# Why don't people believe in God? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 21, 2013, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-people-believe-in-god/666766 "2013-08-21T00:49:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 24
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2013, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-people-believe-in-god/666766/461 "2013-08-22T15:46:23Z")
> [@Timo](#): > > But as I said before, personal experiences trump to just reading verses in the Bible. > > Wouldn’t you say applying/experiencing what you know makes your learning stronger? Or belief in what you learned stronger? Why don’t you just learn it first(by reading it) before trying to apply it? ---
**Author:** ![Timo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c4cdca/32.png) [@Timo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Timo)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2013, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-people-believe-in-god/666766/462 "2013-08-22T15:47:13Z")
> [@Tequila\_Party](#): > > **Timo** , if you want to reach people and minister to their souls, hope they convert and further spread a gospel that you believe in, the way to do that is by living an exemplary and helpful life. Look at all this time you’ve spent on here. Look at all the time you’ve apparently spent memorizing scripture. And you’ve also apparently spent a great deal of time in church. > > Now, if you were to reach me and get me to change to your viewpoint, none of those things would do it. No, what it would take would you being a humble servant. Someone who puts others needs above your own. Someone whose whole life is about helping, in such a way that it highlights the best of your God. If you spent all that time that I outlined above working at a soup kitchen, building homes for the poor and reading to the elderly, I’d be more apt to believe there was something more worthwhile going on than simply a fear of hell. > > Anyway, I’m hoping you’re young enough to learn. I also appreciate you responding to me about being gleeful. It’s good of you to admit a mistake. A lot more contemplation in general may be in order and less frustration might not rule your days. I would stop now, but I feel that when I try stopping, I read some posts that I can try answering, and I want to give another perspective, that may have little impact, but just the same, it may help later on. And it’s the same both ways. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2013, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-people-believe-in-god/666766/463 "2013-08-22T15:48:14Z")
> [@Timo](#): > > But as I said before, personal experiences trump to just reading verses in the Bible. It’s not really about personal experience, though, it’s about how you’re interpreting that experience. You had some experience or other and you’ve concluded it comes from the Christian God. I think it’s unlikely you would feel that way if you hadn’t been raised in a Christian home, so that’s not the kind of proof you think it is. ---
**Author:** ![Razncain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/9d8465/32.png) [@Razncain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Razncain)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2013, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-people-believe-in-god/666766/464 "2013-08-22T15:50:12Z")
**Timo** , this will probably be my last one on this thread. You’ve got enough on your plate, and I realize you can’t get to everyone, but do hope when you let this thread wind down, you’ll go back and re-read it. No need to even respond back even to my post. Bull I’ll leave you with this to think about. Imagine how much of a role geography plays in your belief. Had your family been born in the Middle East, you would more than likely have had a personal relationship with Muhammad and his teachings about Allah; and not of Jesus. Anyway, I appreciate your civility the utmost, and have enjoyed reading from you. ---
**Author:** ![Timo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c4cdca/32.png) [@Timo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Timo)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2013, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-people-believe-in-god/666766/465 "2013-08-22T15:50:52Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Why don’t you just learn it first(by reading it) before trying to apply it? Because it doesn’t work that way. Think about it, wouldn’t it be more cruel of God to have everyone read the Bible at least once page to page before giving his Holy Spirit? Wouldn’t you doubt the existence of God even more? It’s not like I intentionally applied it, it’s like a relationship that just happened slowly. (And with God’s mercy) Going back to the analogy of applying what you learn You can’t apply what you learn without learning it first Same with God. You can’t know God personally without knowing a little bit about Him first. ---
**Author:** ![Dorjan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dorjan/32/12440_2.png) [@Dorjan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dorjan)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2013, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-people-believe-in-god/666766/466 "2013-08-22T15:53:48Z")
> [@Timo](#): > > But is being indoctrinated the same as personal experiences? Ahh Timo, Timo. Remember you said this. No, indoctrination and personal experience are not one and the same. > [@Timo](#): > > . > > It’s my mother’s God. But it’s also my God, because I have my own personal relationship with Him. This is at least the second or third time you’ve admitted to the very point so many here are trying to get you to see. Everyone has personal experiences, things that happened to them. Not all of these things can be explained, and it’s human nature to seek out an answer. Many times that answer comes from religion. Ah, but what religion? You say yourself you grew up in a Christian household. You have been indoctrinated with Christian lore, Christian literature, Christian traditions. Naturally, when you seek to find a meaning to your personal experiences, Christianity is going to be the first thing that fits that bill. And that’s cool, if that’s what