# Why does the Oracle in THE MATRIX have any credibility? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [February 10, 2009, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-oracle-in-the-matrix-have-any-credibility/485267 "2009-02-10T19:52:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2009, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-oracle-in-the-matrix-have-any-credibility/485267/21 "2009-02-10T22:44:40Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > I didn’t say I hated the Matrix: I just don’t get it. I hate the sequels. So…you didn’t watch the entire first movie (at least twice), but you watched both the sequels? -Joe ---
**Author:** ![rocking\_chair](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rocking_chair/32/2918_2.png) [@rocking\_chair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rocking_chair)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2009, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-oracle-in-the-matrix-have-any-credibility/485267/22 "2009-02-10T23:02:44Z")
remember the oracle said " your next life maybe" he does flat line… and then is kissed back to life by trinity. viola!! his next life. at least that’s the way i read it. ---
**Author:** ![dehacker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/bbe5ce/32.png) [@dehacker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dehacker)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2009, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-oracle-in-the-matrix-have-any-credibility/485267/23 "2009-02-10T23:25:11Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > Also, in the third movie, Neo specifically asks The Oracle if she is a program, how can he trust anything she says: > > Neo: I suppose the most obvious question is, how can I trust you? > The Oracle: Bingo. It is a pickle. No doubt about it. The bad news is there’s no way if you can really know whether I’m here to help you or not, so it’s really up to you. You just have to make up you on damned mind to either accept what I’m going to tell you, or reject it. Extremely trivial nitpick: that was the 2nd movie, not the third. > [@msmith537](#): > > Also, I don’t buy the “humans as battaries” thing. I mean there are obviously much better ways to get power - nuclear, wind, tidal, geothermal, etc (not solar though) - and it may be a nice biproduct, but the machines IIRC never really state that they are storing humans as a power source. Trinity and Morpheus tell us that and they plainly know jack shit. Plus you don’t need to keep humans in some sort of Matrix simulation either. Humans keep perfectly nicely in a vegetative state. > > I always suspected that the machines keep the humans in The Matrix in a sort of iRobot “protect them from themselves” kind of way. Actually, there is some basis in the “Matrix” universe for the humans being used as part of a neural-based supercomputer. See the short story [Goliath](http://whatisthematrix.warnerbros.com/rl_cmp/comics_frames.html) for details. ---
**Author:** ![Chase\_Ransom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9de0a6/32.png) [@Chase\_Ransom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chase_Ransom)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2009, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-oracle-in-the-matrix-have-any-credibility/485267/24 "2009-02-10T23:29:23Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > I feel obliged to point out that no movie including Monica Bellucci can be entirely worthless. Couldn’t have said it better myself. ---
**Author:** ![dehacker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/bbe5ce/32.png) [@dehacker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dehacker)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2009, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-oracle-in-the-matrix-have-any-credibility/485267/25 "2009-02-10T23:53:49Z")
Monica Bellucci wasn’t in The Matrix, she was in the two sequels. ---
**Author:** ![ToeJam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/dfb087/32.png) [@ToeJam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ToeJam)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2009, 1:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-oracle-in-the-matrix-have-any-credibility/485267/26 "2009-02-11T01:14:47Z")
I believe that’s his point, **dehacker**. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2009, 1:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-oracle-in-the-matrix-have-any-credibility/485267/27 "2009-02-11T01:57:55Z")
From now on, when someone says “The Matrix” can we assume they mean the entire story including any of the three Matrix films and the Animatrix? Also, I don’t undertand the hate for the other two films. ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2009, 2:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-oracle-in-the-matrix-have-any-credibility/485267/28 "2009-02-11T02:48:15Z")
Personally I would have liked it better if there had been only one sequel, and the reveal at the end was that Zion and the world Neo and Morpheus believed that they lived in was simply another Matrix, a fall-back Matrix, designed to catch those who could not live in the original Matrix, or who found the way out. _“Some humans can’t live in a real world. They have to have a dark world, a tragic world, in which they can play hero or victim. You chose this world, Neo, because you wanted to be a hero. We gave you a world where you could fulfill that fantasy…”_ ---
**Author:** ![smiling\_bandit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9a140/32.png) [@smiling\_bandit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smiling_bandit)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2009, 3:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-oracle-in-the-matrix-have-any-credibility/485267/29 "2009-02-11T03:03:40Z")
I’m sorry, but the Matrix-within-a-Matrix idea is actually so tacky that had they done this, ye olde internette nerds would be screaming from the rafters. Regardless, the Oracle is one of the weakest chaarcters in the sequels. She is almost utterly pointless, doing nothing of consequence and eating up screen time. It’s never clear why she was important. ---
