Department of Justice [helped with the defense](https://www.nytimes.com/2020/12/31/us/politics/justice-department-mike-pence-louie-gohmert.html), although that was strictly before 01/06, it was related - a civil case where the Department of Justice [refused to help with the defense](https://www.cnn.com/2021/07/27/politics/mo-brooks-lawsuit-doj/index.html) - [many _ **criminal** _ cases](https://www.justice.gov/usao-dc/capitol-breach-cases) brought by the U.S. Attorney’s office for the District of Columbia (part of the DoJ) against individuals ~Max ---
**Author:** ![Hypno-Toad](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b2d939/32.png) [@Hypno-Toad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hypno-Toad)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2021, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-federal-government-sue/956811/18 "2021-12-29T23:22:51Z")
I was thinking of your first example. I must have thought it was the federal govt initiating the lawsuit. ---
**Author:** ![dtilque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d6d6ee/32.png) [@dtilque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dtilque)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2021, 1:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-federal-government-sue/956811/19 "2021-12-30T01:07:24Z")
> [@eschrodinger](#): > > Cite? I thought I’d read that the DoE was sued by the EPA over the Rocky Flats Plant in Colorado some time back in the 90s. I can’t find anything about such a suit, so my memory must be going. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2021, 4:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-federal-government-sue/956811/20 "2021-12-30T04:50:25Z")
Very vague memory on this… I thought that since governments (which includes state governments) are sovereign they have to agree to let themselves be sued. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-federal-government-sue/956811.md?page=2)