makes things make sense to you, and makes you happy, awesome! Here is what you need to understand though, and please try to understand it. You are no different from Ahmed in Tehran. Ahmed grew up surrounded by Islam the same way you grew up surrounded by Christianity. Ahmed seeks an answer to his personal experiences, something that makes his life make sense. Which religion do you think will most likely fit that bill and make sense to him? It will most likely be Islam. Take our dear Aanamika. Aanamika grew up surrounded by Hinduism the same way you grew up surrounded by Christianity. Aanamika seeks an answer to her personal experiences, something that makes her life make sense. Which religion do you think will most likely fit that bill and make sense to her? As she has stated herself, Hinduism fits the bill best for her. Consider Akira, born and raised in Nagoya, Japan. Akira grew up surrounded by Shinto lore, Shinto literature, Shinto traditions. Naturally, when he seeks to find a meaning to his personal experiences, Shinto is going to be the first thing that makes complete sense to him. I sincerely hope by now you are starting to see a pattern here? Here is the next part. You, Ahmed, Aanamika, and Akira are **NO MORE CORRECT OR INCORRECT** in your beliefs than the other. If, by accident of birth, Ahmed was born in your household and you in his, Ahmed would in all likelihood be in here annoying us with Bible quotes and you would have just recently celebrated Eid al-Fitr a couple of weeks ago. If you **still** cannot understand why your religious beliefs, and nearly everyone else’s, are overwhelmingly due to where you were born and how you were raised, then we might as well shut this entire thread down, as you are either being deliberately obtuse or are mentally incapable of understanding anything we are trying to explain to you. ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2013, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-people-believe-in-god/666766/467 "2013-08-22T15:57:19Z")
Excellent post **Dorjän** - ---
**Author:** ![Timo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c4cdca/32.png) [@Timo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Timo)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2013, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-people-believe-in-god/666766/468 "2013-08-22T15:57:55Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > It’s not really about personal experience, though, it’s about how you’re interpreting that experience. You had some experience or other and you’ve concluded it comes from the Christian God. I think it’s unlikely you would feel that way if you hadn’t been raised in a Christian home, so that’s not the kind of proof you think it is. Maybe. That would make sense. However, I don’t know, and this is a genuine question, but are there like other religions where many people claim to feel their God to be true? Or is it more of statues and idols? Again, Romans 1:21-23 Maybe, good question though… hm… But what would you say to the brothers and sisters that I fellowship with, or maybe those that I have yet to fellowship and get to know, like K-love radio for example, people I never met, yet what they say I can agree with, and what they’ve gone through, I can show empathy, that some have been through the same troubles, others maybe not, but the point is that there are brothers and sisters who have gone through similar struggles. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2013, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-people-believe-in-god/666766/469 "2013-08-22T15:58:23Z")
> [@Timo](#): > > Read the book of Psalms. What those people felt back then, is how many people who love the Lord feel now. It can’t be a coincidence. It’s the Holy Spirit. Yes, my favorite Psalm demonstrates the essence of the Holy Spirit: [Psalm 18:37-42](http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Psalm%2018:37-42&version=NIV) > [@](#): > > I pursued my enemies and overtook them; > I did not turn back till they were destroyed. > I crushed them so that they could not rise; > they fell beneath my feet. > You armed me with strength for battle; > you humbled my adversaries before me. > You made my enemies turn their backs in flight, > and I destroyed my foes. > They cried for help, but there was no one to save them— > to the Lord, but he did not answer. > I beat them as fine as windblown dust; > I trampled them like mud in the streets. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2013, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-people-believe-in-god/666766/470 "2013-08-22T15:58:53Z")
> [@Timo](#): > > Because it doesn’t work that way. Right- knowing what you are talking about is hard. Better to go the way of truthiness. This is sort of an issue endemic to Christianity: because it’s based on having a personal relationship with Jesus, the actual beliefs and actions of Jesus are given secondary importance (at best). So you get a lot of people who say they’re Christians have only the foggiest notion of what the Bible says Jesus said or did, or the historical context Christianity and its scriptures come from, or a lot of other things that are significant in understanding the religion and its background. I’m not a fan of Islam either, but at least Muslims are supposed to know the entire Quran. There’s something to be said for knowing what you are talking about. > [@Timo](#): > > Maybe. That would make sense. However, I don’t know, and this is a genuine question, but are there like other religions where many people claim to feel their God to be true? Are you kidding? Everybody thinks their religions is true and their god is real. You would probably figure this out if you took five minutes to read about any other religion. > [@](#): > > Or is it more of statues and idols? The Jews banned idolatry long before the Christians showed up, and Muslims are even more strict about it than Christians are. ---
**Author:** ![Timo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c4cdca/32.png) [@Timo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Timo)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2013, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-people-believe-in-god/666766/471 "2013-08-22T15:59:08Z")
“Ahh Timo, Timo. Remember you said this. No, indoctrination and personal experience are not one and the same.” I believe that was a rhetorical question. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2013, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-people-believe-in-god/666766/472 "2013-08-22T16:03:04Z")