**Author:** ![Kozmik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/8dc957/32.png) [@Kozmik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kozmik)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2009, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-oracle-in-the-matrix-have-any-credibility/485267/30 "2009-02-11T03:13:44Z")
> [@Chimera](#): > > Personally I would have liked it better if there had been only one sequel, and the reveal at the end was that Zion and the world Neo and Morpheus believed that they lived in was simply another Matrix, a fall-back Matrix, designed to catch those who could not live in the original Matrix, or who found the way out. > > _“Some humans can’t live in a real world. They have to have a dark world, a tragic world, in which they can play hero or victim. You chose this world, Neo, because you wanted to be a hero. We gave you a world where you could fulfill that fantasy…”_ “This isn’t The Matrix?” “No. It’s another training program designed to teach you one thing…” ---
**Author:** ![It\_s\_Not\_Rocket\_Surgery](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/it_s_not_rocket_surgery/32/312_2.png) [@It\_s\_Not\_Rocket\_Surgery](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/It_s_Not_Rocket_Surgery)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2009, 4:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-oracle-in-the-matrix-have-any-credibility/485267/31 "2009-02-11T04:42:24Z")
> [@Chimera](#): > > Personally I would have liked it better if there had been only one sequel, and the reveal at the end was that Zion and the world Neo and Morpheus believed that they lived in was simply another Matrix, a fall-back Matrix, designed to catch those who could not live in the original Matrix, or who found the way out. > > _“Some humans can’t live in a real world. They have to have a dark world, a tragic world, in which they can play hero or victim. You chose this world, Neo, because you wanted to be a hero. We gave you a world where you could fulfill that fantasy…”_ _The Matrix_ meets _Total Recal_l? Um, no thanks! ---
**Author:** ![Jragon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e19b73/32.png) [@Jragon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jragon)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2009, 5:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-oracle-in-the-matrix-have-any-credibility/485267/32 "2009-02-11T05:28:00Z")
> [@smiling\_bandit](#): > > I’m sorry, but the Matrix-within-a-Matrix idea is actually so tacky that had they done this, ye olde internette nerds would be screaming from the rafters. > > Regardless, the Oracle is one of the weakest chaarcters in the sequels. She is almost utterly pointless, doing nothing of consequence and eating up screen time. It’s never clear why she was important. It makes sense at first, then the fridge logic hits. It’s explained that she’s the “anti-architect” he “balances” the equation that is the matrix while the Oracle unbalances it (never mind the weird terminology). At first you think “okay, that’s cool I guess.” Then you realize the oracle is a denizen of the matrix, meaning, a program. Now I suppose she could be a rogue program like Smith, but she states her purpose so CLEARLY it’s implied she was designed to do that… why, exactly? The only purpose I can think of is that so the machines can do a routine slaughtering of Zion every few decades, by why bother with “the One” and “possible loss of your life support system” thing? After the first time they knew where it was so they could do it every now and then without bothering with people leading them to it and that whole taking elders business. Therefor the Oracle exists just because she exists, which tends to happen a lot once you put the Matrix under scrutiny (if I were to rifftrax it I’d replace half the lines with “Why? Cause I said so!”). ---
**Author:** ![The\_Second\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@The\_Second\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Second_Stone)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2009, 5:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-oracle-in-the-matrix-have-any-credibility/485267/33 "2009-02-11T05:31:15Z")
The only thing I really hated about all three matrix movies was the original humans as batteries crap. Even if told as a lie, who the hell would believe that was an efficient way of generating/storing electricity? ---
**Author:** ![Mister\_Armageddon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/858c86/32.png) [@Mister\_Armageddon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mister_Armageddon)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2009, 6:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-oracle-in-the-matrix-have-any-credibility/485267/34 "2009-02-11T06:32:02Z")
The movies make a little more sense if you assume the brains of humans are used as parallel processors that keep the Matrix functioning. I read somewhere that was the original explanation, but studio executives didn’t think audiences would understand it so they went with the battery thing. ---
**Author:** ![Khadaji](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Khadaji](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Khadaji)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2009, 12:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-oracle-in-the-matrix-have-any-credibility/485267/35 "2009-02-11T12:04:32Z")
From reading this I’m glad I didn’t watch the sequels. ---