> [@Timo](#): > > You can’t know God personally without knowing a little bit about Him first. That doesn’t mean you should know as little as possible. What exactly is your opposition to sitting down and reading the Bible? Are you afraid that if you read beyond whatever verses your particular sect has picked out to support whatever beliefs they’re pushing you might come across something that interferes with those beliefs? ---
**Author:** ![Timo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c4cdca/32.png) [@Timo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Timo)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2013, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-people-believe-in-god/666766/473 "2013-08-22T16:04:22Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > Yes, my favorite Psalm demonstrates the essence of the Holy Spirit: > > [Psalm 18:37-42](http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Psalm%2018:37-42&version=NIV) Hm… I don’t know if you’re being sarcastic, haha sorry if I respond and it turns our you weren’t. But what did those people who cried out for help do before? Why was there a battle in the first place? Maybe they initiated? They may seem like the victims only because of crying out for help, but what did they do to have God ignore them? ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2013, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-people-believe-in-god/666766/474 "2013-08-22T16:07:30Z")
> [@Timo](#): > > are there like other religions where many people claim to feel their God to be true? Or is it more of statues and idols? How can you even ask that at this point in the thread? 😕 ---
**Author:** ![Dorjan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dorjan/32/12440_2.png) [@Dorjan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dorjan)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2013, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-people-believe-in-god/666766/475 "2013-08-22T16:07:37Z")
> [@Timo](#): > > “Ahh Timo, Timo. Remember you said this. No, indoctrination and personal experience are not one and the same.” > I believe that was a rhetorical question. I’m sorry, did you go blind and not see the rest of my post? :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Timo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c4cdca/32.png) [@Timo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Timo)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2013, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-people-believe-in-god/666766/476 "2013-08-22T16:07:53Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > That doesn’t mean you should know as little as possible. What exactly is your opposition to sitting down and reading the Bible? It’s not like I’m trying to know as little as possible haha… But I read some of the posts that I could try helping, like I said before, maybe give a little insight of the little that I know, yet could still be helpful. It’s like the feeling, and hopefully you know the experience. When you know something to be true, and you’re debating with others who say otherwise, and they say something that you could at least help with, would you ignore? It’s like if a person posted Dogs are not real… Are you going to let that post go unanswered? ---
**Author:** ![Timo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c4cdca/32.png) [@Timo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Timo)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2013, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-people-believe-in-god/666766/477 "2013-08-22T16:09:01Z")
> [@Dorjan](#): > > I’m sorry, did you go blind and not see the rest of my post? :dubious: haha no, but that would be funny I was just thinking about what to say, the rest is a good question. Kind of mind- boggling. I’m thinking about it/answering the ones that I can try answering now ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2013, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-people-believe-in-god/666766/478 "2013-08-22T16:09:34Z")
> [@Timo](#): > > Hm… I don’t know if you’re being sarcastic, haha sorry if I respond and it turns our you weren’t. > > But what did those people who cried out for help do before? Why was there a battle in the first place? Maybe they initiated? They may seem like the victims only because of crying out for help, but what did they do to have God ignore them? Why don’t you put your imagination aside just this once, open the book, and find out for yourself? Here is your chance to read it for yourself instead of taking other people’s words for what it says and what it means. ---
**Author:** ![Timo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c4cdca/32.png) [@Timo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Timo)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2013, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-people-believe-in-god/666766/479 "2013-08-22T16:11:17Z")
> [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](#): > > How can you even ask that at this point in the thread? 😕 Because I don’t know. I’ve already stated many times that I haven’t looked into other religions and that I should because it could help with my belief. I mean… it’s not like I’m hiding what I don’t know, trying to make it seem like I know everything. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2013, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-people-believe-in-god/666766/480 "2013-08-22T16:11:21Z")
> [@Timo](#): > > haha no, but that would be funny > > I was just thinking about what to say, the rest is a good question. Kind of mind- boggling. I’m thinking about it/answering the ones that I can try answering now Why don’t you save those "ha ha"s for when somebody tells a joke, o.k.? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-people-believe-in-god/666766.md?page=23) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-dont-people-believe-in-god/666766.md?page=25)