**Author:** ![marshmallow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df705f/32.png) [@marshmallow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/marshmallow)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2009, 12:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-oracle-in-the-matrix-have-any-credibility/485267/36 "2009-02-11T12:06:55Z")
My problem with the Matrix (original or the entire series) is that there is no sensible reason why humans would want to escape from The Matrix. The Earth’s biosphere is screwed, everything is nuked and gray. There won’t be a sun for a long time. The remaining survivors wear ratty clothes, eat slop, the ratio of men to women is not favorable, and it’s just a generally depressing place. To me, the most realistic reaction to this was Cypher, from the original. Yeah, get me back in the Matrix! Let me eat steak and live a normal life! Who cares if it’s “fake”? If anything, the machines are doing humanity a huge favor. It’s disturbing we’re kept in jello pods and everything, sure, but it’s not like they’re really doing anything bad to us. If anything, the Matrix would be great for people who knew the truth. Use your crazy super powers to your advantage. Accrue a fortune, become famous, and get an unbelievable amount of tail. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2009, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-oracle-in-the-matrix-have-any-credibility/485267/37 "2009-02-11T15:21:44Z")
> [@Merijeek](#): > > So…you didn’t watch the entire first movie (at least twice), but you watched both the sequels? > > -Joe Precisely. I’d seen bits & pieces of the first movie and was underwhelmed, but went to see the second one on a date and was actively annoyed. I had no interest in seeing the third, but the night it opened I ran into some friends who wanted me to go with them. So we went, to find it was sold out; I didn’t much care, as the movie theater was a trivial distance from my apartment and I could just walk home. But then two girls who had bought tickets earlier walked up and offered to just give theirs away, and as the tickets were free I took one. The fact that the girls had begun the day fanatical enough to not merely stand in line for an hour to buy tickets, but had bought tickets for TWO shows, and after seeing it once had decided to give their tickets away, should have been a clue. ---
**Author:** ![garygnu](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/garygnu/32/2924_2.png) [@garygnu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/garygnu)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2009, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-oracle-in-the-matrix-have-any-credibility/485267/38 "2009-02-11T15:27:40Z")
> [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > The only thing I really hated about all three matrix movies was the original humans as batteries crap. Even if told as a lie, who the hell would believe that was an efficient way of generating/storing electricity? Two birds with one stone, so to speak, but still, the brain/processors bit makes more sense. ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2009, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-oracle-in-the-matrix-have-any-credibility/485267/39 "2009-02-11T15:32:02Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > There’s at least one we both love: Fellowship of the Ring. > > There’s at least one we both like: The Two Towers (I don’t know that you love it, **Mika** –do you? Too true - I do love Fellowship. That at least was exactly out of my dreams. And no, I don’t love Two Towers. Bt I do so love the battle scenes. > [@](#): > > I didn’t say I hated the Matrix: I just don’t get it. I hate the sequels. > > But I’d wager we have more movies we like in common than dislike. It’s not like you’re praising _I Spit on Your Grave_ as a subtle & poetic comment on the feminine condition. Bwuh? Never heard of it, thankfully. I even liked the sequels, though they were not to the level of the first one. But very few sequels ever are. The only time this works at all well is movies where the first one is just setting up the background and the second one is the true story (read: Mad Max). I don’t count the people who hated the Matrix from the start but I thnk those who liked the first one came away with too high expectations for the follow-up, forgetting the Cardinal Rule of Sequels. But then again, I liked Aliens 4, even if I don’t really like Wynona much. As for not wanting to escape from the Matrix, I think that is way more than feasible that a small percentage of humans could never ever be slaves. Most of us would be (hell, I’d be in there, having a grand old time) but there have been people throughout history who would rather die than be slaves, who would rather do anything than be slaves. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2009, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-oracle-in-the-matrix-have-any-credibility/485267/40 "2009-02-11T15:38:01Z")
> [@Anaamika](#): > > Bwuh? Never heard of it, thankfully. **Mika** , if you don’t do ANYTHING else I ever advise you to do, DO NOT watch that movie. Ever. Do not go to Wikipedia to read the synopsis. Assume that anyone who tries to get you to watch it with them is an agent of Wolfram & Hart trying to drive you mad so that you’ll be on their side during the apocalypse. > [@](#): > > I don’t count the people who hated the Matrix from the start but I thnk those who liked the first one came away with too high expectations for the follow-up, forgetting the Cardinal Rule of Sequels. But then again, I liked Aliens 4, even if I don’t really like Wynona much. I liked both Aliens 3 & 4. But I’d never seen Alien or Aliens, so I wasn’t comparing. And, having seen only Alien 3, I found 4 a letdown. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-oracle-in-the-matrix-have-any-credibility/485267.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-does-the-oracle-in-the-matrix-have-any-credibility/485267.md?page=3)